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  • Question

  • For the first time I’m trying to restore one of my home system that have been backed-up for months on the WHS. I’ve been a champion to many other people about this product – until today… My first attempt at a system restore has been a painful failure…

     

    1)      This is a simple 32-bit Windows system, with the OS intalled on the C drive, data on other drives. It is being restored from an HP 485, and there are no network connection issues, etc. that others have expressed. There are no hardware changes - restoring a backup from about 5 days ago. 

     

    2)      The restoration starts to reboot, a very quick blue screen and reboots again. (Cannot see any part of the screen – too quick). At some point the option to try to go back to Last known good configuration and safe mode were available – tried both, both similarly failed. Turned-on bootup logging - could find no log file on C:\ (using the original XP disk in Recovery mode).

     

    3)      In case that particular day’s backup was not properly handled, I tried 2 other dates – all had the same effect.

     

    4)      Read in some postings that there could be a driver issue – the way around it was to write the latest Restore CD, copy the "Windows Home Server Drivers for Restore" directory to a USB device and restore that configuration. The restoration could see the USB drive (one more drive reported), but the restore again failed to reboot properly. Also read the directory name should be DRIVERS (doubt this), so copied the drivers material to a directory of this name as well – no change. (Does not seem to use the drivers?)

     

    Is there a way to use the original insall disk to repair this? Is there a way to find the actual problem area?

    OS backup/restore is the core benefit for this product, and I cannot seem to get this straight-forward restoration resolved.
    Any help in resolving this would go a long way in restoring my faith that this could be a useful product.
    Thank you.

    Wednesday, November 25, 2009 9:48 PM

Answers

  • Thank you for all your feedback. 

    For all of us to learn...

    As I mentioned in my last note, I suspected that there was no hardware problem, so I started researching other possibilities...

    Long story short, by going back in history much further I finally found a restore that worked!

    The virus effects showed only a few days before starting the restore process. Starting 5 days before the problem, I stepped back 5 previous backups just in case. I finally stepped back much further and found a restore over a month ago that did not have reboot problems...

    My take-away was that the WHS works for this system - just go back much further!!! 

    My current settings were 3 months, 3 weeks, 5 days - I think I'll adjust this to 5, 5, and 5...


    Thanks everyone for all your help and consideration, casey


    POSTSCRIPT:

    The first restore point that did work was the first restore point that had been locked so it wouldn't be deleted in a clean-up. I do this after major software install, or every few months just in case.

    I don't know if it made the difference, but thought it should be mentioned in case someone was having a similar problem. My take-away is to continue to lock a back up every so often... And If I have a problem with a restore, go back at least to a locked version...

     

    • Marked as answer by Ken WarrenModerator Saturday, November 28, 2009 2:59 PM
    • Edited by caseycasey Saturday, November 28, 2009 4:32 PM Postscript
    Saturday, November 28, 2009 4:28 AM

All replies

  • Hello,
    allow me a few questions:
    Which OS did you try to restore? Windows XP or Vista or 7?
    Was the hardware a self made system or a laptop or another branded computer with a separate system tool partition? If so, that partition had not been backed up and you run into issues with missing files, because the boot pointer shows the wrong partition. The FAQ How to solve boot problems after restoring a client disk should show you, how to solve this.
    If you restored to different hardware, it has also to be expected, that the system won't boot.
    There are also some situations, in which restored OS do not boot due to missing files, which have not been saved properly. This has been fixed with Power Pack 3, but only for new backups of course.
    Best greetings from Germany
    Olaf
    Wednesday, November 25, 2009 9:54 PM
    Moderator
  • Thank you Olaf for your fast response,

    It is a 32-bit XP restore, self-built system. The first drive has 2 partitions - the first, C:, is the OS, the second is data. There are other drives, but the OS partiion is the only thing I backup on WHS. 

    I had already read your "How to solve a boot problem..." FAQ, and for good mesure had added another entry to boot.ini - no change is response. I also tried overwriting ntoskrnl.exe (also from that thread), but the Recovery mode boot of the XP install did not allow me to do that... 

    It is the exact same hardware.

    1) Which files are not being backed-up properly - I may be able to work around that problem...

