Sign in
Microsoft.com
 
Microsoft
 
 
 

locked
Large File xfers crash WHS RRS feed

 > 

  • Question

  • Question
    Sign in to vote
    0
    Sign in to vote
    Hi :

    Have a new system passes all the tests and the hardware all checks out.

    I am trying to transfer about 10gigs of digital photos to the Photos file on the server. I know using the standard Windows Explorer utility can "break" the server.  I have tried cloning routines, the Shared Folder access and the system hangs up.  Big time .  Then I get Data Error on a few actual jpegs.  I go in a delete these files and still a  data error.  I need to go in a whack the whole xfer and then reboot everything.

    Once this is done I get all green network/system indications and all is good.

    Is there a different technique to xfre large files I am not aware of?

    Thanks

    Ralph
    Monday, February 22, 2010 4:29 PM

Answers

  • Question
    Sign in to vote
    0
    Sign in to vote
    Having fun now Theo. Thanks

    Not sure what Ken was trying to say.....about an OEM product or home-built especially the "oddity of the way the channel works"...what?

    Anyway.....more input:

    I downloaded Firefox to the WHS workstation ( probably a bad thing!) and then downloaded the WD drive tools too.  I ran the drive tools from the actual server desktop and then did it from the console. This worked fine.  Maybe I should have done this the first time without the XP load. Plus with the Advance Admin Console add-in I could even run the error-checking routine on the separate drives from the console.

    More options for future failures.  I do agree with Ken if the drive works 2 weeks it should work for years.....

    Thanks again for talking me off the ledge......so far WHS has run as advertised. But the hard part was with the dead drive I got all green "LEDs" when I went into server storage.  Gave a false sense of security....that was my basic complaint initially....not trying to diss WHS but I got "good to go" and then file crashes....due to bad hardware.

    A simple add-in could be made to do just what the WD tools does or even a basic check-disk routine.

    Anyway...thanks again for not lecturing me but "hand holding" thru the darkness...still trying to figure who I talk to about increasing your medal count.

    Finally if you are still reading this....does one need an antivirus package for WHS? Is there an FAQ on this subject?

    After your expert suggestions and resolution I consider the original thread closed!


    • Marked as answer by Ralph Hash Wednesday, February 24, 2010 2:39 PM
    Wednesday, February 24, 2010 2:39 PM

All replies

  • Question
    Sign in to vote
    0
    Sign in to vote
    If you tell us more about your server: home-built or OEM, which OEM, what add-ins have you installed, what add-ins have you uninstalled, have you installed software using the server desktop, etc. we can probably give you some guidance.

    That said, what you describe sounds like a network issue. Check cables, switches, routers, NICs, etc. Make sure you're using the correct drivers for your server's NIC.
    I'm not on the WHS team, I just post a lot. :)
    Monday, February 22, 2010 4:35 PM
    Moderator
  • Question
    Sign in to vote
    0
    Sign in to vote
    Hi Ken

    Thanks for the help here are the answers:

    Home built, modeled on the machine in Maximum PC Nov 2009 issue.

    CPU = Core Duo
    1 x 75G raptor ( the C: drive)
    4 x 1.5TB WD Green version
    All low power draw hardware

    Installed the WHS toolkit, and 3 apps outlined in the MPC article: Advance Admin Console, Disk Management (this cost 10 bucks, other were free) Web folders 4 WHS.  All loaded well, all was "green" and good to go until I did a very simple file transfer of a bunch of jpegs from my office machine to the server.

    Major crash. Locked up hard....just transferring photos...geeze

    This is the 4 time I had to reload WHS.

    I have built a number of computers for the business, my office one runs XP and I a Raid 5 set up over 4TBs and the C: drive is a 300G Raptor. I can transfer files, clone stuff, backup and do this across the network for the 4 other machines in the lab.

    The server was suppose to act as a work redundant backup and media server for the home. I have spent way to much time on the WHS  software...it seems very "fragile" based on the number of posts to these forums.

    Why not use the same hardware and just load XP and forgetaboutit?  I can set up the same file structure that is in WHS and get some robust, cheap apps off the web to do file cloning, backups and streaming....whatever.

    WHS seems a real pain to use and keep functional.....Sorry to un-load on you but this is wicked frustrating....and a major sink of time.

    If you think there are some simple fixes by all means let me know...otherwise I will load another copy of XP ( we buy them 3 at a time) and just let it run.

    Thanks for listening to the rant I will take a cleasning breath and go lie down now!

