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Can the misleading Bold button in the MSDN forums be removed RRS feed

  • Question

  • It gives in the edited code a bold text but does not show the text in bold.

    Thanks


    Success
    Cor


    Sunday, October 14, 2012 9:54 AM

Answers

  • Thank you to Sipla and Derosnec for writing this out like a bug. Often it takes a long time before we can get enough information to explain an issue in depth, which is exactly what bug writing is. Bug writing is an art form (arguably), and you guys have it. The sooner we get to details like these the sooner I can submit a bug request.

    So I'm submitting a bug request now.

    And for the record, I just voted Derosnec's posts as helpful, twice. Yes, I do that. =^)

    And no I'm not going to create non-Microsoft accounts in order to run through all the possible test cases. That's not my job (and I'm not asking anyone here to run through a dozen test cases either). But I'll submit it to someone who does have that job.

    Thank you!


    Ed Price (a.k.a User Ed), SQL Server Customer Program Manager (Blog, Twitter, Wiki)





    Wednesday, November 7, 2012 5:42 PM
  • Hi,
    I hope that one day we will also be able to use bold and italic again in the Technet Exchange Forums here and here 


    Martina Miskovic

    • Marked as answer by Cor Ligthert Wednesday, November 21, 2012 4:27 PM
    Wednesday, November 21, 2012 5:45 AM

All replies

  • This is test of the Bold button.

    This is another test.

    The behavior above is as expected before I click "Submit". Perhaps the behavior is different in TechNet than MSDN.


    Richard Mueller - MVP Directory Services

    Sunday, October 14, 2012 4:57 PM
  • I try to use the MSDN branding exclusively as I don't like the Technet branding. I've noticed at times some flakeyness in the bold button results but seems only when I was expanding or reducing a bold selection.

     

     

     


    Regards, Dave Patrick ....
    Microsoft Certified Professional
    Microsoft MVP [Windows]

    Disclaimer: This posting is provided "AS IS" with no warranties or guarantees , and confers no rights.

    Sunday, October 14, 2012 5:26 PM
  • Richard,

    This forum has the presentation from before 16th of august. Try a developers forum which has a new kind of 1995 look. 

    Beside that you recognise it because it has a new button "File a Bug" the only thing I recognise which is good in it.



    Success
    Cor



    Sunday, October 14, 2012 6:34 PM
  • First, please link to a thread. Then I can test the bold in that thread.

    Thanks!


    Ed Price (a.k.a User Ed), SQL Server Customer Program Manager (Blog, Twitter, Wiki)

    Tuesday, October 16, 2012 5:10 AM
  • http://social.msdn.microsoft.com/Forums/en-US/vbgeneral/thread/b08c761d-e294-408b-8738-790b1baeaafe

    Be aware the editor shows it in bold but the result is not bold.


    Success
    Cor

    Tuesday, October 16, 2012 10:22 PM
  • Looks fantastic to me:

    http://social.msdn.microsoft.com/Forums/en-US/vbgeneral/thread/b08c761d-e294-408b-8738-790b1baeaafe

    I think this is fixed.

    Thanks!


    Ed Price (a.k.a User Ed), SQL Server Customer Program Manager (Blog, Twitter, Wiki)

    Wednesday, October 31, 2012 10:08 PM
  • Not fixed. Last two replies in that thread do not show bold where they should.

    See:
    http://social.microsoft.com/Forums/en-US/reportabug/thread/52e01930-4182-41cd-ab5e-06f68d72f520

    which should not be marked as answered because it isn't.

    Thursday, November 1, 2012 4:28 AM
  • I can see it in every one of these threads and every one of these brands. The issue seems to be that some people don't like the way bold appears on these fonts. Sometimes it's hard to see. But it's still there: Bold. Not bold. Bold. Not bold. Bold.

    That's By Design. But you can submit your feedback via the Site Feedback links at the bottom of those pages.

    Thanks!


    Ed Price (a.k.a User Ed), SQL Server Customer Program Manager (Blog, Twitter, Wiki)


    Saturday, November 3, 2012 11:01 AM
  • The difference between bold text and normal text should be nearly the same in the editor as in the posted text.  I can easily see the difference in the editor.  I cannot detect the slightest difference in the posted text. This is not personal preference - the bolding just isn't there.

