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What’s new in backup for “Vail” RRS feed

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    Backing up client computers for file or folder or a full system restore was a feature introduced in Windows Home Server V1. Significant portion of the features and technology have been carried forward in the Vail product as well.

    Backing up your server

    Ability to backup the server and restore both data and the full system from a disaster was one of the #1 asks from our customers. In Vail we have provided ability to do automated backups of the full server to externally attached storage. Features include:

    ·         Full VSS based backup of the server to externally attached disks using Windows Server 2008 R2 backup technology

    ·         Ability to back up to multiple targets for offsite storage. You keep one external disk onsite for your most recent backups, and the other disks offsite in case of disasters

    ·         You can back up the Operating System, Data, Shared Folders, and even the Client Backup Database for future recovery

    ·         Select what you want to protect using the server backup configuration wizard on the Computers and Backup tab

    ·         Schedule automatic backups multiple times a day upto half hour intervals

    ·         Backups to external disks are incremental for storage optimization but each back up version is fully restorable

    ·         Restore scenarios include restoring individual Files or Folders, Full system restore through Bare Metal Restore, and Factory Reset

    Note: Not all features stated above have been fully developed in the product yet. For details about what is and is not available please refer to the Getting Started guide.

    Backing up the client computers

    Centralized backup of client computers to the Windows Home Server storage was a feature introduced in Windows Home Server V1. The basic technology and the features have been carried forward with some key feature updates.

    Features from Windows Home Server V1

    ·         Automatic daily backups of network joined client computers to centralized storage on Windows Home Server

    ·         Backups are single instanced and incremental over the network. This provides storage and backup time optimizations. Only unique data and incremental changes across your home network are sent over the wire and stored only once.

    ·         Ability to exclude files or folders from your backup

    ·         Restore scenarios include individual Files or Folders and Full System Restore to similar hardware using Bare Metal Restore

    New Features in “Vail”

    ·         Support for VSS writers on client computers to improve consistency of backups

    ·         New backup configuration wizard allows you to select volumes or folders you want to backup. Items that are not selected are excluded from the backup

    ·         New Files or Folders restore Wizard provides a guided wizard for the user to restore individual files or folders from a backup

    ·         New mini filter driver for the Files or Folders Restore wizard solves many of the problems in V1 resulting from multiple mount of backup volumes

    ·         Intelligent automatic scheduling allows more computers to be backed up

    o   Higher priority is given to computers with the oldest backups during the time window

    o   Prioritization is calculated dynamically

    o   Computers which are chronically out of compliance (such as laptops) are automatically backed outside of the backup time window whenever they are connected to the server

    ·         Backups are now resummable. In WHS V1 if backups are not successfull, it started from the beginning the next time backups ran. This resulted in computers with high storage in repeated failed backups. In Vail we take checkpoints along the way (this is not visible to the end user). If for any reason backup fails in the middle such as due network connection drop, backups will resume from the last checkpoint next time it runs

    ·         Full system restore functionality now allows automatic partition and formatting of drives during restore. In WHS V1 if volumes did not exist, users had to manually create partitions and format them before continuing with the system restore process. In Vail we do this automatically based on the configuration that existed in the source during a backup

    ·         System restore disk now includes both the x86 (32 bit) and x64 bit version of the restore media. This allows you to restore both x86 and x64 bit client computers without the need to download and install specific 32 bit drivers for the restore CD

    ·         Improved resiliency and robustness of the backup database including an improved database repair functionality 

    ·         Backup applet on the Client Launchpad allows users to start/stop manual backups as well as set the power management settings

     

    Note: Not all features stated above have been fully developed in the product yet. For details about what is and is not available please refer to the Getting Started guide

     And thank you all for testing Vail

    -Bodhi

    Bodhi Deb - MSFT
    Wednesday, April 28, 2010 10:52 PM

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    ...
    System restore disk now includes both the x86 (32 bit) and x64 bit version of the restore media. This allows you to restore both x86 and x64 bit client computers without the need to download and install specific 32 bit drivers for the restore CD
    ...
    Hurray! :)
    I'm not on the WHS team, I just post a lot. :)
    Wednesday, April 28, 2010 11:07 PM
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    "disk now includes both the x86 (32 bit) and x64 bit version of the restore media"

    This is great!  :-)

    I did a couple of full system restores and it worked without having to have drivers loaded on a thumb drive. 

     

    Don
    Thursday, April 29, 2010 12:38 AM
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    Thanks for the documentation, Bodhi.

    While on the subject of backups, I have a couple of quick questions I'm hoping someone can answer.

    1)I noticed that when selecting what files and folders to backup, the backup configuration window no longer shows the folder size. Is this something that's been purposely dropped, or just something that wasn't beta-ready?

    2) Along those same lines, what's going on with client backup scheduling? It's currently AWOL (though I'm assuming this is just for the beta). Are we going to be getting any new features there, beyond the aforementioned changes to priority and chronically out of compliance computers?

