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big time data loss,please be aware. RRS feed

  • Question

  • well,possibly a little bug i've just noticed-the entire contents of my shared music folder,35 gigs of music,have become corrupted and unreadable. the files are still there,but al of the mp3's fail while beng played at various points,and any attempt to copy the files results in random crc data errors.

    a little background-running whs on an epia m10000 board,i gig of memory,(no overclock,bios defaults),and the whs main drive is a 250 gig on the onboard ide master. other drives are present,but have not been added to the storage pool.

    about 2 days ago,the console gave me a "drive failure" warning (main drive),system rebooted,did a chkdsk,and found some file errors which it said had been sucessfully repaired. today,i go to stream some music to my 360 while playing a game,and every song i try plays for a min or two and restarts at various points. btw,the harddrive in question is fine. all other data, (there weren't any other shared folder contents) and the operating system itself are 100% ok. also tested the drive in another computer,with manufacturer's tools,as well as other third party tools,just to make sure. no hardware errors at all,and no bad clusters or surface errors. the drive is only about 20 months old,and has only seen light duty as a storage drive.

    and that's it,bye bye 5 years of mp3's. did i have backups? nope,got rid of em while rearranging data on my other drives to make room. so,yes,data loss completely my fault (thank god i hadn't transferred any of my movie collection,or god forbid,mine or my gf's family pictures).however,i don't think that it was unreasonable of me to expect that a release client had a stable file system in place. if you happen to think that was an unreasonable expectation,i'm sorry to tell you,but it simply isn't -this isn't a beta folks,it's expected to ship within 6 months. while i certainly expected glitches (anyone else have logon.exe jamming at 100%,or the connect service doing the same for no apparent reason?) i didn't expect such a basic component of the product to be unstable,especially given what this is supposed to be: a safe and stable backup system for important and irreplaceable data.

    most of you reading this are in the same boat as me: your friends and family know that you're testing this software,they've heard you talk about it's many good points,and how it's very useful,especially for those ppl who don't have the knowledge to set such things up on their own,and they're waiting to hear if you'd recommend that they trust all those pictures and music and movies they've spent years collecting to it. and you're the guy they listen to when it comes to the mysterious computer stuff. you say it's good,they very well might buy it. you say it's not so good,they hold off.

    guess what i'm going to say?

    for myself,it's right back to my installation of server 2003 r2,at least i had the presence of mind to keep that drive untouched (that ran for over a year without a single glitch,at least that i can thank microsoft for) but for my family and friends,i'm going to have to say WHS is not something i'd recommend they go near for quite some time to come.
    Monday, July 2, 2007 11:59 PM

Answers

  • it's the customers fault his data was lost because he did'nt have backups.

    should everyone have backups,of course-does that make it his fault when an o.s. trashes his data? um,no. it just makes it his fault that he doesn't have backups. not like i lost my tax returns here,or pictures of my kid's first birthday. that stuff is backed up,as it should be.

    my man,if you aren't on microsoft's payroll by now,you should be,cause u have a microsoft mentality 100%,and the dev knowledge to go with it.
     
    Tuesday, July 3, 2007 12:59 AM

All replies

  • WHS is still in beta until it's released, it's just in the RC stage of the beta, it's not done yet. You also know that you should have had backups of critical data but you chose to roll the dice and lost. You have nobody to blame but yourself.

    You might want to look at data recovery software, you may be able to get some of that data back.


    Good luck...

    Tuesday, July 3, 2007 12:29 AM
  • uh,did you see me complain about the data loss? i admitted it's my fault,and as a matter of fact,i didn't ask for any help or suggestions on recovering the data. it's mp3's,not exactly difficult to replace. so please save the snarky comments and obvious recovery options, i'm just trying to let people know that the file system has some serious problems,even at this late stage.

    i will say one thing for you-obviously you dont know much about beta testing if you think a release client is the same as a beta. rc's are for ironing out interface details and interoperability issues,as well as minor last minute bugs. trying to fix major file system problems at this point would be like trying to separate the egg whites from a plate of scrambled eggs.

    Tuesday, July 3, 2007 12:44 AM
  •  jamima69 wrote:
    uh,did you see me complain about the data loss? i admitted it's my fault,and as a matter of fact,i didn't ask for any help or suggestions on recovering the data. it's mp3's,not exactly difficult to replace. so please save the snarky comments and obvious recovery options, i'm just trying to let people know that the file system has some serious problems,even at this late stage.

    i will say one thing for you-obviously you dont know much about beta testing if you think a release client is the same as a beta. rc's are for ironing out interface details and interoperability issues,as well as minor last minute bugs. trying to fix major file system problems at this point would be like trying to separate the egg whites from a plate of scrambled eggs.