    Saturday, November 3, 2012 12:36 PM
  • Hi Ed,

    Visual Studio LightSwitch - General Questions is one of the forums that do not display bold or italic. It's been that way since the dreadful "new" format was applied to the foum.

    This thread contains a reply from me that uses both bold & italic, but neither show when viewing the thread.

    Here is how the reply looks to me after it was posted:

    Thanks for looking into this for everyone.


    Yann - LightSwitch Central - Click here for FREE Themes, Controls, Types and Commands
     
    Please click "Mark as Answer" if a reply answers your question. Please click "Vote as Helpful" , if you find a reply helpful.
     
    By doing this you'll help others to find answers faster.

    Tuesday, November 6, 2012 10:36 AM
  • I'm not sure what's going on here.

    I cannot repro this issue:

    http://social.msdn.microsoft.com/Forums/en-US/lightswitch/thread/54338ac5-5e40-4375-ba53-f90a067d5a39


    Ed Price (a.k.a User Ed), SQL Server Customer Program Manager (Blog, Twitter, Wiki)

    Tuesday, November 6, 2012 6:48 PM
  • I am seeing your entries exactly the same. Also, after I switched to bold in my test where was no way to switch back to not bold. I suspect I can fix it in HTML, but I wanted to remove bold using designer and first button didn't switch bold back to normal.

    For every expert, there is an equal and opposite expert. - Becker's Law


    My blog

    Tuesday, November 6, 2012 7:05 PM
  • I cannot repro this issue:

    http://social.msdn.microsoft.com/Forums/en-US/lightswitch/thread/54338ac5-5e40-4375-ba53-f90a067d5a39


    There is no bold anywhere in that thread when viewed in IE9 with Vista. This is the HTML for your post:

    <div class="body"><p>Testing:</p>
    <p><strong>Bold</strong>. Not bold. <strong>Bold</strong>. Not bold. <strong>Bold</strong>.</p>
    <hr class="sig"><p>Ed Price (a.k.a User Ed), SQL Server Customer Program Manager (<a href="Bloghttp://blogs.msdn.com/User_Ed">Blog</a>,
    <a href="Twitterhttp://twitter.com/UserEd_">Twitter</a>, <a href="http://social.technet.microsoft.com/wiki/contents/articles/4135.aspx">
    Wiki</a>)</p>
    </div>

    It's apparent that <strong> has been disabled. It needs to be re-enabled.

    Tuesday, November 6, 2012 8:23 PM
  • But why can you not see it, but I can see it? Do some browsers force <strong> to be enabled?

    Ed Price (a.k.a User Ed), SQL Server Customer Program Manager (Blog, Twitter, Wiki)

    Tuesday, November 6, 2012 9:27 PM
  • I am looking in Google Chrome.

    For every expert, there is an equal and opposite expert. - Becker's Law


    My blog

    Tuesday, November 6, 2012 9:31 PM
  • Hi,
    I don't see the bold text either.
    It is the same problem in the Technet Exchange Forums since they got the "new design".
    Example thread here . My answer there has both bold and Italic text, but it doesn't show.


    Martina Miskovic

    Wednesday, November 7, 2012 12:35 AM
  • I've checked your example thread in IE9, Google Chrome, FireFox and Opera and I don't see bold and italics in each of these browsers. The text is plain in all browsers I tested.

    For every expert, there is an equal and opposite expert. - Becker's Law


    My blog

    Wednesday, November 7, 2012 1:30 AM
  • Thanks Naomi for confirming that bold and italic doesn't show.
    It's kind of interesting that they do show up in the email alerts but not in the Forum. I hope that it can be fixed cause I find them very usefull.

    Martina Miskovic

    Wednesday, November 7, 2012 1:42 AM
  • Both Bold & Italic disappeared from the forum when the "new" format was applied to certain forums.

    This forum doesn't have the new format, it still has the previous (& much better) format.

    Maybe becuase you're a Microsoft employee? Try logging on with a non-MS account?


