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Remote connection to PC, should handle all versions of XP and Vista, especially home versions

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From the FAQ section of these forums, there is mention of how to enable remote connection to PC. First, it says that you must manually enable remote connection.

You can enable remote connection by:

Right clicking My Computer
Click properties
Clicking the remote tab
Checking the box for Remote Desktop
Click OK

Then it says you must have the right version of Windows:

The following editions of Windows support Remote connection (remote desktop):

Windows Vista Ultimate
Windows Vista Enterprise
Windows Vista Business
Windows XP Professional
Windows XP Media Center Edition
Windows XP Tablet

My suggestions are two-fold:

Automatically enable the remote connection (or offer to enable it) when running the Connect CD on the PC.

Support remote connection to the most likely versions found in the home, namely:

Windows XP Home

Windows Vista Home Basic

Windows Vista Home Premium

This second suggestion probably requires loading a certain Terminal Services component, but I really don't understand why this remote connection feature is touted as a feature of WHS, but won't be useful for a majority of the home users out there. As it stands, home users are unlikely to have any of the business versions, or XP Pro versions. That leaves just the MCE being able to be remotely controlled. Certainly you want support for XP Home, Vista Home Basic and Vista Home Premium?
Tuesday, February 13, 2007 5:23 PM

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Hi,

I agree that adding Remote Desktop functionality to Windows Vista and Windows XP Home may be a compelling feature for the Windows Home Server Connector software - but I doubt we'll see it happen...

It's an interesting idea though. I've gone ahead and filed this as feedback on Connect. If you believe in it - vote on it. The product team will ultimately make a decision.

https://connect.microsoft.com/WindowsHomeServer/feedback/ViewFeedback.aspx?FeedbackID=257823

Justin

Tuesday, February 13, 2007 11:30 PM

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The solution is dependent upon what features ship in the various editions of Windows XP and Windows Vista. The following editions:

Windows XP Home
Windows Vista Home Basic
Windows Vista Home Premium

Do not ship with the Remote Desktop functionality.
Tuesday, February 13, 2007 7:53 PM
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I find that troubling especially for Vista Home Premium users. Just a suggestion, but couldn't you install/allow Remote Desktop if WHS client is connected to a Windows Home Server. Thats valueadd, another reason to get WHS.

Tuesday, February 13, 2007 9:05 PM
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I understand the technical reasoning behind it, but I don't understand it from a product perspective.

You have a Windows Home Server that cannot connect remotely to Windows XP Home, Windows Vista Home Basic, or Windows Vista Home Premium. And those are the most likely OSes in the home... so what benefit will Mr. and Mrs. John Q. Public find in having this 'remote access' touted on their WHS product, but only if they have Professional, Business, Enterprise or Ultimate versions of the OSes.

This is a suggestion forum, so I'm suggesting that you may want to find a technical solution to allow this. The connector CD, for example, could load the necessary components to each of the home OSes to allow the remote connection... couldn't it?

Tuesday, February 13, 2007 10:58 PM
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Hi,

I agree that adding Remote Desktop functionality to Windows Vista and Windows XP Home may be a compelling feature for the Windows Home Server Connector software - but I doubt we'll see it happen...

It's an interesting idea though. I've gone ahead and filed this as feedback on Connect. If you believe in it - vote on it. The product team will ultimately make a decision.

https://connect.microsoft.com/WindowsHomeServer/feedback/ViewFeedback.aspx?FeedbackID=257823

Justin

Tuesday, February 13, 2007 11:30 PM
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By the way, there is an open Connect feedback item on auto-enabling Remote Desktop on Windows SKUs that support it, for those who are interested:

https://connect.microsoft.com/WindowsHomeServer/feedback/ViewFeedback.aspx?FeedbackID=257541

Justin

Tuesday, February 13, 2007 11:31 PM
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I agree with Blaine here.

It defeats the purpose of having WHS if it doesn't effectively support the Home range OSes. Giving the option for "remote access" when setting up an user account is just a tease when largely many home PCs are still come pre-installed with XP Home, Vista Home Basic or Vista Home Premium.

Wednesday, February 14, 2007 12:19 AM

Justin M. Harrison wrote:

Hi,

I agree that adding Remote Desktop functionality to Windows Vista and Windows XP Home may be a compelling feature for the Windows Home Server Connector software - but I doubt we'll see it happen...