    Regards

    Ralph







    Monday, February 22, 2010 8:29 PM
  • Question
    Sign in to vote
    0
    Sign in to vote
    Hi Ken

    Thanks for the help here are the answers:

    Home built, modeled on the machine in Maximum PC Nov 2009 issue.

    CPU = Core Duo
    1 x 75G raptor ( the C: drive)
    4 x 1.5TB WD Green version
    All low power draw hardware

    Installed the WHS toolkit, and 3 apps outlined in the MPC article: Advance Admin Console, Disk Management (this cost 10 bucks, other were free) Web folders 4 WHS.  All loaded well, all was "green" and good to go until I did a very simple file transfer of a bunch of jpegs from my office machine to the server.

    Major crash. Locked up hard....just transferring photos...geeze

    This is the 4 time I had to reload WHS.

    I have built a number of computers for the business, my office one runs XP and I a Raid 5 set up over 4TBs and the C: drive is a 300G Raptor. I can transfer files, clone stuff, backup and do this across the network for the 4 other machines in the lab.

    The server was suppose to act as a work redundant backup and media server for the home. I have spent way to much time on the WHS  software...it seems very "fragile" based on the number of posts to these forums.

    Why not use the same hardware and just load XP and forgetaboutit?  I can set up the same file structure that is in WHS and get some robust, cheap apps off the web to do file cloning, backups and streaming....whatever.

    WHS seems a real pain to use and keep functional.....Sorry to un-load on you but this is wicked frustrating....and a major sink of time.

    If you think there are some simple fixes by all means let me know...otherwise I will load another copy of XP ( we buy them 3 at a time) and just let it run.

    Thanks for listening to the rant I will take a cleasning breath and go lie down now!

    Regards

    Ralph


    Have you tried installing just the OS and the related updates through the WHS Console (but no add-ins or apps)?  How about if you try it without the Raptor drive?
    Monday, February 22, 2010 9:17 PM
    Moderator
  • Question
    Sign in to vote
    0
    Sign in to vote
    Yes the first 2 times I did the install, real bare the OS and that was it. Xfer the photos ...same result. Major lock up and crash.

    I had to uninstall the Connector from the client and then re-load the WHS on the server.  It seems a few jpegs would hang up the system ( could not delete them from the server) with the redundant data error.....it is just a jpeg from Hawaii....??

    So re-load without the Raptor because of the different spin speeds of the drives?  Hmmm interesting....

    How about just loading the XP and using all the drives and forgetting the WHS? 

    Can you explain the merits of the WHS over the same hardware ( or a subset in this case) vs XP running as the server OS?

    Thanks




    Monday, February 22, 2010 9:30 PM
  • Question
    Sign in to vote
    0
    Sign in to vote
    Ralph,

    Based on what you are describing I would say you have a hardware problem or a (hardware related) driver problem:

    1. Check your BIOS settings. Any overclocking features enabled?
        (How much RAM installed, does the BIOS support the amount and type of RAM installed?
         If this is new hardware used for the first time, check the manufacturors website for drivers, BIOS updates/fixes....)

    2. Suspect the systems memory chips (run a memory test or try replacing).
        Most of the time bad memory chips will cause the system to go down when under load...

    2. Make sure you have the right chipset drivers, supported for Windows 2003 Server.
        (Check the manufacturors website)

    3. Check the NIC drivers. Use recent drivers, supported for Windows 2003 Server.
        (Check the manufacturors website)

    If none of the above gets your problem solved, try installing an OS that you know well (like Windows XP) to test your hardware configuraton. Try stressing the system by running memory/CPU/disk bechmark tools.

    - Theo.

    No home server like Home Server
    Monday, February 22, 2010 10:29 PM
    Moderator
  • Question
    Sign in to vote
    0
    Sign in to vote
    Thanks Theo here we go...

    No overclocking. Bios pretty basic, ( it is a slow moving server right!) Ram = 2Gigs

    Here is the conundrum for WHS. 

    I could not find specific drivers for just the WHS or 2003 server. Most device guys are all excited they have drivers for Windows 7.  If there are specific hardware issues then WHS should list very much upfront the "approved" list of vendors that support their OS. Just like EVGA lists hardware that supports their version of SLI. Very easy list to cruise, power supplies, mobos, video cards....etc.

    Now my question....if I load XP as suggested and all works fine....why not just roll this way.  Is there a real advantage to WHS over any other OS?

    Right now I can backup and clone my work files and images into my own machine ( I run a Raid 5 for the data) with XP, got real nice Raid drivers right on the mobo and robust as ____.  I was interested in doing a "server" given how easy Maximum PC made it look for the home files and media...but I can do this with an Xp machine too ....yes?