    Yes. While you admit you should have had a backup you're still making excuses and trying to blame the RC.
    however,i don't think that it was unreasonable of me to expect that a release client had a stable file system in place. if you happen to think that was an unreasonable expectation,i'm sorry to tell you,but it simply isn't -this isn't a beta folks,it's expected to ship within 6 months.


    You don't have a clue what I know but good luck with that. Wink

    Tuesday, July 3, 2007 12:52 AM
  • it's the customers fault his data was lost because he did'nt have backups.

    should everyone have backups,of course-does that make it his fault when an o.s. trashes his data? um,no. it just makes it his fault that he doesn't have backups. not like i lost my tax returns here,or pictures of my kid's first birthday. that stuff is backed up,as it should be.

    my man,if you aren't on microsoft's payroll by now,you should be,cause u have a microsoft mentality 100%,and the dev knowledge to go with it.
     
    Tuesday, July 3, 2007 12:59 AM
  •  jamima69 wrote:
    jeez,i sure hope microsoft is paying you to care this much O.o


    Is that what you've been reduced to? Accusing me of working for MS? Grow up kid. The fact is, I've had my criticisms of WHS too, you're just too full of yourself because you think you know everything already. You don't know as much as you think you do. Big Smile

    BTW, I'm running 2 RC WHS servers and *MY* mp3's are all fine. I have backups of everything on WHS RC too. Imagine that? Wink

    Hope that helps...


    EDIT:
    If you think RC isn't still beta, I suggest you check the connect WHS home page.


    Welcome to Windows Home Server RC (Release Candidate)

    This Beta program is by invite only.

    Thank you for participating in the Microsoft Windows Home Server beta program. While the beta program is currently invite-only, we are granting you permission to publicly disclose and discuss Windows Home Server RC. Microsoft has created an open web forum at:

         http://forums.microsoft.com/WindowsHomeServer

    "beta" Big Smile




    Tuesday, July 3, 2007 1:04 AM
  • lol,sure are testy,arent we? i didnt even have a chance to edit my comment b4 u replied to it.

    btw,this "kid" is 32,and knows quite a bit about dev work,so puff your chest at someone else Stick out tongue


    and from the wiki:

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Release_candidate#Release_candidate

    Release candidate

    The term release candidate refers to a version with potential to be a final product, ready to release unless fatal bugs emerge. In this stage, the product features all designed functionalities and no known showstopper class bugs. At this phase the product is usually code complete.



    Tuesday, July 3, 2007 1:11 AM
  • 32 and your best shot is that I work for MS? Whatever you say, kid. Wink

    You losing your mp3's is not a showstopper, you're not that important. You COULD have been productive and provided TALQ CAB #s but no, you just had to whine instead.


    Good luck...


    Tuesday, July 3, 2007 1:13 AM
  •  you seem more concerned with my lost mp3's than i am O.o, i'm already downloading replacements.

    but you're right,i should know better than to feed the trolls-i really have to stop that,it's just a waste of time :/

    Tuesday, July 3, 2007 1:15 AM
  •  jamima69 wrote:
    you're right,i should know better than to feed the trolls-i really have to stop that,it's just a waste of time :/


    Amateur psychology won't work with me either, kid. Big Smile

    You did notice that your wiki quote had the qualifier, "potential" and "unless" right? Wink

    You're not very good at this...
    Tuesday, July 3, 2007 1:19 AM
  • LMAO,i'm not playing anymore troll,sorry Sad

    all said tho,i really hope ms gets their act together on this,i'm just afraid it's going to take awhile longer. when it works,whs fills a much needed niche,and hopefully with a few service packs it will become both useful and reliable.

    and now,off to ruin my ratios Sad
    Tuesday, July 3, 2007 1:26 AM
  • It's OK kid, you've been spanked and now you can wipe your tears. Big Smile

    Again, you could have been productive and provided TALQ CAB #'s so the WHS team could look into it but instead you show what a great beta tester you are. Stick out tongue

    Thanks for all of your help! Now that you've whined we all know where you stand in regards to WHS. MS must be doomed now. I hope the stock market survives, after your stunning critique. Big Smile

    It's OK, that mean ol' WHS wont hide in your closet (unless that's where you put it) I'm sure the WHS team will dump all of the code and start over since you've lost data, somehow.

    Hope that helps...

    Tuesday, July 3, 2007 1:35 AM
  • Good advice there jamima!

