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Missing replies sent via the Bridge -- problem is back RRS feed

  • Question

  • In January, it was reported that messages sent via the Community Bridge and a newsreader weren't visible in threads until someone posted a new message using the web interface. This problem seems to be back.

    For example, I posted this message in the web interface. If I later post a reply in Windows Live Mail using the Community Bridge, the reply will be listed on the start page of this forum, but the reply will be invisible in the thread.


    Stefan Blom, Microsoft Word MVP

    Tuesday, April 30, 2013 12:19 PM

Answers

  • You do have people on the forum team who know how to use the bridge, don't you?

    Well, they should. It's hardly rocket science to use a newsreader. Or to monitor this forum, for that matter.

    Edit: Playing with this today, it seems that if the NNTP poster is the original poster, or the first responder, then the post is seen in the forum interface. But subsequent NNTP responses do not appear, though they are included in the response count.

    From what I can tell, it is working now. All my posts I made earlier today were visible after a couple of minutes. I did not check the contents page for the forum, though.

    What you say above explains what happened when I tried to produce a repro in the sandbox forum. In that case, my posts appeared immediately.


    Erland Sommarskog, SQL Server MVP, esquel@sommarskog.se
    Friday, May 10, 2013 5:18 PM

All replies

  • This is a reply that illustrates the problem. This message will be invisible in the web interface at http://social.microsoft.com/Forums/en-US/reportabug/threads.
     
     
     
     

    In January, it was reported that messages sent via the Community Bridge and a newsreader weren't visible in threads until someone posted a new message using the web interface. This problem seems to be back.

    For example, I posted this message in the web interface. If I later post a reply in Windows Live Mail using the Community Bridge, the reply will be listed on the start page of this forum, but the reply will be invisible in the thread.


    Stefan Blom, Microsoft Word MVP


    Stefan Blom, Microsoft Word MVP
    Tuesday, April 30, 2013 12:20 PM
  • OK, problem appears to be fixed again? I can't reproduce it in this thread at least...

    Stefan Blom, Microsoft Word MVP

    Tuesday, April 30, 2013 12:22 PM
  • I'm getting inconsistent results... I can't tell if the problem is back or not. <sigh>
     
    (Posted in WLM using the Community Bridge)

    Stefan Blom, Microsoft Word MVP
    Tuesday, April 30, 2013 12:44 PM
  • Posting in the web interface to see what happens...


    Stefan Blom, Microsoft Word MVP

    Tuesday, April 30, 2013 1:21 PM
  • OK, the message "I'm getting inconsistent results... I can't tell if the problem is back or not. <sigh>" that I posted several minutes ago, just appeared when I posted in the web interface...


    Stefan Blom, Microsoft Word MVP

    Tuesday, April 30, 2013 1:24 PM
  • OK, the message "I'm getting inconsistent results... I can't tell if the problem is back or not. <sigh>" that I posted several minutes ago, just appeared when I posted in the web interface...


    Stefan Blom, Microsoft Word MVP

    I can definitely say that I am still seeing the problem. Perhaps not always, but certainly very often.

    It really has to be fixed, because currently posting via NNTP is very often wasted effort.


    David Wilkinson | Visual C++ MVP

    Tuesday, April 30, 2013 1:39 PM
  • I can definitely say that I am still seeing the problem. Perhaps not always, but certainly very often.

    It really has to be fixed, because currently posting via NNTP is very often wasted effort.


    David Wilkinson | Visual C++ MVP




    Yes, that's my conclusion as well—finally...

    Stefan Blom, Microsoft Word MVP


    Tuesday, April 30, 2013 1:43 PM
  • I know that often I am missing Erland's new replies and even in the threads I participate. Sometimes I open a thread and, surprise, see a new message by Erland which was not seen in the Forum's view. Other people noticed this problem also.

    I think last couple of days it has been better, but I can not be certain.