    Yann - LightSwitch Central - Click here for FREE Themes, Controls, Types and Commands
     
    Please click "Mark as Answer" if a reply answers your question. Please click "Vote as Helpful" , if you find a reply helpful.
     
    By doing this you'll help others to find answers faster.

    Wednesday, November 7, 2012 2:44 AM
  • But why can you not see it, but I can see it? Do some browsers force <strong> to be enabled?

    It's probably not the browser that is removing any action for <strong>.  It is clearly related to the recent upgrades, even though it doesn't affect everyone.  Most likely it is somehow getting redefined in the page setup, but I don't know enough about how these actions are controlled to be able to suggest where this is happening.

    Wednesday, November 7, 2012 3:04 AM
  • The issue seems to be that some people don't like the way bold appears on these fonts. Sometimes it's hard to see.

    This is not the issue. On some locale-brand configurations, the effect of <strong> tags is completely ignored in the style sheet, I checked. By "some" I mean en-US and MSDN. This was the pair I (and no doubt many others) used until layout update.

    Since there still seems to be some misunderstanding on the whole issue, I created a handy dandy chart to look at.

    This is from the Chart Controls FAQ thread. (this link goes to the MSDN en-US version)

    (For a non-resized image, try this link (you'll spot the typo too if you're caReful). (This should be added to the image automatically with the add-image feature))

    As you can see, there are no less than four (4) different looks (not counting right-to-left-languages etc.) of the same thread depending on where you are from and whether you are a "developer", "techie" or a nondescript user (+ exceptions like this Forum Issues forum). Technet and "no branding" seem to look the same on both locales.

    • Edited by sipla Wednesday, November 7, 2012 3:00 PM
    Wednesday, November 7, 2012 1:43 PM
  • It's probably not the browser that is removing any action for <strong>.  It is clearly related to the recent upgrades, even though it doesn't affect everyone.  Most likely it is somehow getting redefined in the page setup, but I don't know enough about how these actions are controlled to be able to suggest where this is happening.

    So the idea is that my account setup (and those who see Bold plainly) is different than yours? 

    Thank you to Naomi for testing. It's not a browser issue. 


    Ed Price (a.k.a User Ed), SQL Server Customer Program Manager (Blog, Twitter, Wiki)

    Wednesday, November 7, 2012 5:30 PM
  • Thank you to Sipla and Derosnec for writing this out like a bug. Often it takes a long time before we can get enough information to explain an issue in depth, which is exactly what bug writing is. Bug writing is an art form (arguably), and you guys have it. The sooner we get to details like these the sooner I can submit a bug request.

    So I'm submitting a bug request now.

    And for the record, I just voted Derosnec's posts as helpful, twice. Yes, I do that. =^)

    And no I'm not going to create non-Microsoft accounts in order to run through all the possible test cases. That's not my job (and I'm not asking anyone here to run through a dozen test cases either). But I'll submit it to someone who does have that job.

    Thank you!


    Ed Price (a.k.a User Ed), SQL Server Customer Program Manager (Blog, Twitter, Wiki)





    Wednesday, November 7, 2012 5:42 PM
  • So the idea is that my account setup (and those who see Bold plainly) is different than yours? 

    I doubt that it could be related to account setup, and I am not speculating on what the differences between users is.    The HTML at that point has the <strong>, but for some reason, for that page, for some users, <strong> is not being interpreted by the renderer and the text is not changng.  I assume that happens because there is some prior process occurring in the page display that disables the effect of <strong> - it is somehow being redefined to nothing. There are many things that are different between users in that process.  But it's that prior process, not the HTML as such, that causes the bold to disappear for those users, and it's likely that's what changed in the latest upgrade.   But only those who know what they changed, and who know how these changes affect the interpretation of <strong> by the renderer, who could point to the actual cause.


    • Edited by Acamar Wednesday, November 7, 2012 8:15 PM sp
    Wednesday, November 7, 2012 8:11 PM
  • @Amcar

    Yes, I agree with what you're saying. I don't think of this as a bug per se, but as a deliberate choice that MS made, to to make forums "match" the new (ex) Metro guidelines. The new format has also transformed the user's name & the sign out "button" into CAPITALS, which looks like SHOUTING.

