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RTM should have thease abilitys RRS feed

  • General discussion

  • Backup Configuration Wizard should have a option to backup individual files or/and folders, like i want to backup My Documents only, this will realy save space!

    Computers & Backup needs another status line that shows antivirus/firewall status on all individual systems

    Connector needs a option to manual add server ip or name like the one that you get when you install the application
    Wednesday, July 11, 2007 3:26 AM

All replies

  • Point by point...

     Tommy LA wrote:
    Backup Configuration Wizard should have a option to backup individual files or/and folders, like i want to backup My Documents only, this will realy save space!
    Not as much as you think. Because of the technology used for backups, there is only one copy of a given 4k cluster of data in the WHS backup database for all the client PCs on your network. So your total backup space requirements, assuming you don't exclude any additional folders, will be the size of your largest PC's data, plus relatively small increments for other client PCs. Typically, you'll see a couple of months worth of backups taking up little, if any, more space than that largest PC does now. And if you've got a few folders that contain a huge amount of data, but that don't need to be backed up, you can always exclude them.
     Tommy LA wrote:
    Computers & Backup needs another status line that shows antivirus/firewall status on all individual systems
    That information is available from Vista (in a way, and only with certain antivirus products) but XP doesn't expose it. So leaving it as a Network Health issue seems more sensible to me.
     Tommy LA wrote:
    Connector needs a option to manual add server ip or name like the one that you get when you install the application
    I'm not sure what you're asking for here. Can you describe a set of steps that leads you to a point where you need this?
    Wednesday, July 11, 2007 3:44 AM
    Moderator
  • "I'm not sure what you're asking for here. Can you describe a set of steps that leads you to a point where you need this?"
    i mean when going to tray and left click on Connector, and you should have a option to manualy add the home server and have a manual connect there to, its useful if you have 2 home servers running so you can chose witch you want to connect to or if you gets disconnected or connector wont connnect you to home server, you can easly do it manualy

    i hope you guys get it
    keep up the good work
    Windows Home Server is getting my attention
    Wednesday, July 11, 2007 6:46 AM
  • I do agree with the need to choose which files and folders you backup, instead of only being able to choose which files/folders you don't want to backup.  I really have no need to back up my entire hard drive.  If I need to reinstall an image I can just use Acronis or Ghost and keep the image on the server.  It just seems very tedious to have to go and select every folder I DON'T want to back up, just to end up with a backup of some documents and pictures.
    Wednesday, July 11, 2007 6:49 AM
  •  Hckymeyer wrote:
    I do agree with the need to choose which files and folders you backup, instead of only being able to choose which files/folders you don't want to backup. I really have no need to back up my entire hard drive. If I need to reinstall an image I can just use Acronis or Ghost and keep the image on the server. It just seems very tedious to have to go and select every folder I DON'T want to back up, just to end up with a backup of some documents and pictures.

    yes, i want only to backup "My Documents" on all clients, looks like WHS has this in reverse and thats in a a wreid way :/
    Wednesday, July 11, 2007 6:59 AM
  • SME...

     

    Thanks for the snappy reply.  Yes I have installed WHS.  Yes I am ACTUALLY testing the product.  This is a page for suggestions of what we would like to see in the RTM of WHS.  Not a page so that when a suggestion is made you can say it's stupid and attack the poster. 

     

    I think Tommy LA has a very valid point.  For a lot of users it seems backwards to have to exclude the folders we don't want backed up instead of being allowed to only choose the files I DO want backed up.  It is a lot more administrative work on my part to go and exclude all but 2 or 3 folders on each PC instead of just picking a couple folders to be backed up and calling it a day.

     

    If you are going to be constructive feel free to reply, otherwise please keep it to yourself.

    Wednesday, July 11, 2007 7:46 AM
  • That wasn't a reply to you, that was a reply to Tommy who quoted you. Wink

    If you're going to tell people to keep it to themselves, be sure they were talking to you.


    EDIT:
    Furthermore, the average admin will want to back up the whole PC and maybe exclude a folder or two, so you expect THEM to have to go through more work because YOU are bassackwards and want to do a half-baked backup? That makes no sense. I think it's fine the way it is.

    Wednesday, July 11, 2007 7:47 AM
  • Touche and point taken   
    Wednesday, July 11, 2007 7:52 AM
  •  Hckymeyer wrote:
    Touche and point taken


    I'll also add that while the forum is for "suggestions," it also says, "A place to discuss..." so if all you're looking for nothing but "yeah, me too" you're going to be disappointed.


    Wednesday, July 11, 2007 8:00 AM
  • The general idea with WHS backing up the entire computer is excellent, so if you can't bare excluding the files you don't need a backup of, maybe WHS isn't the thing for you?

    Why not try MS SyncToy or another backup solution instead?

    Wednesday, July 11, 2007 8:28 AM
  • yes, i want only to backup "My Documents" on all clients, looks like WHS has this in reverse and thats in a a wreid way :/

    It's a backup utility, designed to backup your PC and restore it to its previous condition should it fail. In order to do that, it needs to backup as much of the PC as possible. It already automatically excludes the folders that have no value. As ChristianJohansson says, perhaps this is not the solution for you.