It's an interesting idea though. I've gone ahead and filed this as feedback on Connect. If you believe in it - vote on it. The product team will ultimately make a decision.

https://connect.microsoft.com/WindowsHomeServer/feedback/ViewFeedback.aspx?FeedbackID=257823

Justin

This would be something i'd really like to see. I never really understood why the Home versions lacked this feature. I doubt we will ever see this with XP Home, but Vista seems to be modular enough to enable this - but i have no idea on how much work it would really be.

Wednesday, February 14, 2007 2:11 PM

asty1 wrote:

By the way, there is an open Connect feedback item on auto-enabling Remote Desktop on Windows SKUs that support it, for those who are interested:

https://connect.microsoft.com/WindowsHomeServer/feedback/ViewFeedback.aspx?FeedbackID=257541

Justin

I get a page not found sir.

Wednesday, February 14, 2007 4:48 PM

I'm having he same problem as Brothernod, is it because we are not part of the beta?

Voicing my agreement. If the only way to connect to a store bought version of WHS is through remote desktop and as a result it is only possible to connect to WHS using XP pro, Vista Ultimate and Vista Business, that will definitely be a large selling hinderance. Not only did I spend $$$ on buying a store built WHS, but now I have to upgrade my Vista Home Premium to use it.

Wednesday, February 14, 2007 8:29 PM

Let me clarify the behavior because there is some confusion.

First, connection to the home server can be made from any browser... that is not the issue. Users that are authorized to access the WHS remotely will then be allowed to login. From that session you can view a list of files in the shared folders and can upload and download, you can connect and manage the server, etc. All this functionality is there regardless of the OS you are using.

At issue is the ability to directly connect to various PCs on your network. WHS has the ability to let you remotely connect to any of the PCs in the house as if you were logged onto that PC. This is very useful for many reasons, diagnosing problems, getting documents off of local PCs, etc. However, this remote connection only works if the PCs in your house are running Vista Business, XP Pro, Vista Enterprise, Vista Ultimate, etc. which are all less likely in the home environment.

So don't worry, remote connection to the server is there, but not just to the client PCs (unless they have the correct OSes).

Wednesday, February 14, 2007 8:40 PM

BlaineMVP wrote:

Let me clarify the behavior because there is some confusion.

So don't worry, remote connection to the server is there, but not just to the client PCs (unless they have the correct OSes).

So let me see if I have this correct. If I am in a remote location, I will be able to access the WHS through the internet, however, once I connect to WHS I will only be able to remote connect to a PC version of windows that has remote connection software.

Not as annoying, but I could see where it could cause problems. Thanks for the clarification.

Wednesday, February 14, 2007 8:56 PM

I know I'm pretty much just chiming to say I agree... but heck I really do agree. We have 3 machines in our house not counting our WHS box. While our laptops both run Media and Pro, our main machine(as most purchase desktops are the last few years), runs Windows Home. So that means no remote connectivity to our main desktop machine.

That makes ZERO sense that Windows HOME Server can't remote desktop to a machine running Windows HOME.

MS needs to make it happen here.

Monday, February 19, 2007 11:11 PM

I know it's unlikely to happen but perhaps if the Home Server devs talk to some higher up's at Microsoft then perhaps before RTM the software thats installed on the client side can include the remote connection features.

Tuesday, February 20, 2007 9:39 PM

To all those who desire remote access to their computers that are not running MCE, XP Pro, Vista Business or Ultimate my suggestion is to look into using an alternative such as LogMeIn. I really don't see Microsoft making it happen through the installation of the WHS Connector application. I've used the MS RDP client to connect to my XP Pro computers at home but I've had issues with the icons getting rearranged on the remote computers desktop (17" screen) when using my laptop which has a 15" screen.

LogMeIn has a much richer user interface and it gives you free remote access to your PCs from any web-connected device. You just need to sign up for an account which is free and very secure.

I've been testing WHS and using the remote access feature to access those computers on my LAN which are running XP Pro and Vista Ultimate. It's not a bad experience, it's just not very 'feature rich'.

Cheers!

Monday, February 26, 2007 2:53 AM

I also join this suggestion. It's often enough the case, that I want to do some configuration works on the PCs of my children or on my Mediacenter PC using RemoteDesktop. With the home versions this is not possible (or only with workarounds like messenger desktop sharing, remote assistance, VNC). So why should not the properly running WHS client also include the RemoteDesktop component?

