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Opportunities Form RRS feed

  • Question

  • Hi

    Please excuse me if I sound a bit dumb, but I am very confused by the opportunities form and need some assistance.

    I would like to select my customer and create an opportunity based on a product within my price and product list. Lets say this ia a Widget... and the customer wants to buy 100 of them. The List price is $100 each. The normal discount is 15% off List but I want to give him a discount of 25% off the List price.

    How in the world do you do this in the opportunity form?

    I have set my products to Currency Amount within the Price List Items. All my products have a standard List price.

    Can someone assist please?

    Jay
    Wednesday, December 9, 2009 4:00 PM

Answers

  • The "Estimated Value" of an Opportunity can be automatically calculated from the Opportunity Products, and it comes from those entries you make.  The pricing that you supply the Opportunity Product is also imported to the Quote Product automatically.  Discounts are applied to Opportunity Products, Quote Products, Order Products, and Invoice Products in an identical manner.  If any of those references match the criteria for a Discount List, that discount is automatically applied to the "Volume Discount" field.  Manual Discounts can be finessed in either spot, but their properties are not inherently transitive: in other words, if you create a Quote from the data existing in the Opportunity Products, and then change the data on an Opportunity Product, it will not automatically update any Quote Product.  You would need to create a new Quote.

    The financial data from Opportunities should be regarded as "fuzzy data", which are approximations.  The Opportunity is really best, as you indicated, at managing the sales process and the progression.  Quotes can provide a robust "revision" history through the Activate/Revise process, that allows you to identify those Quotes that were rejected, and subsequently updated with new financial information.

    My favorite book--and really the only one I've read--is "Working with Microsoft Dynamics CRM 4.0".  It explains a lot of the relationships between these records, and best-use scenarios for them.
    Dave Berry
    • Marked as answer by Jay.at.Teqdis Thursday, December 10, 2009 7:30 PM
    Wednesday, December 9, 2009 9:03 PM
    Moderator
  • "Percent of List" refers to the "List Price" field on the Product record.  This is identical to the function of the "Percent of Markup/Margin" for the "Current/Standard Cost" field on the Product record.  In order to use those effectively, you need to put data in those fields on the Product.


    Dave Berry
    • Marked as answer by Jay.at.Teqdis Thursday, December 10, 2009 7:30 PM
    Wednesday, December 9, 2009 10:50 PM
    Moderator

All replies

  • I don't have an answer for you but I do suggest that you look at the use of the Discount and Discount List entities.  I believe they exist to implement the business rules to which you allude.
    Wednesday, December 9, 2009 4:29 PM
  • Hi Mardukes

    • I created a product list and that seems fine.
    • I created two price lists USD and EUR for products of the relative currencies.
    • When I create the price list entries the Pricing Method is confusing.
    • If the product already has a List price and discount list, then why am I being forced to state a price or percentage here?
    How does this work?

    I entered one product to test. This has a price of $100 List. In the Price List Item I selected Percentage of List. I selected the Zero Discount List item.

    When I load the opportunity form and go to add a product it does not allow me until the product is within a price list.
    If I choose a product that is in a price list then parts of the form are greyed out no matter what was chosen within the Price List Item creation form...

    The fields available to me are:
    • Unit (?? considering I had to specifiy that in the Price List Item AND the Product records )
    • Quantity (correct)
    • Manual Discount (This seems to be the DISCOUNT AMOUNT in value - Again ODD )

    So how does the opportunity system work??? Because this right now does not excite me at all.

    What I was expecting to see was to be able to select a product and enter a quanity and then apply a discount to it, resulting in the selling price.

    What am I doing wrong. If someone can assist I would really appreciate it.

    Jay
    Wednesday, December 9, 2009 7:27 PM
  • I am not familiar enough to answer your questions but my reaction is that perhaps you should be generating a quote for your opportunity.
    Wednesday, December 9, 2009 7:32 PM
  • Mardukes is partially right.  Products on an Opportunity record simply allow you to identify the products that you identify with the Win/Loss of the sales "opportunity".  Otherwise, they're meant to pre-populate the line-item entries on the Quote/Order/Invoice.  Any time you create one of those secondary records from within the context of the Opportunity, all Products listed under the Opportunity Products are imported automatically.

