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Backup configuration RRS feed

  • Question

  • Hello everybody,

     

    My question is about the backup time. I cannot seem to find the option to have your backup being done on per weekly basis instead of daily. Personally as a home user a weekly backup would be more than suficient. By looking at the backup tab under settings I can only see start time and end time in hours, unless I am missing something. Is there anywhere the option to set the days as well?

     

    Thanks

    Tuesday, May 1, 2007 3:21 PM

Answers

  • Backup happens on a daily basis, and as of now there is no way to change it. But more importantly, there is no need to change it to weekly basis. Since it is an incremental backup, it backups only the data that has changed. More over, you can set the cleanup rules to tell home server how long to keep the weekly, monthly and daily backups.
    Tuesday, May 1, 2007 7:13 PM
    Moderator
  • there isn’t a way to make backups strictly manual or weekly

     

    I'd like to convince you that daily backups are the greatest thing since sliced bread J  it was our goal to make backups quick, small, and capable of being deleted (while being incremental

     

    Deep in the guts of WHS all our backup data is incremental – below the file level.  This technique is slick because it lets us lay down the contents of your files on the server in such a way that fragmentation is minimized.  Usually when a file system gets fragmented it’s due to lots of little files being created and deleted.  With our backup software we make just a few huge (4GB) files and do so linearly, as such these shouldn’t be causing you fragmentation problems. 

     

    For disk space used we’ve added a unique feature to allow backup sets to be deleted – while maintaining all the benefit of an incremental backup.  This means you’re not likely to hit a wall in a year with your disk space running out,  it also means should you be doing a video editing one night you can go to the server, delete that backup set in order to regain your disk space, and then exclude the video folder from being backed up in the future. 

     

    We also considered power usage – you can suspend or hibernate your client PC.  The backup software will wake up in the middle of the night and backup.  Should you be running on a laptop that isn’t plugged in that’s cool too – we just skip the backup that night to conserve your battery (if you’re plugged in we’ll do the backup)

     

    make sense?

    Wednesday, May 2, 2007 7:39 AM
  • JG, there's no difference between daily, weekly, and monthly backups as done by Windows Home Server. They're all effectively disk images, though they don't occupy the space of a disk image, due to the SIS-like backup database. See the Home Computer Backup white paper for more details.
    Friday, January 11, 2008 3:02 AM
    Moderator

All replies

  • I wanted the same thing originally, but there's really no harm in nightly backups.  After the first monster backup, the backups are quick and painless after that.  Nightly is nice as well so you don't get in trouble if your PC happens to be turned off when the weekly time rolls around.
    Tuesday, May 1, 2007 3:39 PM
  • Backup happens on a daily basis, and as of now there is no way to change it. But more importantly, there is no need to change it to weekly basis. Since it is an incremental backup, it backups only the data that has changed. More over, you can set the cleanup rules to tell home server how long to keep the weekly, monthly and daily backups.
    Tuesday, May 1, 2007 7:13 PM
    Moderator
  • But still, it would be nice to have the option of not using the automated backup. It takes a fair amount of space and fragmentation could be an issue at some point. Let me ask you this then, is there an option to turn off the auto feature and backing up manualy? At least i would be able to do it when i want, what i want and most important, i don't have to make sure my computers are on.
    Wednesday, May 2, 2007 7:09 AM
  • there isn’t a way to make backups strictly manual or weekly

     

    I'd like to convince you that daily backups are the greatest thing since sliced bread J  it was our goal to make backups quick, small, and capable of being deleted (while being incremental

     

    Deep in the guts of WHS all our backup data is incremental – below the file level.  This technique is slick because it lets us lay down the contents of your files on the server in such a way that fragmentation is minimized.  Usually when a file system gets fragmented it’s due to lots of little files being created and deleted.  With our backup software we make just a few huge (4GB) files and do so linearly, as such these shouldn’t be causing you fragmentation problems. 

     

    For disk space used we’ve added a unique feature to allow backup sets to be deleted – while maintaining all the benefit of an incremental backup.  This means you’re not likely to hit a wall in a year with your disk space running out,  it also means should you be doing a video editing one night you can go to the server, delete that backup set in order to regain your disk space, and then exclude the video folder from being backed up in the future. 