Best greetings from Germany
Olaf Engelke

Monday, February 26, 2007 9:46 AM

Moderator

I agree with this, but with a sidenote: allow people to remote to their Home versions of Windows, but not from their Home versions to another desktop or WHS. In other words, don't actually install the remote desktop client on Home versions of Windows, just install something that enables Pro or Ultimate versions of windows to remote to those Home desktops. Perhaps even make it work so that it only allows this if you use it through the WHS, and not from one desktop to another.

This would add value to WHS and allow -everybody- to use WHS to remote to their desktops as advertised (remember that many consumers (especially the target audience for Home Server) wouldn't read the fine print or wouldn't realise that their version of Windows is not among those listed).

But because it's only allowing people to remote to the desktops and not from the desktops, it wouldn't be the same as 'normal' Remote Desktop Functionality. Microsoft wouldn't be 'giving' features to Home users that Pro/Ultimate users had to pay for, because it's a severely limited subset of that feature that only works through WHS. So there'd still be a reason for people to buy Pro/Ultimate versions of Windows instead.

(Of course, only allowing RDP to the home would make it impossible for those people to remote to the WHS and get on the Administrator's Desktop, but people who only use Home versions shouldn't need to get on the Admin's Desktop anyway.)

Definitely supporting this. If WHS does not have this, it'd be perceived as 'severely crippled' from the get-go.

Monday, February 26, 2007 10:22 AM

I can't agree more on this issue. I was exceedingly disappointed that one of the coolest features of Home server relies on "Professional"/"Business" level products in order to function. I really believe this kind of limitation will become a massive stumbling block for the whole product. Surely there is a way Microsoft can implement this functionality via the "remote assistance" technology... Even if RDP is not used, I see it as important to implement a technology that will serve the function.

Monday, February 26, 2007 11:16 AM

You do realize that pretty much all flavors of XP (Home, MCE and XP) plus all versions of Vista already have the RDP client to access the WHS remotely. It's found in Start-->All Programs-->Accessories-->Communications in XP and Start-->All Programs-->Accessories in Vista. So if you wanted to stop Jimmy from using Remote Desktop on his XP Home Machine to connect to the WHS, you would need to somehow block the use of that program. And unless Jimmy knew the Administrator's password or is a member of the Remote Desktop Users group on WHS with the "Allow Logon through Terminal Services right", he won't be able to control the WHS remotely.

So I don't really think that should be much of a concern. Just create a good password on the Server when you set it up and don't give it to anyone on your network who doesn't need it. The same goes for him trying to Remote to other computers in the house. He would need to know the username and password on those machines to make it work.

I do agree that it's a shame that those versions of Windows do not already include the ability to be managed remotely but as I mentioned before in a previous post, there are better FREE alternatives out there with much more functionality like LogMeIn. Check it out if you haven't already.

Monday, February 26, 2007 9:41 PM

I'm going to play devil's advocate for a moment. I doubt the average "home" computer user understands the risks of allowing remote connections back to their desktops. If you can access your PC via remote desktop over the net without using a VPN then so can everyone else. It's an extremely easy way for someone to get to your desktop and at that point they control your world. Think of it this way, if someone's intentions are malicious then MS has put together a tool that brings all my data together and exposes it over the internet without any sort of warning that maybe I should be careful. Yes, it convenient, for both me and my new malicious friend.

Personally, I'm not even comfortable having the WHS interface accessible over HTTP/HTTPS. If you're going to use Remote Desktop and/or a web interface then only use it with a VPN. If you don't know how to configure and use a VPN then you're almost certainly a person that shouldn't be using these tools. I'm really not not trying to be harsh but protecting your assets and identity should be more important than ease of use. On the other hand if you are tech savvy and you are stuck with a "home" version of an operating system then it probably just slipped your mind that there are a ton of products out there that enable remote access. No, it won't let you connect via WHS's web interface but seriously, why would I go to a web interface to connect to a box when I can just go there directly?

Tuesday, February 27, 2007 3:22 PM

I'm not sure where you were trying to go with your argument Jay. Were you trying to play Devil's Advocate as to why MS didn't include Remote To Functionality in to the home versions of it's OS? If that's the case then why include Remote To Functionality in to the home version of its Server?

Tuesday, February 27, 2007 4:07 PM

Why did MS include it? My guess is they saw it as a "feature" that they could market without having to do anything more than aggregate a list of computers. The functionality to connect via remote desktop to a PC has nothing to do with WHS but is inherit in the OS of the PC. It would be trivial for someone to write a little .NET code that shows all the PCs in my home network in a web interface and lets a user connect via remote desktop. It's not something new to WHS but something that's always existed (assuming the OS version supports it).