    Right now that is the big question in my mind.  Does WHS really beat XP for a simple non-enterprise server app?

    Can you lend any insight?

    Thanks
    Monday, February 22, 2010 10:47 PM
  • Question
    Sign in to vote
    0
    Sign in to vote
    Thanks Theo here we go...

    ...] I could not find specific drivers for just the WHS or 2003 server.


    Then that most likely is your problem then.
    * Chipset drivers: check you chipset manufacturor (Intel? VIA?) 
       I would be very surprised if you can not find the right drivers there.
    * NIC: same.
       If you have an onboard NIC, check your systems manual to find the chipset used.

    Mind that Windows Home Server is OEM and was not ment to be an "end-user" product. It is mainly marketed through manufacturors like HP, ACER, etc. You can however build your own Home server if you think you are up to it by buying the OEM-kit.


    Now my question....if I load XP as suggested and all works fine....why not just roll this way.  Is there a real advantage to WHS over any other OS?
    Windows Home Server is much more then "an OS". 24x7 Windows Server. Network storage, automatic Client backups, Server Data backup, File Duplication, Media Streaming, Remote acces to both you files and client PC's, Hosting your private Website or a Home network services etc..

    However, if you are only interested in Network Access Storage you could just buy a plain NAS storage device or role one of your own running the OS of you choice. Windows XP was not designed to operate as a server, but of coarse you could use it like that.
    - Theo.
    No home server like Home Server
    Monday, February 22, 2010 11:25 PM
    Moderator
  • Question
    Sign in to vote
    0
    Sign in to vote
    The North&South Bridge Chipset drivers ( P45, ICH10) are the same for Windows 2003 Server and XP when I checked the Intel site. At least that is what it seems

    Same for the RealTek Lan RTL8111DL XP=WHS

    The OEM version servers that run WHS usually roll with an Atom or other slower CPU.  I figured I'd race the server out a bit and throw in a dual core and some larger drives.

    I was excited by the marketing for WHS too and that is why I went out and invested in all the parts and software and now time. 

    It seems that from the beginning that the platform is a bit fragile and sensitive.

    I am trying the XP idea you suggested before....the drivers seems like they might not be the problem.

    But once I do the XP hardware check I'll install WHS again and see if I can copy a simple file.

    I'll jump back in here and let you know how it all turns out.

    Thanks for hanging in there and "schooling me".

    Ralph
    Tuesday, February 23, 2010 12:21 AM
  • Question
    Sign in to vote
    0
    Sign in to vote

    Hi Ralph,

    Thats correct. The Intel drivers do support multiple OS versions, including Windows 2003 Server.
    So does Realtek. So it looks like your drivers are OK.

    IMH there must be some other problem. Provided that you have a stable hardware and driver configuration Windows Home Server (which is build on top of Windows 2003 Server) will proove to be rock-solid. I have never had any problems with it, except for the ones I did cause myself by experimenting with it while logging on the WHS Desktop (which btw is unsupported)

    FYI: I have been running two WHS servers 24x7 hours for more then 2 years now. Except for a disk crash (which WHS handled gracefully) they have never let me down!

    And yes, I am interested to know how your testing turns out.
    Thumbs up!
    - Theo.

    No home server like Home Server
    Tuesday, February 23, 2010 8:15 PM
    Moderator
  • Question
    Sign in to vote
    0
    Sign in to vote
    Theo:

    All I can say is ......U DA MAN!!!!....you called it!

    I did the XP install ( bitching all the way I might add) and all went well.  Everything looked fine but I decided to run check disk on all the drives any way...of the 5 drives one did not make it out of the error check.

    I downloaded the Western Digital utilities to try again....damn if I was not surprised!!!

    During the Smart status check the WD utilities flagged a bad 1.5T Caviar!!! NO SH*T!!! (pardon my Armenian) at 10:30 pm the language starts to go....

    Made sure it was the drive and not the mobo or cable and sure enough...BAD DRIVE!

    RMA process is in the works on a 1 month old, 2 hour used drive....my first sick drive that was new.

    So congratulations....you called it way out in the process.   Reinstalled the WHS ( that Raptor has seen its share of installs the last few days!) WHS loaded no problem ( all the updates ran fine) set all up and then did the dreaded big-____ file transfer.

    Gulp!  Hit enter key and 9.5+Gs of family vacation photos made it in about 15 minuets!  No hang, no crash!

    WHS is vindicated!

    Now one rant is that I wish that WHS was a bit more robust in the utilities department in helping me de-bug the issue. Having to load XP to do the check seems a bit unfortunate..... But I'll stand down from this complaint and just be more open to the less probably fault occurrence ( failed brand new WD drive, who'd a thunk it).