    Thursday, April 29, 2010 2:19 AM
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    Your second question has been asked elsewhere; the answer is that scheduling (I presume that it will be global as in V1) will be in a later build. For the first, I don't make selections for backing up. I want to back up the entire computer. Probably, though, the folder size was dropped intentionally. It's not useful information; it tells you how big a folder is, but not how important it is.
    I'm not on the WHS team, I just post a lot. :)
    Thursday, April 29, 2010 2:52 AM
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    Thanks Ken, you are correct about the folder sizes. We want to make all UI as simple as possible for normal users and that sometimes means taking out things. The folder sizes are one such change. We recommend that you back up everything. Storage is cheap. If users want to exclude a particular folder they probably already know about it and no need to show it in the config wizard.

    Having said that, we the beta is for feedback such as this. So I highly recommend everyone to test the product and open bugs, suggessions, feature requests etc. Cannot guarantee that every feedback or suggestion will be taken but they all go through due consideration in the team.   

    -Bodhi

    Bodhi Deb - MSFT
    Thursday, April 29, 2010 4:15 AM
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    Full server system backup that is just GREAT.  Finally the main system section of the server will really be great for everyone concerned.  MS GOOD job.

    jd

    Thursday, April 29, 2010 4:50 AM
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    About the backup time window. This release it is set to default 12:00 to 6:00 AM. The UI to change the default setting did not make it in this beta. Coming soon.

    cheers.

    Bodhi Deb - MSFT
    Thursday, April 29, 2010 5:18 AM
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    We want to make all UI as simple as possible for normal users and that sometimes means taking out things. The folder sizes are one such change. We recommend that you back up everything. Storage is cheap. If users want to exclude a particular folder they probably already know about it and no need to show it in the config wizard.

    -Bodhi

    Bodhi Deb - MSFT

    Folder size is very helpful in WHS v1. If I see huge folder it probably means there is some garbage in it.

    I download some stuff to try and then forget to delete. Also I temporarily copy some videos locally so I don't have to keep server on 24/7.
    Downloaded software patches can take hundreds of gigabytes. MS Office 2007 service pack 2 = 300GB. These are not meant to be in backup.
    Folder size helped to detect such things.

    Just one more disadvantage comparing to WHS v1.
    Thursday, April 29, 2010 8:05 AM
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    Thanks Bodhi for the details on Backup and Restore in VAIL. A couple of questions though: 

    1. With backups now being resumable, does that mean that backing up over WiFi is now a supported scenario?

    2. Will it be possible to restore a volume to a partition that is smaller than the original partition was, as long as it larger than the real data that is contained in the backup?

    3. Will the new files and folders restore wizard be able to restore ACLs and ADSs (alternate data streams) for files and folders?

    4. Will there be a way to see on the client (even if the server is not available) to see when the last successful backup was run?

    I'd also love to see the folder size information make its way back into VAIL. It helps a lot when configuring backups for the computers of family members. I know the which and where on my computer but not on every computer in the house.

    Thanks

    Andreas M.

    Thursday, April 29, 2010 11:44 AM
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    ...
    MS Office 2007 service pack 2 = 300GB.
    ...
    You mean 300 MB? That's about how large it is...
    I'm not on the WHS team, I just post a lot. :)
    Thursday, April 29, 2010 2:34 PM
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    Ken

     

    could you make this as a "sticky" post please?

    2 home servers plus vail test server 10tb storage combined
    Thursday, April 29, 2010 4:51 PM
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    Thanks Andreas, Comments inline

    Thanks Bodhi for the details on Backup and Restore in VAIL. A couple of questions though: 

    1. With backups now being resumable, does that mean that backing up over WiFi is now a supported scenario?

    [Bodhi] Backup over wifi has always been supported, except wifi is less reliable and in WHS V1 failures had bigger impact. We have always had a 5 minute reconnect logic for the network, but having the resummable feature makes it even more robust 

    2. Will it be possible to restore a volume to a partition that is smaller than the original partition was, as long as it larger than the real data that is contained in the backup?

    [Bodhi] No. We need the disk to be at equal to or greater than the source so we can create the partitions with the exact sizes as existed in the source.

    3. Will the new files and folders restore wizard be able to restore ACLs and ADSs (alternate data streams) for files and folders?

    [Bodhi] What we do is mount the backup as a local volume and use windows copy dialog to copy the files or folders accross. So basically the copy works in the current user context.  

    4. Will there be a way to see on the client (even if the server is not available) to see when the last successful backup was run?

    [Bodhi] Currently we only display the status of the last backup action on the launchpad app. Can you please open a connect bug and provide info what you are looking for here.

    I'd also love to see the folder size information make its way back into VAIL. It helps a lot when configuring backups for the computers of family members. I know the which and where on my computer but not on every computer in the house.

    [Bodhi] Open a bug vote on it etc. :-) cant guarantee though.  

    Thanks

    Andreas M.