My point was that remote desktop, depending on the configuration several things, can be quite unsecure and that it takes extra effort to make it secure.

Let's run through a possible situation. Suppose someone by the name John posts on this forum for help with his WHS setup. As part of his post he includes his IP (he shouldn't but I've seen multiple people do it). Most home users will use either their first name or some combination of their first and last name for a username. He posted using John so let's assume that's his username on his home PC. That's two pieces of the puzzle. Now we just download one of hundreds of software packages that do brute force password attacks. Somehow I doubt most users are as diligent about their password on their home PC as they are the password for their online banking. Then we wait. Maybe John isn't his username, maybe he's got intrusion detection, maybe his password isn't easily cracked. That's ok, there are more fish in the sea.

I'm not saying people shouldn't use it. I'm saying that the likely audience for home versions of MS OS aren't aware that it might not be safe. And WHS, despite the name, isn't running on a home version of the OS. It looks like it's a scaled-down version of Windows Server 2003.

Tuesday, February 27, 2007 6:34 PM

A few to make this part of the conversation go a little faster. I've been in IT for 10+ years so you don't need to give me long drawn out worst case scenarios to explain your side. Secondly yes WHS is a subset of Win 2003 Server. That's well known and documented.

However that doesn't change the fact that they choose to put HOME in the name of this product. Thereby in most regular consumers minds immediately associating it with XP and Vista Home products.

For it to no be able to connect to products that it is brand labelled/associated with is pretty much inexcusable, and something like that is guaranteed to confuse customers more than anything else.

Even without being able to remote in to a home machine once you've potentially gained access to the Windows Home Server interface and you still have access to parts of the home network. You've got access to the Windows Home Server console(guaranteed to be able to cause some havoc), as well you've got access to the users public folders.

So even without remote access to the XP Home/Vista Home machines you've already got the potential for a malicious attack on the home network.

None of that changes the fact that if they are going to remotely let you access your Windows Home Server console, and your XP Pro, and your appropriate flavors of Vista. They might as well enable/install host remote desktop services on Xp/Vista Home machines.

Tuesday, February 27, 2007 6:51 PM

BasP wrote:

But most versions of Windows already have the "from" capability of which you speak. That is, the RDP client comes with all versions of Windows XP and Vista. It's only the ability to act as an RDP "target" that's restricted to certain flavors of Windows.

Tuesday, February 27, 2007 8:40 PM

DarienA wrote:

For it to no be able to connect to products that it is brand labelled/associated with is pretty much inexcusable, and something like that is guaranteed to confuse customers more than anything else.

Agreed. Customers will be angry because they'll think it's a feature they've paid for that's missing.

DarienA wrote:

Even without being able to remote in to a home machine once you've potentially gained access to the Windows Home Server interface and you still have access to parts of the home network. You've got access to the Windows Home Server console(guaranteed to be able to cause some havoc), as well you've got access to the users public folders. So even without remote access to the XP Home/Vista Home machines you've already got the potential for a malicious attack on the home network.

Which is exactly why I'm blocking traffic to those ports at my router and using a VPN to gain access from outside my LAN. I am actually surprised that MS didn't see this as a security/configuration risk and create an install disk that one could use remotely to create a VPN. There's already software to install the WHS client so I don't see why it couldn't accommodate this.

As far as enabling it on the OS goes, I would like to see it on all MS OS. Remote Desktop and IIS were the reason I purchased XP Pro. Who knows, maybe they'll add it through an automatic update at a future point.

Tuesday, February 27, 2007 10:02 PM

Just a suggestion, but why could microsoft not offer remote desktop as a windows live service with a banner add to all those with HOME versions of XP and Vista wich would allow them to access their PC's remotely with or without WHS. Sounds like a win win situation to me. MS would make $ off of the adds.

Saturday, March 3, 2007 8:01 AM

myrampar wrote:

LogMeIn has a much richer user interface and it gives you free remote access to your PCs from any web-connected device. You just need to sign up for an account which is free and very secure.

LogMeIn is great. I even have some of my clients using it. But the free version has some restrictions - no copy/paste of files down to the remote machine, for instance. The very things you may find essential when accessing your home machines. You can pay a subscription of about $20 a month or $199 a year for up to 5 PCs that gives back these options. There's other advanced options too. https://secure.logmein.com/go.asp?page=productcomparison

But dang it, we just 'bought' a complete home server solution. Why would we want to go seek something else to give remote control features to our Home machines that happen to be runing a version of the OS that has Home in the title?