     

    We also considered power usage – you can suspend or hibernate your client PC.  The backup software will wake up in the middle of the night and backup.  Should you be running on a laptop that isn’t plugged in that’s cool too – we just skip the backup that night to conserve your battery (if you’re plugged in we’ll do the backup)

     

    make sense?

    Wednesday, May 2, 2007 7:39 AM
  • @remo67 - What's the big deal with nightly backups - I am finding that they take less than 15 minutes per PC.  That is pretty insignificant and one day it may save your bacon to have a file backed up if your HD crashes.
    Wednesday, May 2, 2007 2:54 PM
  • Chris,

    Makes perfect sense and I understand. I just wanted that kind of control but I guess my only other option would be to turn off the auto backup and just turn the thing on when i want to make a full backup. I have 7 machines in my home, all up and running and personally daily backup for me would be overkill and I would also hate to see my computers going on and off during the night. Btw i have one in the bedroom too Smile No stress mate, thank you for your support

    Wednesday, May 9, 2007 1:47 AM
  •  Chris Gray (WHS Team @ MSFT) wrote:

    there isn’t a way to make backups strictly manual or weekly

     

    What happens if you "Turn Off Backups" within the WHS Console? Would you still be able to make manual backups on demand?

     

     

     Chris Gray (WHS Team @ MSFT) wrote:

    Should you be running on a laptop that isn’t plugged in that’s cool too – we just skip the backup that night to conserve your battery (if you’re plugged in we’ll do the backup)

     

    This is something I've been trying to figure out what is happening. After installing the connector software on my laptop, I kept noticing that I would plug it in and start it up and the battery would be completely drained. The first couple of times, it just seemed odd and I didn't put 2 and 2 together. Then occasionally, I would notice it power up in the middle of the night because some LEDs on the wireless card would start blinking so I start thinking something is pulling it out of sleep. Assuming the connector software has to start up to find out that the machine isn't plugged in, how do you deal with things like power on passwords? Is this why my battery drains?

    Wednesday, May 9, 2007 3:12 AM
  • Chris,

     

      I think that the nightly backup concept is a great idea.  Initially I thought that it wouldn't work in my case because my latop connects wirelessly to my network.  I was very suprised that it acutally worked the first night.  However, after that I noticed that it wasn't working anymore.  The first night I was actually up messing around on the laptop when the backup started but after that night I wasn't using the laptop.  Upon noticing that the backups quit working I started looking around at the power settings and noticed that it was set to go into standby mode after 15 or 30 minutes even when it was plugged in.  When this setting was on the nightly backups never worked so I went ahead and set it so that it would never go into standby mode if it was plugged in.  At that point the backups started working again.  At the time I just figured that you couldn't let the machine go into standby like that.  But know after reading this post I guess I'm somewhat confused about it.  Have I missed something?

    Wednesday, May 9, 2007 3:15 AM
  • Well it seems that fragmentation it is an issue after all. See http://forums.microsoft.com/WindowsHomeServer/ShowPost.aspx?PostID=1615353&SiteID=50

    Any comments on that?

     

    Thanks

     

     

     

    Also free space gets fragmented as well. If you have multiple free areas your 4GB file would not be written in only one location. Just a thought

    Thursday, May 31, 2007 7:51 AM
  • I have 8 computers on my network and have adjusted the backup times to coincide with the times that the computers will be in use, thus avoiding any late night backups and I can turn off any computer that I don't want left idle all night. I have not had any problems with backup occurring while the pc is in use.
    Saturday, June 2, 2007 4:54 PM
  • Chris,

     

    I have 3 machines that get backup up nightly.  One is wired that works perfect.  The other two are wireless.  I noted that they need to be plugged in to be backed up.  The one wireless machine backs up perfectly, while the other never backs up even if plugged in.  I noticed last week that the unbacked up machine WAS being backup (and it was plugged in) and this week not at all even though plugged in).  Any ideas?