     

    Here is a snip from Jamima69- "about 2 days ago,the console gave me a "drive failure" warning (main drive),system rebooted,did a chkdsk,and found some file errors, which it said had been sucessfully repaired. today,i go to stream some music to my 360 while playing a game,and every song i try plays for a min or two and restarts at various points. btw,the harddrive in question is fine. all other data, (there weren't any other shared folder contents) and the operating system itself are 100% ok. also tested the drive in another computer,with manufacturer's tools,as well as other third party tools,just to make sure. no hardware errors at all,and no bad clusters or surface errors. the drive is only about 20 months old,and has only seen light duty as a storage drive."

     

    This may be RC1 but, I gotta feeling, we will see at least 2 more RC candidates before this puppy hits the streets. Especially since it is for helping to ensure data backup.

     

    I just want to say, at least from reading this and also from what happened to me Saturday...be careful with chkdsc!

     

    My story is a bit different. I saw a WHS expired message with 0 days left. So, I thought big deal, I'll just scarf another key. First thing I did though, was make sure that this was not some kind of "glitch" as I thought I had read that this warning can *on occasion* just go away on it's own.

    So, I rebooted the PC that I "administer" the WHS- my main PC. Upon reboot, the boot drive (C) goes into chcdsk and tears up the world fixing problems. Then it completes and the system restarts.

     

    Oooopsss! I got a failure to boot from disc error...TWICE.. I am like oh boy, this puppy is waving bye bye. No worries, I have the WHS recovery CD.

     

    I fire that up and take a look and the damn thing, and select my latest backup as the source. I almost hit the button, until I notice it has my external USB J drive as the destination! Not to mention, it does not even show a C drive anywhere! The J drive is where I have all my digital photos (translation: the WIFES digital photos.)  Luckily, I have also stored these on yet another external HDD-which is unplugged and sitting in another place.

     

    Still, now I am nervous as a tick, so I hit the "advanced" tab. Everything is there but, for whatever reason,  my system no longer sports a C drive. But, I do have a primary drive partition showing, of the right size, but with no freakin drive letter! I am able to format it and then do some drive lettter musical chairs in the disc administration and regain the primary as C again. I reload with the restore tool and now my system is up and running perfect again for the next 2 days.  PLUS the Home server will expire in 0 days disappeared. *coughs*

     

    What happened? I have no idea. Did I cause a problem? Probably! Was I able to recover? Yes. Could I have wiped out several years of digital photos? Hell yes.

     

    BE CAREFUL WITH THIS OS! Make backups even though we are on RC versions!

     

    In summary- Even when this thing is RTM you are really taking a risk if you don't read the disclaimer and keep copies off the server, even offsite! Nothing is foolproof. If you don't, there is no one to blame but yourself. Also, think twice before you let CHKDSK run.

     

    Having said that, I was able to pull out of it. But, now I have a few more grey hairs.


     

    Tuesday, July 3, 2007 1:45 AM
  • ah yes,the true measure of a troll,the less u feed em,the more vocal they get Wink

    is your itsy bitsy tummy empty, you cute little troll?  *pats troll on the head*

    consider this a free snack,but i really do have other stuff to do. you can continue if you like tho,i'm sure others reading this thread will have a laugh.

    g'night now Smile

    Tuesday, July 3, 2007 1:48 AM
  • I agree, I think we'll see RC2 or another RC "build" depending on the schema. Wink

    So, what you're saying is, this is still beta software and that you should always have backups of critical data? Big Smile

    Beta testing can cause a few gray hairs...but so can these kids today. Stick out tongue


    Tuesday, July 3, 2007 1:53 AM
  • @ dan bell

    ohhhh-absolutely right-pherhaps the chkdsk screwed the file data,given the way whs has the shares set up. i wouldn't think that to be the case,especially when the chkdsk was scheduled by the os,but i can see where it could be the case. damn nasty thing to be happening at this late stage,imho. btw, i was getting those "0 days left" messages as well. i just ignored them,and they went away on their own within a few hours,but thanks for reminding me,i did forget to mention that. i just put it down to rc glitches. but there it is.

    glad to hear you got your data back tho,that's def a good thing Smile i'm sticking with old dependable r2 myself Wink
    Tuesday, July 3, 2007 1:53 AM
  • Dude, What I am saying is..just like the disclaimer. Always keep a backup of your vital data somewhere OTHER than the WHS. Preferrably offsite.
    Tuesday, July 3, 2007 1:56 AM
  •  jamima69 wrote:
    ah yes,the true measure of a troll,the less u feed em,the more vocal they get

    is your itsy bitsy tummy empty, you cute little troll? *pats troll on the head*

    consider this a free snack,but i really do have other stuff to do. you can continue if you like tho,i'm sure others reading this thread will have a laugh.

    g'night now



    I already told you that your amateur psychology wont work with me. Your mouth wrote checks that your rear cant cash. You're supposed to be helping beta test WHS but you don't run TALQ and submit the CAB #'s, you just whine about how you had a problem. You didn't help at all. Instead you keep trying to make this about me and that dog wont hunt, kid.