I like the suggestion that some sort of restricted remote connection facility is added to the machines running Home versions of the OS, so that they can be connected to only via WHS.

Scenario.

'Dad' is the home network admin. He sets up WHS so that he can access every PC on the home network via WHS. SO when he logs into the Home Server from anywhere, he sees shortcuts on his desktop to each PC in the home network, regardless of the OS they run. This way he can perform any admin or troubleshooting tasks even when he is working hard at the 19th hole at the end of a long 'work' day :+)

Any other family member can only see network shares etc. when they log in.

Sunday, March 4, 2007 6:40 PM

Another way to look at it, from an "average home user" standpoint, is to only make those files available thru RDP that are on the WHS box. If your just using Vista/XP Home versions at home (as most people are), you can still remotely access the Shared Files folder(s) on WHS thru RDP. Since the WHS box will be powered -on- all the time, the shared files will always be available remotely. This gives people the ability to selectively store "only those files they want exposed to the internet" on the WHS box rather than on the individual Windows OS machines. I see this as a PLUS, not a MINUS -- speaking from an "average home user" perspective. The averge home user doesn't need to (or have any idea "How-To") remotely administer their Windows desktop boxes via WHS. Access their available data files -- "yes". Actively administer -- "no".

The challange is for MS to somehow explain the advantages/disadvantages (usability/security) of storing files on the WHS box (and how to go about doing it) so that the "average user" understands.

Monday, March 5, 2007 5:05 PM

I disagree about remote PC access as a minus. It is a definitely PLUS! And not everything can be done through file management on the server.

For example, I had a situation where my daughter's teacher required the class to all connect to a specific homework site. I've set our children up so they are standard (non-admin users) on their PCs but the site required various updates for Java or Flash or some other plug-in. She was unable to get to the site and do her homework. Fortunately it could wait until I got home from work, but if I had been out of town on a trip, say, I could have just logged in remotely to the PC, downloaded the updates as an administrator, then turned it back over to her to do her homework.

There are certain things that the "family network administrator" is going to want to do that require access to the individual PCs.

I agree that you may not want to give remote PC access to everyone on your network this is why it should be a flag in the user set-up. One setting lets you get to the server for file level access (the shares). One lets you get to the admin console and manage the server (if you have the password). The last flag lets you do remote PC access. If you don't want to allow the remote PC access, you just turn it off for all your users. But it should be by user.

Monday, March 5, 2007 7:00 PM

BlaineMVP wrote:

In this situation there is nothing that WHS solves inherently. Remote desktop has been around for quite awhile and while WHS may consolidate the list of computers on a home network for connection, it doesn't add much additional value. I have three boxes on my home network that are all accessible via remote desktop. I changed the ports on all of them to something besides 3389 and then forwarded the ports through my router back to each box. There are lots of other solutions available if you want a non-MS flavor. This isn't an argument for or against, it's just a caution that this isn't WHS functionality. It's already in your OS (or not).

Monday, March 5, 2007 8:38 PM

I won't deny that there are ways to do this without WHS. But focusing on WHS as a product, and reviewing the features in the context of what a typical home user might expect from the experience, I don't think asking them to do their own port reassignment and forwarding makes sense. The WHS solution says you can simply logon to your WHS server, see the list of computers, click on one and you are logging on to it. Since this is included functionality in a Windows *HOME* Server product, it should connect to HOME versions of Windows.

I'd love to see Microsoft's response to this whole thread... has anyone in Microsoft discussed this descrepancy in having WHS unable to connect to typical home OSes?

Monday, March 5, 2007 10:21 PM

You know, all versions of Windows XP (and Vista, I assume) have the ability to host Remote Desktop sessions (i.e. you can remote to them). Even Windows XP Home; that's how the Remote Assistance feature works. It seems to me that Microsoft could find some way to tap in to that without a ton of work.

Tuesday, March 6, 2007 5:02 AM

Moderator

Exactly and it was the first issue I spotted after I had it up and running and wanted to remote into the machines on my network as one machine runs Vista Premium and another XP Home so only the XP Pro machines on my network are accessible remotely.

I've also just realised that Virtual PC 2007 won't work on Vista Premium so I am going to have to shell out for Ultimate, which I knew I should have bought in the first place!