    2) Is there a way to find out exactly WHERE the XP boot is failing?

    Thanks, casey

    PS. Run in Command prompt safe mode, the boot process seemed to stop/reboot at mup.sys? Does that help clarify the problem?

    • Edited by caseycasey Wednesday, November 25, 2009 10:45 PM add PS and corrections
    Wednesday, November 25, 2009 10:21 PM
  • Also tried  Repair from the XP installation disc - no matter what I tried, kept getting "PAGE_FAULT_IN_NONPAGED_AREA"...

    Im' out of ideas.

    Sorely disappointed - I will no longer champion WHS to others - it has failed the most crucial task it can provide.



    Thursday, November 26, 2009 1:25 AM
  • Also tried  Repair from the XP installation disc - no matter what I tried, kept getting "PAGE_FAULT_IN_NONPAGED_AREA"...

    Im' out of ideas.

    Sorely disappointed - I will no longer champion WHS to others - it has failed the most crucial task it can provide.


    You've left out one very important piece of information:  Why are you restoring from a backup in the first place?  It may very well be that your problem is hardware related and is still there.  For example, typically the message "PAGE_FAULT_IN_NONPAGED_AREA" refers to faulty RAM...
    Thursday, November 26, 2009 6:23 PM
    Moderator
  • Exactly - a problem with your hardware will not be removed with a software restore.
    Besides faulty RAM also a faulty disk could be the culprit.
    Did you add any hardware, before this started to happen? If so, try to remove this component.
    Best greetings from Germany
    Olaf
    Thursday, November 26, 2009 8:57 PM
    Moderator
  • Ah...

    I'm restoring from backup because I got a pernicious virus that could not be removed by anything in my bag of tricks... (Avast kept blocking the virus every 5 minutes, telling me it was there, but could not remove it even on reboot system scan. Malwarebytes found several offending items, but even after 2 passes through both of these I could not remove the culprit. After several other attempts at rolling back (probably 10 hours total trying to remove this problem), I decided to try my first WHS restore from before the problem. There was no indication of a hardware problem, it is the same hardware configuration for the last 6+ months.

    However, I got another indication that there could be a hardware issue - trying a fresh install from XP intall disk on another drive/partition I once got a ntkrnlmp.exe "error code 7" failure - not consistently though... I also did a great deal of research on mup.sys. Found a great article that points out that it is often not mup.sys that fails, but the hardware/registry procedures after mup.sys that may cause the reboot. (Link to good mup.sys Article:  http://www.aitechsolutions.net/mupdotsysXPhang.html)

    So your comments are very appropriate...

    I removed all but the boot-up hard disk, all PCI cards (3 RAID cards) and USB devices other than keyobard/mouse. Removed most hard disks from the 750w power supply, so plenty of headroom). Just Mobo, CPU, memory, graphics card, hard disk. Same results. I also performed chkdsk which fixed an error, but same reboot after mup.sys problem...

    Following your comment further: This system is my media server and I built my desktop system on the same motherboard, memory, CPU, etc. (different graphics cards). After your comment, I moved the disk over to the other system and tried to boot there (it was going to have graphics card differences, and no PCI RAID cards but thought it may work since I select safe mode with command prompts anyway...) Seemed to last longer at mups.sys? But then rebooted...

    Thank you for your further insights. I can't easily swap the memory between the two systems - if you know a good memory test program, etc., I could try that... Any other recommendations?

    Beyond the time required to re-install the system from scratch (est 40 hours), I need to know if WHS can be be a viable backup medium - or written-off as another failure. This is why I'm spending sooooo much time on it right now.

    All your feedback is greatly appreciated!!!
    • Edited by caseycasey Thursday, November 26, 2009 10:20 PM spelling
    Thursday, November 26, 2009 10:18 PM
  • Ah...

    I'm restoring from backup because I got a pernicious virus that could not be removed by anything in my bag of tricks... (Avast kept blocking the virus every 5 minutes, telling me it was there, but could not remove it even on reboot system scan. Malwarebytes found several offending items, but even after 2 passes through both of these I could not remove the culprit. After several other attempts at rolling back (probably 10 hours total trying to remove this problem), I decided to try my first WHS restore from before the problem. There was no indication of a hardware problem, it is the same hardware configuration for the last 6+ months.