    The only reason it varies from forum to forum is that some forums/countries haven't been set to the new format. The reason it varies from person to person in the same forum (& same language setting - en-US/un-AU etc) could possibly be that the account that can see bold/italic is a Microsoft account, but I can't test that theory.

    I read and/or answer a LOT of questions (though not as many as Naomi, she's a machine!). This new format has made that extremely difficult. Like many others I wish they'd bring back the older, easier to read format, not just allow bold & italic to be shown again (not just remove the formatting buttons). The readability problem goes far beyond just bold & italic.


    Yann - LightSwitch Central - Click here for FREE Themes, Controls, Types and Commands
     
    Please click "Mark as Answer" if a reply answers your question. Please click "Vote as Helpful" , if you find a reply helpful.
     
    By doing this you'll help others to find answers faster.

    • Proposed as answer by Naomi N Thursday, November 8, 2012 1:27 PM
    • Unproposed as answer by Cor Ligthert Thursday, November 8, 2012 4:38 PM
    Thursday, November 8, 2012 5:37 AM
  • Naomi,

    I did not see that this was one of the first threads which I own, so I should mark your proposal as answer.

    Although I agree very much with Yann that setting all formats back to the old format until that new one is not anymore such a mass (I think people are not even reporting bugs about those anymore because it are to much) I don't follow your proposal.

    The only browser I see that new forums seems to go well is on Safire on an IPad. On Windows 8 with IE10 are even worse than on the browsers you've tested.

    This bad situation is reported starting on 16 August (this is only one of the bugs and because it seems impossible for Microsoft to repair all those bugs, I've asked to remove this one and not mislead everybody).

    Better is of course to set (temporally at least) the old forum design back.


    Success
    Cor




    Thursday, November 8, 2012 4:37 PM
  • I'm going to check on the status of this bug request.

    Thanks!


    Ed Price (a.k.a User Ed), SQL Server Customer Program Manager (Blog, Twitter, Wiki)

    Monday, November 19, 2012 11:47 PM
  • Hi Ed,

    It looks to me (at least in the LightSwitch forum) that bold & italics have finally been restored!

    Thanks for sticking with this issue & getting it sorted out.


    Yann - LightSwitch Central - Click here for FREE Themes, Controls, Types and Commands
     
    Please click "Mark as Answer" if a reply answers your question. Please click "Vote as Helpful" , if you find a reply helpful.
     
    By doing this you'll help others to find answers faster.

    Wednesday, November 21, 2012 5:39 AM
  • Hi,
    I hope that one day we will also be able to use bold and italic again in the Technet Exchange Forums here and here 


    Martina Miskovic

    • Marked as answer by Cor Ligthert Wednesday, November 21, 2012 4:27 PM
    Wednesday, November 21, 2012 5:45 AM
  • Bug 85328 was filed.

    This should be resolved now.

    Please verify.

    Thanks!


    Ed Price (a.k.a User Ed), SQL Server Customer Program Manager (Blog, Twitter, Wiki)

    Thursday, November 22, 2012 1:22 AM
  • Confirmed OK in the thread I reported here:
    http://social.microsoft.com/Forums/en-US/reportabug/thread/52e01930-4182-41cd-ab5e-06f68d72f520

    Thank you for you effort in getting this sorted.

    Thursday, November 22, 2012 1:43 AM
  • Please verify

    It seems to be fixed in the per thread view. Thanks.

    However the thread list view still doesn't make a distinction between read threads, unread threads and threads that have unread posts. Again the markup is there (the css classes viewed and hasUnread) but it has no effect.)

    Slightly OT, it's amazing how many different looks MSFT forums have. Some forums are MSDN only (If you try to change to social.technet, it forces you back to social.msdn. But if you change to technet while looking at a single thread, you can!) Even forums under the same brand look different depending on the product they're for (Not only the background and logo). Some products have a completely different domain such as silverlight and asp.net. Of course these look different altogether. I'm not sure all this is intentional, or whether it is a good idea if it is.

    Thursday, November 22, 2012 10:20 AM