     

    Thursday, October 25, 2007 3:51 PM
  • Not sure if anyone is reading this, but I rebooted the laptop in question and it worked fine last night.

    Friday, October 26, 2007 6:36 PM
  • That is all very well. I understand all about cluster level  backup and why it makes daily backup a trivial concern but a very desirable solution.  What I need to know though is what is the difference, in terms of CONTENTS (not frequency, I know what daily, weekly, monthly mean)  between the three different periods of backup.  In settings we can configure  how many levels of each type to keep, but we are given no information (nothing in the Help or Forus on this) on which to base such a decision.  So what exactly IS the difference between a Daily, a Weekly and a Monthly backup apart from the period between them?

    I find it a far too common fault with Microsoft products that information is kept from the user as "not needed to know" but when things go wrong, or the defaults are not suitable, the end user is left to try and figure out how to fix things on his/her own. This sort of information should be in the help file. Don't just say "chose the number of weekly backups to retain" but give the criterion on which such a decision could be based.

    I suppose I'll have to wait for a couple of months to pass, log on to the Home Server machine (ignoring the warning) and wander round with a sector editor trying to figure out what is going on with the different back ups.  If I'm lucky however someone may know the answer and will post it here.

    JG
    Thursday, January 10, 2008 11:16 PM
  • JG, there's no difference between daily, weekly, and monthly backups as done by Windows Home Server. They're all effectively disk images, though they don't occupy the space of a disk image, due to the SIS-like backup database. See the Home Computer Backup white paper for more details.
    Friday, January 11, 2008 3:02 AM
    Moderator
  • Thanks Ken, the pointer to the White Paper was what I needed.  The point that wasn't clear to me before was that ALL backups are full backups, even though they are done incrementally. The answer is that a backup has two parts, the clusters that have been changed and need adding to the pool and the snapshot image which is a list of all the required clusters from the pool, whether backed up this ttime or previously.  This implies then that clusters are not just stored once but there may be several instances according to which of the kept periodic back-ups still need them.  The programming of the backup maintenance within WHS must be pretty hairy then.  This IS a bit that the end user does not need to know Smile

    JG
    Friday, January 11, 2008 11:31 AM
  • This thread might not be the right spot and if not I am sorry ....

     

    I need some help with nightly backups - it seemed to work properly for a while with my home theater machine - waking it up to back it up and then the machine would go back to sleep.

     

    Recently though I am getting notifications that it has not been backed up?

     

    Is there a log or test procedure I could follow to find out why WHS is not waking up my machine to back it up?

     

    Thanks for any help!

    Monday, January 14, 2008 2:18 AM
  •  Yupitsme wrote:

    This thread might not be the right spot and if not I am sorry ....

     

    I need some help with nightly backups - it seemed to work properly for a while with my home theater machine - waking it up to back it up and then the machine would go back to sleep.

     

    Recently though I am getting notifications that it has not been backed up?

     

    Is there a log or test procedure I could follow to find out why WHS is not waking up my machine to back it up?

     

    Thanks for any help!

     

    Have you tried backing it up manually?  Did you look at the event logs on your HTPC?

    Monday, January 14, 2008 2:50 AM
    Moderator
  • I have turned off automatic backup in favor of 2 reasons: First, I prefer not to run my computers overnight and second, weekly is routine enough for me. I have six machines connected to the server and leaving all six running all night every night is just way too much wasted energy and I personally think my computer parts will last longer if they dont run 24/7 (fans, hdd's). If you right click a computer in the computers tab, you have the option to turn off automatic backups and then you simply click backup now to run it manually whenever you are ready. Although if I did leave my computers all on, my furnace wouldnt kick on nearly as much..I still have 2 socket A athlon xp space heaters and a P4 3.0 portable furnace that still make good all purpose machines for kids.

     

    Monday, January 14, 2008 6:33 AM
  • Yupitsme wrote "my home theater machine - waking it up to back it up and then the machine would go back to sleep."

    I don't know home theatre and I am new to WHS but I did notice somewhere that it will not wake up a lap top if it is on battery, only if it is on mains. I mention this just in case it applies in your case too.

    Monday, January 14, 2008 3:58 PM