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OCS 2007 on VMWARE RRS feed

  • Question

  •  

    Hi Everyone,

     

    Anyone has any experience in running OCS 2007 in VMWARE environment or Microsoft Virtual Server environment?

     

    Appreciate any answer / comment on this.

     

    Thanks

     

    Newson Ng

     

     

    Monday, September 24, 2007 5:18 AM

All replies

  • I have seen some of the beta support engineers post on this site that it is not supported on VMWare, but you will also find lots of people who have used it and got it to work.

    I have personally used Virtual Server and Virtual PC many times and got everything to work just fine. There are some performance issues, especially with the Exchange UM performormance. The OCS Ignite tour was all done using virtual server/PC as well.

    Monday, September 24, 2007 4:56 PM
  • I've run OCS Beta (and RC and RTM EVAL) in Microsoft virtulisation products and am not overwhelmed. In VPC, OCS services fail to start after a re-boot, and we have other weird problems. I do not reccoment live running of OCS in a virtulised environment.
    • Proposed as answer by joostan Thursday, August 27, 2009 11:58 AM
    Tuesday, September 25, 2007 10:23 AM
  •  

    I've deployed OCS (private beta, public beta, rtm eval) several times on MS Virtual Server 2005 without any problems.

    Not tested yet on VMWare

    Rgds,

    Dieter

     

    Tuesday, September 25, 2007 12:23 PM
  • I'm running a complete OCS 2007 environment (FE, Edge, Mediation) on ESX 3.0.1.

    Runs perfectly fine.

     

    Tuesday, September 25, 2007 6:40 PM
  • It may run fine, but so far as I can tell, it's not supported. That may not matter for testing, but it might be important for production.
    Thursday, September 27, 2007 4:44 PM
  • We have successfully deployed OCS Beta, RC, & RTM on VMWare ESX (32-bit & 64-bit hosts) and have had no issues to date.  PSS is supposed to be making best-efforts to support VMWare but that isn't always the case.  As a general rule, we have not virtualized SQL or Exchange Mailbox servers but all other OCS/Exchange roles are fair game.  

     

    Saturday, October 20, 2007 3:46 AM
  •  Rob Ross wrote:
    We have successfully deployed OCS Beta, RC, & RTM on VMWare ESX (32-bit & 64-bit hosts) and have had no issues to date.  PSS is supposed to be making best-efforts to support VMWare but that isn't always the case.  As a general rule, we have not virtualized SQL or Exchange Mailbox servers but all other OCS/Exchange roles are fair game.  

     

    While it may work (and we use virtulisation in the classroom too), it is not supported in production (per the Supportabiity guide). Given the importance of OCS for some organisations, that may be a real incentinve NOT to virtulialise your OCS deployment.

    Milieage varies.

    Sunday, November 11, 2007 1:03 PM
  • I can't imagine anyone attempting to run OCS Virtualized for a production deployment.  If you plan to do a proof-of-concept internally to show off it's IM capabilities only, then this would work as I have a working deployment of OCS 2007 in my VMware Server 1.0.4 test lab environment.

     

    But in my expereince with running OCS in both my lab and in the PCS 2007 Ignite Virtual PC labs audio and video can be very choppy.  Any network QoS can go right into the toilet when you attempt to run all these pieces on a single piece of hardware.

     

    Sunday, November 11, 2007 3:23 PM
    Moderator
  • OCS 2007 support in a Virtualized Environment

     

    None of the roles of the OCS 2007 are supported in the virtualized environment. Its a complete no no. Please refrain from doing this in the virtual Environment. You would get the support from Microsoft on Best effort basis. They may try and help but if the issue is not resoved you have to get them on the physical servers before you get further support.

     

    The supportability document which explains this is available here.

     

    Hope this clarifies.

     

     

    Windows 2008 support for OCS 2007.

    With the release of Windows 2008 many of you might try and install the OCS 2007 on the Windows 2008 server. Please don't jump and do this. Make sure you see windows 2008 server listed in the following link before you do so. Again it comes to supportability. I hope you understand. To make it simple please do not install OCS 2007 on Windows 2008 in a production environment until you get the word from horses mouth.

     

    Windows 2008 not supported for OCS 2007

    Wednesday, February 6, 2008 8:37 AM
  •  

     

    We are ruuning OCS 2007 on VMWare for past 6 months without any problem in proof of concept environment. with success of Proof of concept on VMWare we are going forward in production on VMWare.

     

    see link below for more information.

    http://www.microsoft.com/presspass/press/2007/nov07/11-12HyperVPR.mspx

     

     

    Here is the announcement extract from the article:

     

    Server Virtualization Validation Program

    In response to industry and customer demands for more comprehensive technical support of virtual machines, Kelly also announced the Server Virtualization Validation Program. Beginning in June 2008, vendors will be able to self-test and validate certain technical requirements of their server virtualization software running Windows Server 2008 and prior versions. The program will enable Microsoft to offer cooperative technical support to customers running Windows Server on validated, non-Windows server virtualization software.