    Run away kid, run away, you know you were wrong and you have nothing to defend yourself with. It IS beta software and just because you've had problems doesn't make it a WHS problem. Perhaps we'd know more if you weren't all about whining and blaming others for your mistakes.

    Nice try kid...

    Tuesday, July 3, 2007 1:58 AM
  • Hahhahah! Not as glad as I am to not lose anything. BTW, whenever you can, those of us on Office, make you up a PST file of the email! I have already screwed up twice doing a restore and forgetting to make a backup of my email from that day. This is another way to get in the doghouse with your significant other!!!

     

    For the WHS team- at least I was able to recover. This product has some nice back up options. I mean, I could have had a disc failure and WHS got me back up quick. You just gotta make sure your fingers are not faster than your brain on restore.

     

    I guess this thing reminds me a bit of the transition from DOS to Windows for workgroups. You can wreak havoc with a mouse. In DOS, you had to know what you were doing. With ease of use comes responsibility. And taking your time.

    Tuesday, July 3, 2007 1:59 AM
  •  Dan Bell wrote:

    Hahhahah! Not as glad as I am to not lose anything. BTW, whenever you can, those of us on Office, make you up a PST file of the email! I have already screwed up twice doing a restore and forgetting to make a backup of my email from that day. This is another way to get in the doghouse with your significant other!!!



    You might look at this:
    http://office.microsoft.com/en-us/outlook/HA010875321033.aspx
    It works with 2007 too, just what you need. Wink

    Tuesday, July 3, 2007 2:07 AM
  • Thank you SME- Unfortuantely, I am on Office 2000.  I love the interface it provides. I tried 2003 and I just could not get used to it.  All I have to do is use the backup tool in Outlook 2000 and save it to my G drive, then my external WD picks it up using Retrospect.
    Tuesday, July 3, 2007 2:15 AM
  • Did you try pfbackup to see if it would work anyway? Wink

    Tuesday, July 3, 2007 2:16 AM
  • well,just to state it,the chkdsk on my system was scheduled and performed automatically by the os,it def wasn't something i undertook on my own.

    like i said,not exactly critical data tho,mp3's are about as difficult to replace as air these days. i'm actually trying to go with flac this time around Wink i was hoping for more stability from an rc,but it is what it is-i suppose i'll check back in 6 months and see what progress has been made.


    Tuesday, July 3, 2007 2:24 AM
  •  jamima69 wrote:
    well,just to state it,the chkdsk on my system was scheduled and performed automatically by the os,it def wasn't something i undertook on my own.

    like i said,not exactly critical data tho,mp3's are about as difficult to replace as air these days. i'm actually trying to go with flac this time around i was hoping for more stability from an rc,but it is what it is-i suppose i'll check back in 6 months and see what progress has been made.




    It really isn't important that it was scheduled automatically. The thing is, it did it because it found errors, which it fixed, therefore the corrupt data. What we need to know is what caused the errors that it fixed? Were you editing mp3 tags? That's known to corrupt mp3 files. Was there a reboot during balancing? If you had ran talq and submitted the CAB numbers then the devs could have looked but I'm guessing it's already too late. Wink

    Yes, while a mp3 can be replaced, it's never a good idea to trust critical data to beta software. Backups are your friend. Beta tests aren't about free stable pre-release software, they're about helping to provide a better product, for the community. Again, thanks for your contribution.

    Hope that helps...

    Tuesday, July 3, 2007 2:47 AM
  • I'm sorry I am late to this thread, I see everyone got a little upset early on.  I need to remind people that these forums HAVE to be respectful.  I really like everyone that has been contributing to the Windows Home Server forum and I would like to keep them around. 

     

    As to the problem, if your drive showed unhealthy, then it's possible your drive became physically corrupt and Windows Home Server was warning you.  Chckdsk can help resolve bad sectors and move files as a work around.  Did you have folder duplication enabled on the folders that had corrupt information?  If something in Windows Home Server is corrupting data this is a really big deal and we need your help resolving this. 

    Tuesday, July 3, 2007 7:22 PM
    Moderator
  • I think he's already switched back to win2k3 r2, I've mentioned TalQ.exe and the CAB#s more than once. He never really gave any useful information, all he wanted to do is try to make it about me, which failed. I tried. Big Smile

    Tuesday, July 3, 2007 7:34 PM