    For every expert, there is an equal and opposite expert. - Becker's Law


    My blog

    Tuesday, April 30, 2013 3:18 PM
    Moderator
  • Here is the recent sample

    http://social.msdn.microsoft.com/Forums/en-US/transactsql/thread/6877af3e-bc5a-4575-8bc8-d9600ed88092

    The last message is now visible (may be after the OP added a new message which is deleted now), but it was not visible before.


    For every expert, there is an equal and opposite expert. - Becker's Law


    My blog

    Tuesday, April 30, 2013 5:19 PM
    Moderator
  • And here is another one

    http://social.msdn.microsoft.com/Forums/en-US/transactsql/thread/1a1ba78a-96da-44fd-b119-8aeec46a7460

    If I would not re-read that thread, I would never knew that Erland had posted in it - when I posted, that message was not visible.


    For every expert, there is an equal and opposite expert. - Becker's Law


    My blog

    Tuesday, April 30, 2013 5:23 PM
    Moderator
  • And here is another one

    http://social.msdn.microsoft.com/Forums/en-US/transactsql/thread/1a1ba78a-96da-44fd-b119-8aeec46a7460

    If I would not re-read that thread, I would never knew that Erland had posted in it - when I posted, that message was not visible.






    Thank you for these additional examples!

    Stefan Blom, Microsoft Word MVP

    Tuesday, April 30, 2013 6:36 PM
  • I can attest (as a non NTTP user) that I see the problem fairly frequently.  Often I can see a thread that has replies, but no name associated with the last reply.  If I open the thread I can only see the original topic.  If I post to the thread then the NTTP user's replies will magically show up.

    I specifically observed this this morning.

    Monday, May 6, 2013 2:23 PM
  • So there are two problems. One is that the thread display always shows the last post made from the web UI, even if there is a later from the NTTP bridge. The other, and a lot more serious, is that posts from NTTP bridge does not display at all. There is a deliberate design to delay posts from the bridge for a few minutes, but the delay was infinite in January, unless someone else posted to the thread. And, yes, as Stefan says, the problem is back. But not consistently.

    Here are a few samples (which could become invalid if there are mosts posts to the threads):

    http://social.msdn.microsoft.com/Forums/en-US/transactsql/thread/ac3bca2e-e107-480c-8f49-f9ec79c904f8#9a106fd9-f68e-492d-9e9d-d3a0195aa997
    There is a second post from me in that thread. (And hopefully SathyanarrayananS would not have made his response, if he had seen my first post.)

    http://social.msdn.microsoft.com/Forums/en-US/transactsql/thread/1ec51a17-e837-4651-9538-6f3e889e7860#1ec51a17-e837-4651-9538-6f3e889e7860
    There is one more post that I made through the NTTP bridge.

    This one however is different:
    http://social.msdn.microsoft.com/Forums/en-US/sqlsecurity/thread/ec56412e-4721-461d-abc4-d1e5b89115af
    There is a short post which starts I don't think the Service Broker endpoint has anything to do with it. The type is not TSQL. I posted it 32 minutes ago, and it displays in the web UI. I made two other postings to that forum just a few minutes later. They do not display.


    Erland Sommarskog, SQL Server MVP, esquel@sommarskog.se
    Monday, May 6, 2013 10:08 PM
  • So this is a booster post from the web UI for what I posted through the NNTP bridge a few minutes ago.

    Erland Sommarskog, SQL Server MVP, esquel@sommarskog.se

    Monday, May 6, 2013 10:09 PM
  • http://social.msdn.microsoft.com/Forums/en-US/transactsql/thread/ac3bca2e-e107-480c-8f49-f9ec79c904f8#9a106fd9-f68e-492d-9e9d-d3a0195aa997

    In this thread I only see the first post from you (the one you're saying it's a regression problem in SQL Server 2012). I do not see any other post from you in that same thread.


    For every expert, there is an equal and opposite expert. - Becker's Law


    My blog

    Monday, May 6, 2013 10:53 PM
    Moderator
  • In your second link I do not see your post at all.

    For every expert, there is an equal and opposite expert. - Becker's Law


    My blog

    Monday, May 6, 2013 10:54 PM
    Moderator
  • In your second link I do not see your post at all.