    “Microsoft has worked with industry partners to create a technical support model that will meet customers’ growing demands,” Kelly said. “As more customers deploy and virtualize Windows-based applications on Windows Server 2008 or other server virtualization software, this program will help ensure that customers receive a joint support experience for their physical and virtual infrastructure deployments.”

    “Technical support of virtualized images is an industrywide challenge,” said Roger Levy, senior vice president and general manager of Open Platform Solutions for Novell. “Our relationship with Microsoft provides us with a jointly supported solution today. Novell and Microsoft continue to collaborate to optimize bidirectional virtualization between Windows and SUSE Linux Enterprise with Xen. Microsoft’s server virtualization validation program provides customers with additional peace of mind when they run Windows as a guest in a validated environment such as SUSE Linux Enterprise.”

     

    Tuesday, February 26, 2008 2:22 AM
  • Hi to everyone,

    i'm also very interested in this topic, despite MS doesn't support virtualization option officially.

    Here it is some conclusions just in terms of voice quality to PSTN break-outs over media gateway(G.711 used), please correct\add some personal experience if possible:

     

    1.  Virtual PC --- can be used just for testing purporses, performance is very poor

    2. VMWare Workstation -- much better then Virtual PC, but I wouldn't go with the results we had to production environments

    3. VMware Server  --- ?

    4. VMware ESX --- ?

     

    Thanks

    Andrew

     

     

    Thursday, March 27, 2008 6:03 AM
  • In one of our Pilot environment we have a large VMWare ESX deployment and run OCS virtualized for a subset of our users.  Without getting into a debate over which virtualization product is better or the supportabilty position for Virtualized OCS, we have found that calls are very clear and can handle 3-5 calls/hour per user.  Still, these numbers are relative to your environment and as always, your mileage will vary.

     

    I use VMWare Workstation daily, and that works well for testing and demos.  Since we have ESX, VMWare Server hasn't been considered.     

     

    Thanks;

     

    Rob

    Thursday, March 27, 2008 6:19 AM
  • I dont know for vmware.
    But it runse fine on a dell D830 laptop with XP and virtual server 2005R2.
    Actualy i'm running some more on it the same time Exchange 2007 + AD and  some clients..
    Although it requires some RAM and disk space, but that would be the same for VMware.
    I like to be able to script with MS virtual server the reason i dont choose VMWare
     
    (Altough i might plan later to also instal vmware workstation for sisco callmanager .
    ..But i rather would have that disk trick into virt server to get callmanager running.)
    Wednesday, April 16, 2008 10:09 AM
  • I am working on setting up OCS 2007 on VMWare ESX servers and having some difficulty with the Edge server, do you have any suggestions

     

    Monday, July 14, 2008 4:41 PM
  • Kyle,

     

    Keep in mind that OCS 2007 is not currently supported using server virtualization techologies. With that being said can you give me more details on your issue? What problems are you having?

    Monday, July 14, 2008 8:25 PM
  •  

    Kyle:

     

    I copied the entire OCS 2007 CD to the drive that I wanted to install on (E: Drive) in this case and the Edge Server installed Successfully through the wizard.

     

    I had copied to (C: Drive) originally and tried to install on (E: Drive) and failed.  Got lucky I guess.

     

    Hope this helps.

    Friday, August 15, 2008 5:45 PM
  • I deployed OCS fine on VMWare ESX 3.5.  Also an edge server ....

     

    Works like a champ

     

    Tuesday, August 26, 2008 4:07 PM
  • From all reports I've received from Microsoft, the reasoning behind not virtualising OCS 2007 is due to the time sensitive nature of the audio and video codecs. 
    CPU and RAM resources can't be 100% guaranteed and you will see a degredation in audio/video quality in a virtual environment as opposed to physical hardware as the server starts to experience higher load.

    I wouldn't recommend deploying any OCS roles (and Exchange UM for that matter) that process audio or video on virtual infrastructure in a production environment. Things like the Reverse Proxy, CWA server, QoE, Archiving/CDR may be good candidates for virtualisation however.
    Wednesday, September 10, 2008 1:30 PM
  •  

    Are you testing voice/video?  Those are the components that struggle with vitualization.  IM is a pretty light load and not sensitive to delays.  Voice quality is hard to maintain on virtual servers.
    Wednesday, October 8, 2008 2:52 PM
  • We have Exchange UM deployed virtually for a set of test users and you can definately hear the quality degrade as the load on the system increases...same goes for OCS A/V.  Although not officially supported either, a hybrid approach (Enterprise Pool Expanded) can give you the best of both worlds where anything non-voice related (F/E, Web Services,etc.) is virtualized.  All other roles where the codec's need direct access to the hardware are physical.
    Wednesday, October 8, 2008 3:20 PM
  • Apparently some have managed to virtualize OCS

    But remind that this is not supported ... and no information about setup and userbase

    Oh and remind that it is Hyper-V not VMWare

    http://blogs.technet.com/haroldwong/archive/2008/08/26/tech-ed-2008-interview-with-joe-schurman-mvp.aspx

     

     

    Wednesday, October 8, 2008 11:28 PM
  • can you say what size your OCS environment is?