    However, I got another indication that there could be a hardware issue - trying a fresh install from XP intall disk on another drive/partition I once got a ntkrnlmp.exe "error code 7" failure - not consistently though... I also did a great deal of research on mup.sys. Found a great article that points out that it is often not mup.sys that fails, but the hardware/registry procedures after mup.sys that may cause the reboot. (Link to good mup.sys Article:  http://www.aitechsolutions.net/mupdotsysXPhang.html)

    So your comments are very appropriate...

    I removed all but the boot-up hard disk, all PCI cards (3 RAID cards) and USB devices other than keyobard/mouse. Removed most hard disks from the 750w power supply, so plenty of headroom). Just Mobo, CPU, memory, graphics card, hard disk. Same results. I also performed chkdsk which fixed an error, but same reboot after mup.sys problem...

    Following your comment further: This system is my media server and I built my desktop system on the same motherboard, memory, CPU, etc. (different graphics cards). After your comment, I moved the disk over to the other system and tried to boot there (it was going to have graphics card differences, and no PCI RAID cards but thought it may work since I select safe mode with command prompts anyway...) Seemed to last longer at mups.sys? But then rebooted...

    Thank you for your further insights. I can't easily swap the memory between the two systems - if you know a good memory test program, etc., I could try that... Any other recommendations?

    Memtest86+ comes to mind.

    Beyond the time required to re-install the system from scratch (est 40 hours), I need to know if WHS can be be a viable backup medium - or written-off as another failure. This is why I'm spending sooooo much time on it right now.

    All your feedback is greatly appreciated!!!

    Thursday, November 26, 2009 11:40 PM
    Moderator
  • This article states also, that a faulty service or Antivirus program can cause the mentioned BSOD.
    Best greetings from Germany
    Olaf
    Friday, November 27, 2009 7:47 AM
    Moderator
  • Thank you for your further feedback,

    Let me try a recap:

    I am starting to doubt there is a hardware issue here:
      - Memtest86+ has run several times without an error
      - chkdsk successfully completed on the only remaining attached hard disk
      - boot-up on a similar system also caused an abnormal reboot
      - the hardware configuration for the system had not changed for 8 months
         - nor was there any indication that there was a problem in the hardware before the OS restoration
      - The DVD is older - removed from a previous system, and can have a problem with some disks... I'm wondering if the intermittent ntkrnlmp.exe "error code 7" error could be a drive issue - not indicative of a system problem...

    What remains is:
      - what occurs after mup.sys to cause the abnormal reboot (it could be a hardware issue, registry issue, ...?)
      - PAGE_FAULT_IN_NONPAGED_AREA was consistent when trying to use the XP install disk to repair the Restored OS...
        - this no longer seems to be the memory or disk
        - the article also suggests a faulty service or anti-virus; again the problem is these have not changed... And even if they had - without a full, operational windows environment, how can we make the adjustments suggested?

    Where can we take this?
      (1) The article suggests studying the "System Log in Event Viewer" - great if we had a functional OS - otherwise how can this be viewed? Could this indicate what is actually failing after mup.sys?
      (2) Olaf - you mentioend in your first respose that "There are also some situations, in which restored OS do not boot due to missing files, which have not been saved properly. This has been fixed with Power Pack 3, but only for new backups of course." Could this be the source of the problem? Is there a list of missing files?

    Is anything mssing here - are their other directions to explore further?

    Thanks much, casey
    Friday, November 27, 2009 9:23 AM
  • Thank you for your further feedback,

    Let me try a recap:

    I am starting to doubt there is a hardware issue here:
      - Memtest86+ has run several times without an error
      - chkdsk successfully completed on the only remaining attached hard disk
      - boot-up on a similar system also caused an abnormal reboot
      - the hardware configuration for the system had not changed for 8 months
         - nor was there any indication that there was a problem in the hardware before the OS restoration
      - The DVD is older - removed from a previous system, and can have a problem with some disks... I'm wondering if the intermittent ntkrnlmp.exe "error code 7" error could be a drive issue - not indicative of a system problem...