     

    i mean when going to tray and left click on Connector, and you should have a option to manualy add the home server and have a manual connect there to, its useful if you have 2 home servers running so you can chose witch you want to connect to or if you gets disconnected or connector wont connnect you to home server, you can easly do it manualy

    i hope you guys get it

    Nope. What is the point (SME excepted) of having two home servers? "if you gets disconnected or connector wont connnect you to home server, you can easly do it manualy" If WHS can't connect then it can't connect. Manual connection is therefore not an option.

    Wednesday, July 11, 2007 10:40 PM
  • EDIT:
    Furthermore, the average admin will want to back up the whole PC and maybe exclude a folder or two, so you expect THEM to have to go through more work because YOU are bassackwards and want to do a half-baked backup? That makes no sense. I think it's fine the way it is.

     

    So now I'm bassackwards?  I'm willing to bet that when this hits the public there will be a lot of 'mom and pop' admins that don't need or want their ENTIRE system backed up.  If all you want is a backup system there are a lot of easier, and more cost effective, ways to accomplish that task.  I'm willing to bet that most average users will find more use in the remote access and file sharing capabilites that an entire system backup.  I'm just saying it would be much easier to go in and check the folders you want backed up, than having to go in and uncheck every folder you don't want backed up. 

     

    If you feel that an entire backup is what most people will choose, then just leave the default to backup everything.  But it would be much faster to be able to go in and check my music and pictures folders than having to uncheck every single folder on my drive that I don't want backed up.  With this method of selection you can still just check an entire drive at the root level and backup everything, so it wouldn't really add any time or administrative work to do what it already does right now.  But for myself, and I think many others out there, it would be much faster to accomplish what I want with a selective backup instead of a de-selective backup.

    Thursday, July 12, 2007 4:14 AM
  • if you use OpenDNS ( http://www.opendns.com )
    you cant connect to a computer in the network by \\name
    only ip works then, OpenDNS is way safer for my parents, manual option should be in the client, it is in setup why not connector client Smile
    Thursday, July 12, 2007 4:52 AM
  •  Crash2975 wrote:

    It's a backup utility, designed to backup your PC and restore it to its previous condition should it fail. In order to do that, it needs to backup as much of the PC as possible. It already automatically excludes the folders that have no value. As ChristianJohansson says, perhaps this is not the solution for you.



    Don't try to confuse them with logic, they'll have none of that.. Wink

    Thursday, July 12, 2007 4:58 AM
  • Maybe someone missed the bit where it is called "home server" not "server for super admins"
    Thursday, July 12, 2007 6:59 AM
  • That's why WHS seeks to protect those that would only backup 1 folder by defaulting to backing up the whole PC. Since WHS is also targeted to enthusiasts, it has the option to configure backups and exclude folders, if needed. WHS will let you make bad choices but it shouldn't default to them. Wink

    Thursday, July 12, 2007 7:12 AM
  • Really? That seems a major flaw in functionality. How does providing a redirect to an IP address interfere with the local name service? I'd be interested to hear from others how they've got round this.

     

    OpenDNS is way safer for my parents
    Than what? If you've not tried it yet, a name service is provided as part of WHS (domain.livenode.com, which will become domain.homeserver.com on release).

     

    IP adresses can change, especially with most domestic configurations where the router is providing DHCP, and that's about the least friendly thing for parents to wrestle with.

    Thursday, July 12, 2007 1:28 PM
  •  Hckymeyer wrote:

    EDIT:
    Furthermore, the average admin will want to back up the whole PC and maybe exclude a folder or two, so you expect THEM to have to go through more work because YOU are bassackwards and want to do a half-baked backup? That makes no sense. I think it's fine the way it is.

     

    So now I'm bassackwards?  I'm willing to bet that when this hits the public there will be a lot of 'mom and pop' admins that don't need or want their ENTIRE system backed up.  If all you want is a backup system there are a lot of easier, and more cost effective, ways to accomplish that task.  I'm willing to bet that most average users will find more use in the remote access and file sharing capabilites that an entire system backup.  I'm just saying it would be much easier to go in and check the folders you want backed up, than having to go in and uncheck every folder you don't want backed up. 

     

    If you feel that an entire backup is what most people will choose, then just leave the default to backup everything.  But it would be much faster to be able to go in and check my music and pictures folders than having to uncheck every single folder on my drive that I don't want backed up.  With this method of selection you can still just check an entire drive at the root level and backup everything, so it wouldn't really add any time or administrative work to do what it already does right now.  But for myself, and I think many others out there, it would be much faster to accomplish what I want with a selective backup instead of a de-selective backup.

     

    Show me ONE option for "ENTIRE system back up" that is easier to use than WHS.  Just ONE!  How much easier can you have than: Install Server, Install Connector, do nothing...

    And I'd really like a more cost effective solution (for multi-PC households) also.  Since WHS backs up clusters, and if a cluster is duplicated, it just creates a pointer...  in theory, you could backup 5 machines in the storage space of 1 (not counting my documents).  Assuming more than one PC, and they are all running the same OS, you can't get more cost/space efficient either.