    Bodhi Deb - MSFT
    Thursday, April 29, 2010 6:27 PM
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    Just as a bit of anecdotal evidence, my laptops have never backed up to my home servers through a wired connection. Not even once.

    It is, however impossible to restore over a wireless connection, unless your AP is completely open; there's no way to configure security in the Restore CD.

    I'm not on the WHS team, I just post a lot. :)
    Thursday, April 29, 2010 7:33 PM
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    Maybe it is just me, but I see in your comment: "We want to make all UI as
    simple as possible for normal users and that sometimes means taking out
    things", a failing among many MS developers, in trying to make things simple
    and easy to use, things are 'taken out' rather than keeping options
    available for those that need/want them. Why not concentrate on making the
    'defaults' simple and easy, but still provide a decent amount of options for
    those that want them and know how to use them.
     
    This in fact was/is one of the big failures of Windows 7, and in spite of
    our (beta testers) rantings and ravings about removing options, they
    stubbornly pushed ahead with dropping 'things' they darn well should have
    kept available, at least as optional. Windows Explorer for instance is a
    total mess in this regard, just as an example.
     
    --
    Art (artfudd) Folden
    ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
     
    "Bodhi Deb - MSFT" wrote in message
    news:e70f1375-3a97-474f-903b-205fb44a4b40...
    > Thanks Ken, you are correct about the folder sizes. We want to make all UI
    > as simple as possible for normal users and that sometimes means taking out
    > things. The folder sizes are one such change. We recommend that you back
    > up everything. Storage is cheap. If users want to exclude a particular
    > folder they probably already know about it and no need to show it in the
    > config wizard.
    >
    > Having said that, we the beta is for feedback such as this. So I highly
    > recommend everyone to test the product and open bugs, suggessions, feature
    > requests etc. Cannot guarantee that every feedback or suggestion will be
    > taken but they all go through due consideration in the team.
    >
    > -Bodhi
    >
    >
    > --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    > Bodhi Deb - MSFT
     
     
    Thursday, April 29, 2010 7:56 PM
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    Hi Bodhi, are there any plans to introduce configurable alerts per client - as was allowed using Toolkit v.1?

    I can see there are a number of suggestions on Connect relating to this, and personally, I would see this as a benefit to be able to specify different alert timescales for different machines, for example I do not need to know if my laptops have not been backed up for 5 days.

    Perhaps this is something that could be achieved through an add-in, rather than built into the product as standard?

    Your views and thoughts on how/whether this will be possible on Vail either directly or through an addin would be welcome.

    Thanks.

    Friday, April 30, 2010 3:55 PM
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    You can submit a suggestion to this effect on Connect; I'm sure that Microsoft is looking at whether this can (or should) be added to the product. But it was removed from the toolkit for a reason, likely that it was confusing and little used.
    I'm not on the WHS team, I just post a lot. :)
    Friday, April 30, 2010 5:14 PM
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    Ken, as mentioned in my earlier post, there are already suggestions to this effect on Connect - I don't think another one will add any value.  When the toolkit was out there with this functionality it probably was little used, as the user base, I imagine, was quite small at that time.  If it was removed for another reason then fine, also if it's going to confuse the general public then fine also - but I'd like to get some official word on this, particularly whether this is something that could be customised through a third party add-in.
    Friday, April 30, 2010 5:47 PM
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    Making the backup alerts configurable per PC is not in the plan. If there is a connect bug or suggestion open we will go through it along with all the feedback we receive during the beta. It does help if we see multiple bugs in the same area, or if a lot of people voted on it.

    cheers

    -Bodhi

    Bodhi Deb - MSFT
    Friday, April 30, 2010 5:53 PM
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    My understanding is the user who is logged into a given PC will get all the alerts for that PC, unless they are considered a network administrator (UI to come in our next milestone, but you can play around with the groups to change this, the names are somewhat obvious), then they get the alerts for the whole network.
     
    Sean
     
    This post is "AS IS" and confers no rights.
     
    "Ken Warren" wrote in message news:09ee8de5-e881-4a14-8162-1c3a1f3bcc0d...
    You can submit a suggestion to this effect on Connect; I'm sure that Microsoft is looking at whether this can (or should) be added to the product. But it was removed from the toolkit for a reason, likely that it was confusing and little used.
    I'm not on the WHS team, I just post a lot. :)
    Friday, April 30, 2010 5:54 PM
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    For the first, I don't make selections for backing up. I want to back up the entire computer. Probably, though, the folder size was dropped intentionally. It's not useful information; it tells you how big a folder is, but not how important it is.
    I know I am responding to your post quite a while after the fact I know, but I wanted to make a few comments. Making dismissive global statements about how useful information or functionality is, is a sign of a closed mind. I myself find folder sizes in WHSv1 very useful for configuring backups. For example, I have quite a few games installed, plus regularly install new ones. Two of my favorites, Batman Arkham Asylum and City of Heroes are both 3+GB. I see no need to back those up. Folder size helps me quickly choose what folders to exclude.
    Tuesday, July 20, 2010 1:46 AM