    If it is the DVD drive, it is still a hardware issue.  If that drive is failing and it's the same drive you used for both the Restore CD as well as the XP fresh install attempt, you could try replacing the DVD drive.

    What remains is:
      - what occurs after mup.sys to cause the abnormal reboot (it could be a hardware issue, registry issue, ...?)
      - PAGE_FAULT_IN_NONPAGED_AREA was consistent when trying to use the XP install disk to repair the Restored OS...
        - this no longer seems to be the memory or disk
        - the article also suggests a faulty service or anti-virus; again the problem is these have not changed... And even if they had - without a full, operational windows environment, how can we make the adjustments suggested?

    Where can we take this?
      (1) The article suggests studying the "System Log in Event Viewer" - great if we had a functional OS - otherwise how can this be viewed? Could this indicate what is actually failing after mup.sys?
      (2) Olaf - you mentioend in your first respose that "There are also some situations, in which restored OS do not boot due to missing files, which have not been saved properly. This has been fixed with Power Pack 3, but only for new backups of course." Could this be the source of the problem? Is there a list of missing files?

    Is anything mssing here - are their other directions to explore further?

    Thanks much, casey
    How many times did you try a fresh XP install on that hardware?  How many times did it fail?  Did it always fail at the same point?
    Friday, November 27, 2009 3:29 PM
    Moderator
  • There are a lot of reasons for PAGE_FAULT_IN_NONPAGED_AREA. Most of them are hardware related (memory and disk are both strong possibilities), but it can also be caused by antivirus, some drivers, and some other software tools. You could try booting into safe mode again, though I see you've tried that unsuccessfully before. Failing to boot into safe mode is a strong argument for hardware or driver issues, I'm afraid, and the usual answer for both is to identify the problem by process of elimination and replace the defective component.

    Since this is a Windows XP issue, I would suggest you take a look at the Windows XP Resource Kit documentation , particularly the section Troubleshooting the startup process . You should also consider posting in the Windows XP forums , where you will get more in-depth help with XP-specific issues.

    A final option might be to try restoring to a virtual machine, to see if it's hardware or software related. A virtual machine (particularly Microsoft virtual PC 2007) has very "vanilla" hardware, and will usually boot if there are no software issues.
    I'm not on the WHS team, I just post a lot. :)
    Friday, November 27, 2009 4:49 PM
    Moderator
  • A final option might be to try restoring to a virtual machine, to see if it's hardware or software related. A virtual machine (particularly Microsoft virtual PC 2007) has very "vanilla" hardware, and will usually boot if there are no software issues.

    my experience looks different. If the original system was an SATA system (controllers in AHCI or RAID mode) or was dual core CPU or CPU with Hyperthreading, while the VM is only a simulated single core CPU, booting will fail usually with stop 0x0000007B from my experience.
    Best greetings from Germany
    Olaf
    Friday, November 27, 2009 9:09 PM
    Moderator
  • Thank you for all your feedback. 

    For all of us to learn...

    As I mentioned in my last note, I suspected that there was no hardware problem, so I started researching other possibilities...

    Long story short, by going back in history much further I finally found a restore that worked!

    The virus effects showed only a few days before starting the restore process. Starting 5 days before the problem, I stepped back 5 previous backups just in case. I finally stepped back much further and found a restore over a month ago that did not have reboot problems...

    My take-away was that the WHS works for this system - just go back much further!!! 

    My current settings were 3 months, 3 weeks, 5 days - I think I'll adjust this to 5, 5, and 5...


    Thanks everyone for all your help and consideration, casey


    POSTSCRIPT:

    The first restore point that did work was the first restore point that had been locked so it wouldn't be deleted in a clean-up. I do this after major software install, or every few months just in case.

    I don't know if it made the difference, but thought it should be mentioned in case someone was having a similar problem. My take-away is to continue to lock a back up every so often... And If I have a problem with a restore, go back at least to a locked version...

     

    • Marked as answer by Ken WarrenModerator Saturday, November 28, 2009 2:59 PM
    • Edited by caseycasey Saturday, November 28, 2009 4:32 PM Postscript
    Saturday, November 28, 2009 4:28 AM