     

    Once again, people are making comments on what THEY want in the product, instead of what the TARGET MARKET USER would want.  WHS is targeted at the simple, non-techie, user.  The user that isn't doing any backup at ALL today.  WHS is designed to give them as close as possible to a 1-Touch Backup or Restore of their entire system.  It's NOT meant as a NAS, it's NOT meant as a data backup solution; it's meant as a SYSTEM backup solution.

     

    As a couple others have stated:  if YOU want to only backup data/files, then maybe WHS isn't the right solution for you.  There are quite a few existing options (SyncToy, Windows Backup) that will fill that role MUCH better.

    Thursday, July 12, 2007 10:13 PM
  • I'm willing to bet that when this hits the public there will be a lot of 'mom and pop' admins that don't need or want their ENTIRE system backed up. 

    I'll lay you money that most WHS "admins" - not just M&Ps - won't have the foggiest idea what to backup and will be exceeding greatful that they don't need to give themselves headaches trying to understand what's important and what's not. Backing up everything (except some sensible defaults) makes life much easier for them.

    If all you want is a backup system there are a lot of easier, and more cost effective, ways to accomplish that task. 
    I don't see many non-techies using those systems, and it's for them that WHS is intended. Techies will find the solution that suits them.

    I'm willing to bet that most average users will find more use in the remote access and file sharing capabilites that an entire system backup.

    From the comments of other users here who have used the restore facility in anger, I'd say you were wide of the mark there. Like house insurance, you may only need it once, but boy will you be glad you got it!

    I'm just saying it would be much easier to go in and check the folders you want backed up, than having to go in and uncheck every folder you don't want backed up. 

    It took me a matter of seconds to clear the folders I didn't want; it would have taken me much longer to choose the ones I did (ie just about everything except the WHS default exclusions). What I think would be good is a expanding tree with cascading check boxes, like most traditional backup apps. I imagine that it's not made easy to exclude folders to discourage folk from failing to backup things that they actually need.

     

    If you feel that an entire backup is what most people will choose, then just leave the default to backup everything. 

    [checks WHS default] Why, so it is!

    Thursday, July 12, 2007 11:10 PM
  • Wink

    Thursday, July 12, 2007 11:13 PM
  • So the default is already set to backup everything.  As I see it that would not change at all by switching selection methods.  Default is still everything and 'mom and pop' still don't have to change a thing.  What would be the harm, or why would it matter so much to you, if the next screen allowed you to select folders instead of deselect folders?  It would appeal to the best of both worlds.

     

    As to missing the mark on what most people would find important as a selling point for WHS...  Just about everyone I've talked to in my family and friends hasn't really cared about the total PC backup.  Everyone has really been intrigued with the idea of remote access to files and the ability to share.  Wait until this hits the market and see how HP chooses to advertise.  They will put more emphasis on sharing and access than on backup, because that is what will drive customers in to stores to buy the product.

    Friday, July 13, 2007 3:48 AM
  • You can't have it both ways, where everything is selected on one page by default and then deselected the next page, that'd confuse everyone. You're free to backup as little as you'd like but they shouldn't make that the easiest option, imo.

    I'm sure MS has done market research as to what the targeted users want and need. They didn't pull their backup policy out of thin air.

    Friday, July 13, 2007 4:07 AM
  • If you only want to back up "My Documents" why don't you redirect the "My Documents" folder to point to a redundant folder on the server?
    Friday, July 13, 2007 5:18 PM
  • I've already have just my pictures and some documents selected for backup.  I just had to deselect every other folder.  It just seems backwards to have to deselect folders instead of selecting them.
    Friday, July 13, 2007 10:18 PM
  • As I see it that would not change at all by switching selection methods.  Default is still everything and 'mom and pop' still don't have to change a thing.  What would be the harm, or why would it matter so much to you, if the next screen allowed you to select folders instead of deselect folders?

    I can't make sense of your first para; everything's selected for backup on the first screen, then the next has none? How's that going to work?

     

    As regards the functionality, almost no one to whom I've spoken is interested in remote access - those who show photos online are using Flickr and like the comment thread that provides. They are very interested in something that will provide easy and reliable backup for the computers in their home, however. Same applies the "must-have" media centre functionality - even less interest in that than remote access.

    Sunday, July 15, 2007 11:31 AM
  • You also say that the majority of people want it for it's remote access. In that case, a lot of them will be dissapointed as the majority of ISP's* don't allow servers on 'home' contracts.

    I must admit, I think this will have to change, as when large numbers of people just blithly start using WHs, they will be snowed under with support calls asking why they can't access their own server.

     

    * Here in the UK, a recent survey showed that well over 90% of ISP's don't allow servers.

     

    I'm also one of those that agrees with the current method of selecting (or deselecting) backups!

    Maybe if it's SUCH a pain for you, why not write a script to run through it for you?

     

    Colin

    Sunday, July 15, 2007 5:10 PM