     

    Wednesday, October 15, 2008 8:39 PM
  • I've been running OCS 07 for over one year now on VMware ESX3. Never experienced any problems.
    We have 600 users, with some conferencing every day.

    There is really not much data being processed, and the I/O is low.
    Tuesday, January 13, 2009 8:04 AM
  • Successful ESX users -  may I ask what configs you are running your virtual OCS boxes on in terms of proc and RAM?

    Thanks,

    Tim
    Tim
    Monday, February 23, 2009 2:25 PM
  • We are testing in ESX3.5u3


    Resource Pool LAB_OCS
     - Min/Max Mem 4Gb/8Gb
     - Min/Max CPU 2000Mhz/8000Mhz
    4 vServers for OCS 2007 R2
        - Windows 2008 x64
        - 2Gb vRam

    Resource Pool LAB_SQL
     - Min/Max Mem 4Gb/8Gb
     - Min/Max CPU 2000Mhz/8000Mhz
    3 vServers for SQL 2008 EE
        - Windows 2008 x64
        - SQL 2008 Cluster
        - 4Gb vRam

    Resource Pool LAB_EXCH
     - Min/Max Mem 12Gb/24Gb
     - Min/Max CPU 20000Mhz/80000Mhz
    12 vServers for EXCHANGE 2007
        - Windows 2008 x64
        - 2Gb vRam

    Resource Pool LAB_AD
     - Min/Max Mem 2Gb/4Gb
     - Min/Max CPU 2000Mhz/80000Mhz
    2 vServers for AD Etc
        - Windows 2008 x64
        - 2Gb vRam


    vSwitch's are configured to 4vLAN's for
    vLAN101 - Data
    vLAN102 - Management
    vLAN150 - Voice
    vLAN190 - DMZ


    This is not only used for OCS but this is what i'm running atm.
    I have other services like SCCM, SCOM, etc running also.



    Tuesday, February 24, 2009 2:34 AM
  • Jimitupya, you fail to specify how many users you have that use this. I fear it's a lot of overscaling when it comes to OCS.

    Also, considering not running clustered if you have a very good backup (snapshot based, e.g. vRanger) if you have less than 1000 users, as the main problem many times come to SQL or config problems which clustering will not help, rather the opposite in fact.. If you have only one computer running most services, it can be the fastest way to recover all services by just rewinding it back one day. When running clusters and spreading the usage, a lot more servers must be rewinded, and you end up with a puzzle taking more than a weekend to figure out. The end result could be a complete reinstall.
    Wednesday, March 18, 2009 2:18 PM
  • HAL07,
    hiya, yeah we utilize double take for our snapshotting. We support around 500 users and have around 10-20 adhoc a/v conferences per day. We are looking at taking to production for around 8000 users but obviously we will be moving to physical boxes for the a/v components. we also have this setup for remote access via internet for livemeeting and out of office ocs access.

    We did run into issues early on in the peace with clustering services and just failed back for the lab environment. Given we have direct access to MS for Support we have the problems documented and solved on paper for the next lab environment we build for final validation. Also we have around 100 users connecting remotely via edge servers and over our MPLS WAN so this is also a concern for a fully virtualized environment due to specific company policies.

    Want to try for a core08 server build also if anybody has experience with this let me know :-)

    Bad side is that we are also playing with a vm based cisco ucm environment and its quality seems far better than the MS version. But given the overal complexity of both environments they both seem to be heavier in vm that on a physical box.

    All in all have had good and bad experiences with it.

    Jammy
    Thursday, March 26, 2009 6:13 AM
  • I think the services is an issue that some people are seeing on physical tin as well.

    If you went through all of the OCS Server services you will find them all are in the mood of starting and it will take it like 10 minutes then it will fail to start .

    If you set these OCS Services to manual start rather than Automatic then reboot. You will find that the server is functioning normally.

    This is really a very strange problem and I never faced it before as I have already implemented the OCS on 2008 but I still up to this moment don’t know the symptoms that causes this problem to happen.

    Solution:

    - Set startup type for wmiApSrv to automatic

    - Add dependency on RtcSrv to wmiApSrv

    - Set startup type for RtcSrv to automatic

    - Reboot

    - RtcSrv is starting and running

    - Set startup type for all Rtc* services to automatic

    - Reboot

    - All Rtc* services starting and running

     

    To set the RTCSrv service dependency you can use the registry to modify the following:

    HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SYSTEM\CurrentControlSet\Services\RtcSrv and modify the DependOnService to include the wmiApSrv.

    If this does not work you might need to set all the RTC services dependent on the Front-End service.

    Thursday, August 27, 2009 12:00 PM
  • Lately I have the same problem with restarting the FE server. If I leave all OCS services on automatic, the server fails to startup normally. The only way I can login with RDP again is when I boot into safe mode on iLO and set all OCS services to manual. Then reboot to normal mode and start the services in one go in the OCS console.

    Startup with the services on automatic was working fine before. I think this might have started after running windows update, but I'm not sure.
    Saturday, November 7, 2009 4:12 PM