    Price Lists are a pretty standard way of recording different pricing groups, where pricing levels are driven by different criteria, and even relations to cost information within CRM.  You have to identify the applicable Price List reference on the Opportunity, Quote, Order, and Invoice records... as one product may have multiple Price Lists associations.  The restriction of adding Products without Price List entries is done by the system, but be careful since it will allow you to add Products without an association to your chosen Price List, if they are associated to any other Price List.  (That was a revelation from another thread in this forum.)

    Units of Measurement add another layer of complexity to Products and pricing, and allow you to define the "packaging" of your products.  For instance, if you sell sodas by the can, and by the 6-pack.  You can use 2 UOMs:  Single, 6-pack.  Their pricing may be different between them, and the result can be interesting as six Singles may have a different price than one 6-pack.

    Discounts, as you've discovered are done either by Discount List, which are automatically applied based on the criteria you establish for the Discount List; or, they are achieved by Manual Discount.  If you want to use percentages in conjunction with a Manual Discount, you either have to calculate by hand, or provide a custom field to accept the percentage, do the calculation automatically, and feed the result into the Manual Discount field.
    Dave Berry
    Wednesday, December 9, 2009 7:49 PM
    Moderator
  • I look at an opportunity as something scratched down a napkin while the full features of price breaking and such to be a little bit more momentous.
    Wednesday, December 9, 2009 8:03 PM
  • Thanks guys.. nice explanation.

    So I presume that when you create the opportunity you put a manual amount to the value? Since the creation of an opportunity for sure does not mean a quote has been generated. An opportunity has multiple stages such as evaluation, price request, negotiation etc all of which place weightage to the opportunity and contribute to the pipeline. So a quote may come half way down this chain.

    How does one then place a value on it? When I add a opportunity product all I get in terms of price input is the Quanitity, and Discount amount. This does not seem right to me.

    I would have thought that I would have entered something like:

    Product: Widget
    Quantity: 100
    List: $100

    I know I do enter that... but from what you are saying I enter basic values then convert to a quote, and there fine tune the discounts etc?

    Is this what I understand from your email Dave?

    Also can you recommend a really good book on CRM4?

    Thanks

    Jay
    Wednesday, December 9, 2009 8:08 PM
  • The "Estimated Value" of an Opportunity can be automatically calculated from the Opportunity Products, and it comes from those entries you make.  The pricing that you supply the Opportunity Product is also imported to the Quote Product automatically.  Discounts are applied to Opportunity Products, Quote Products, Order Products, and Invoice Products in an identical manner.  If any of those references match the criteria for a Discount List, that discount is automatically applied to the "Volume Discount" field.  Manual Discounts can be finessed in either spot, but their properties are not inherently transitive: in other words, if you create a Quote from the data existing in the Opportunity Products, and then change the data on an Opportunity Product, it will not automatically update any Quote Product.  You would need to create a new Quote.

    The financial data from Opportunities should be regarded as "fuzzy data", which are approximations.  The Opportunity is really best, as you indicated, at managing the sales process and the progression.  Quotes can provide a robust "revision" history through the Activate/Revise process, that allows you to identify those Quotes that were rejected, and subsequently updated with new financial information.

    My favorite book--and really the only one I've read--is "Working with Microsoft Dynamics CRM 4.0".  It explains a lot of the relationships between these records, and best-use scenarios for them.
    Dave Berry
    • Marked as answer by Jay.at.Teqdis Thursday, December 10, 2009 7:30 PM
    Wednesday, December 9, 2009 9:03 PM
    Moderator
  • Thanks David. I still feel that the system design is quirky. It could have been much more friendly and I suppose it could be with a lot of customization done.

    I have seen Maximizer and that has a very simple system that is table driven. You add products, their prices are brought in from the Product table. You apply a discount and this provides the nett value for the opportunity. This can be converted to a quote, or a quote generated in the same way.

    I still do not understand the reason for the pricing section in the Price List Item area. These fields are mandatory and why dont they grab the prices from the product list, after all you are forced to pick a product from the product list!

    Also I have noticed that if you select the Percentage of List, it does not seem to make any difference. Where does this come into action?

    Its very confusing.

    Jay
    Wednesday, December 9, 2009 10:32 PM
  • "Percent of List" refers to the "List Price" field on the Product record.  This is identical to the function of the "Percent of Markup/Margin" for the "Current/Standard Cost" field on the Product record.  In order to use those effectively, you need to put data in those fields on the Product.


    Dave Berry
    • Marked as answer by Jay.at.Teqdis Thursday, December 10, 2009 7:30 PM
    Wednesday, December 9, 2009 10:50 PM
    Moderator