    The other piece of good news is this fourm has some smart users...if it was up to me I'd have them hang another medal next to your name...

    Nice work dude!

    Thanks again for the assistance

    Ralph ( a WHS believer!)
     

    Tuesday, February 23, 2010 9:58 PM
  • Question
    Sign in to vote
    1
    Sign in to vote
    ...
    Now one rant is that I wish that WHS was a bit more robust in the utilities department in helping me de-bug the issue. Having to load XP to do the check seems a bit unfortunate..... But I'll stand down from this complaint and just be more open to the less probably fault occurrence ( failed brand new WD drive, who'd a thunk it).
    ...
    I say this a lot: Windows Home Server isn't a consumer product in it's software-only form. In the expected course of events, you would call your supplier (a system builder or OEM) and they would determine what the issue is. At some point they would say "you have a bad drive, ship it back and we'll ship you a new one" or "we can't tell what's wrong with your server, ship it back and we'll ship you a new one". That you can obtain a Windows Home Server system builder package and install it yourself is an oddity of the way the channel really works.

    If Microsoft starts selling Windows Home Server as a retail software-only product they will have to improve the installation experience significantly, and there will need to be support for a range of issues.

    As for juvenile drive failure, it's pretty common. If a drive lasts for a week, it will usually run for years...
    I'm not on the WHS team, I just post a lot. :)
    Tuesday, February 23, 2010 10:24 PM
    Moderator
  • Question
    Sign in to vote
    0
    Sign in to vote
    WHS is vindicated!
    (*grin*) Well done!
    Congratulations & Welcome to the Windows Home Server Community Ralph.

    And thanks for sharing,
    - Theo.

    PS - As Ken points out, your now are your own system builder. So just be carefull not to break it while trying all the nice (and bad) things you can do to it ;-) If you have not done so allready, reading the "Technical briefs & developer resources" will help  understand some of the inner workingd of WHS. Have fun!


    No home server like Home Server
    Tuesday, February 23, 2010 11:11 PM
    Moderator
  • Question
    Sign in to vote
    0
    Sign in to vote
    Having fun now Theo. Thanks

    Not sure what Ken was trying to say.....about an OEM product or home-built especially the "oddity of the way the channel works"...what?

    Anyway.....more input:

    I downloaded Firefox to the WHS workstation ( probably a bad thing!) and then downloaded the WD drive tools too.  I ran the drive tools from the actual server desktop and then did it from the console. This worked fine.  Maybe I should have done this the first time without the XP load. Plus with the Advance Admin Console add-in I could even run the error-checking routine on the separate drives from the console.

    More options for future failures.  I do agree with Ken if the drive works 2 weeks it should work for years.....

    Thanks again for talking me off the ledge......so far WHS has run as advertised. But the hard part was with the dead drive I got all green "LEDs" when I went into server storage.  Gave a false sense of security....that was my basic complaint initially....not trying to diss WHS but I got "good to go" and then file crashes....due to bad hardware.

    A simple add-in could be made to do just what the WD tools does or even a basic check-disk routine.

    Anyway...thanks again for not lecturing me but "hand holding" thru the darkness...still trying to figure who I talk to about increasing your medal count.

    Finally if you are still reading this....does one need an antivirus package for WHS? Is there an FAQ on this subject?

    After your expert suggestions and resolution I consider the original thread closed!


    • Marked as answer by Ralph Hash Wednesday, February 24, 2010 2:39 PM
    Wednesday, February 24, 2010 2:39 PM
  • Question
    Sign in to vote
    0
    Sign in to vote
    ...
    Not sure what Ken was trying to say.....about an OEM product or home-built especially the "oddity of the way the channel works"...what?
    ...
    WHS is available two ways: OEM (HP, Acer, Tranquil, etc.) hardware/software with support from the OEM or system builder software with support from the guy that installs the software on hardware for you. The way the system builder channel is structured, it's difficult for Microsoft to prevent system builder software from being sold to end users who install it themselves. So Microsoft mostly doesn't bother to try. (At one time there was a requirement that you buy your system builder software along with hardware; vendors got around that by selling you e.g. Windows XP Professional with a CD audio cable.)

    The basic point is that there is no retail software-only package for Windows Home Server, therefore no free support from Microsoft. If you obtain and install system builder software, you are the "system builder", so you are your own support.
    I'm not on the WHS team, I just post a lot. :)
    Wednesday, February 24, 2010 4:04 PM
    Moderator