    Yes, that was my point. For the first two threads, you need to use the NNTP bridge to see my post. (Well, actually someone has posted to the first thread, so now my second post should be visible.) But in the last thread, you see my post - despite that it is the last one in the thread.

    Whether you will see message, depends. Maybe if someone else posts to the thread.


    Erland Sommarskog, SQL Server MVP, esquel@sommarskog.se
    Tuesday, May 7, 2013 7:26 AM
  • But now you should finally see the post I made this morning in this thread, as I post this booster message from the web UI.

    Erland Sommarskog, SQL Server MVP, esquel@sommarskog.se

    Tuesday, May 7, 2013 9:30 PM
  • I didn't see this your answer till now.

    I suggest you to email to fissues at microsoft dot com. I think posting problems here is not efficient anymore. We all can acknowledge that problem exists, but that's all. If you want a solution, you need to constantly remind them about the problem using that email address. No guarantee of the response there either.


    For every expert, there is an equal and opposite expert. - Becker's Law


    My blog

    Tuesday, May 7, 2013 9:43 PM
    Moderator
  • I also think that different forums behave differently. Say, your posts appear immediately in Security forum, but don't appear in T-SQL forum.

    For every expert, there is an equal and opposite expert. - Becker's Law


    My blog

    Tuesday, May 7, 2013 10:09 PM
    Moderator
  • I also think that different forums behave differently. Say, your posts appear immediately in Security forum, but don't appear in T-SQL forum.

    My gut feeling is that it is not related to the forum. It was only one of three posts in the Security forum that made it to the web display without help from other posts.


    Erland Sommarskog, SQL Server MVP, esquel@sommarskog.se
    Wednesday, May 8, 2013 8:27 AM
  • Hi Erland,

    Would you please some screenshots indicating the issue to Forums Escalation <fissues@microsoft.com>?


    Yubo Zhang
    Application Support
    EPX Service Enginerring Tier1

    Friday, May 10, 2013 12:37 AM
  • You really do not need a screenshot. Just make a reply from the NNTP bridge, and then look in the forum interface to see if it is there. Very often (though not always) you will see that it is missing, and that the indicated number of replies is more than the actual number of replies visible in the thread. There must be something about the way that NNTP posts are entered in the forum database that makes them different from posts made in the forum interface.

    You do have people on the forum team who know how to use the bridge, don't you? I think most (maybe all) NNTP users are using the Community Bridge, not the original Microsoft one.

    Edit: Playing with this today, it seems that if the NNTP poster is the original poster, or the first responder, then the post is seen in the forum interface. But subsequent NNTP responses do not appear, though they are included in the response count.


    David Wilkinson | Visual C++ MVP


    • Edited by davewilk Friday, May 10, 2013 4:30 PM addition
    Friday, May 10, 2013 10:02 AM
  • You do have people on the forum team who know how to use the bridge, don't you?

    Well, they should. It's hardly rocket science to use a newsreader. Or to monitor this forum, for that matter.

    Edit: Playing with this today, it seems that if the NNTP poster is the original poster, or the first responder, then the post is seen in the forum interface. But subsequent NNTP responses do not appear, though they are included in the response count.

    From what I can tell, it is working now. All my posts I made earlier today were visible after a couple of minutes. I did not check the contents page for the forum, though.

    What you say above explains what happened when I tried to produce a repro in the sandbox forum. In that case, my posts appeared immediately.


    Erland Sommarskog, SQL Server MVP, esquel@sommarskog.se
    Friday, May 10, 2013 5:18 PM
  • Am 10.05.2013 19:18, schrieb Erland Sommarskog [MVP]:

    You do have people on the forum team who know how to use the bridge, don't you?

    Well, they should. It's hardly rocket science to use a newsreader. Or to monitor this forum, for that matter.

    MS has an internal tool to access to forums... No one at MS would ever use the Web-Interface ;)


    Jochen Kalmbach (MVP VC++)
    Monday, May 13, 2013 1:29 PM