Tuesday, March 6, 2007 4:08 PM

BlaineMVP wrote:

I'd love to see Microsoft's response to this whole thread... has anyone in Microsoft discussed this descrepancy in having WHS unable to connect to typical home OSes?

There is a simple solution to this that does not require Microsoft to do anything. Users can just understand that RTP target is not a part of Home OS's at this time. If you need that as part of your solution you buy Vista Ultimate.....it is really that simple.

Wednesday, March 7, 2007 5:21 PM

You know that, and I know that, but average Joe Consumer isn't going to be happy if they go buy this new-fangled WHS thingy that does this neat remote PC connection stuff, but only if they have "business", "pro" or "ultimate" versions of Windows. Okay, it's a way for Microsoft to make some money on Ultimate upgrades but at the cost of a lot of "good will" with the average consumer.

It's Windows *Home* Server so it should connect to PCs in the *home*. This is the crux of the suggestion and I see that it has a lot of support from beta testers here. But Microsoft can determine the direction of their own product however they like. If they want to say it is an "advanced" feature that won't connect to 90% of the PCs in the home, then I believe they are making a mistake.

Wednesday, March 7, 2007 5:53 PM

Has anyone thought about trying to get clever and using remote assistance to solve this issue? I don't have a *home* OS flavor but I know it's possible to send an unsolicited offer from a *pro* OS to a *home* OS. The request must be granted on the *home* machine before the *pro* can connect but it seems like we could watch the traffic going back and forth and do something to automate that. I'm not sure it would work and it doesn't solve the "built-in" test but it's an interesting scenario.

Actually, if you really want that integrated feel you could license logmein Pro and create a page that your IIS serves up with links to all of your boxes. A little CSS and it would look just like the WHS interface.

I still think that MS is going to laugh when asked why they won't enable a feature that they've determined to have enough value-add to be part of a more expensive software license. Not all versions of Vista have media center but WHS handles media. Should they give all servers that can attach media center? I think the most likely course of action will be that the remote control is pulled if enough people complain.

Wednesday, March 7, 2007 7:01 PM

Possibly instead of Remote Desktop, I would like to see an easy way for the Home admin to be able to offer remote assistance without the requirement "Both you and your assistant must be using either Windows Messenger or a MAPI-compliant e-mail account such as Microsoft Outlook or Outlook Express". Many times, I would like a remote console to be shared in a similar manner to VNC, instead of starting up a whole new login, so that I can help a family member. This would be the way I would prefer if I was out of town and someone in my family was having a problem. I most likely would need to actually see what they were trying to do.

If someone is logged into the system, then they should get a notification that the screen is being shared. If no one is logged in, then the Home admin should be able to log in remotely.

Friday, March 9, 2007 2:09 PM

Correct me if I'm wrong, but I believe the limitations on RDC are due to the lack of terminal services licensing for "home" based versions.

MS would have to include a TS client license on home systems for free which would anger business users who purchase pro for this functionality. It is just like not being able to join "Home" to a domain. They are not paying for it so it wont be added.

Friday, March 9, 2007 8:09 PM

Tdar329 wrote:

Sure, but isn't that missing the point slightly. I have several PC's on my LAN that I'll migrate across to Vista eventually. Should I have to buy Vista Ultimate for the PC's that belong to my kids' just to allow me to take advantage of the remote control features that WHS provides? It would seem a bit mad to do so. As others have said, there are other ways to achieve the same thing; I use Logmein too for example although my company recently blocked it's use within our Intranet. The fact is that MS have included the remote control aspect as a benefit of running WHS when it really isn't for the target market WHS is aimed at. Either include it with no restrictions or don't include it. IMHO.

Saturday, March 10, 2007 11:34 AM

Remote Assistance is included with every SKU of XP and Vista, as far as I know. I believe your kid would have to initiate the request through Messenger, since he/she would be behind your broadband router/firewall. And your firewall would have to be configured not to block outbound traffic on port 3389.

See this TechNet article for more information. It discusses XP, but the concepts should be similar in Vista.

Saturday, March 10, 2007 3:24 PM

Moderator

I believe you have totally missed the entire point, not to mention that I HATE vista and wish to remain on windows xp for as long as i can. Some people don't want to upgrade their OS, I am one of them.

Having remote access to my home edition machines is not a NICE to have it's a REQUIREMENT. I have many times received phone calls from less than technical family members seeking assistance and have not been able to do much for them without being at the machine in some cases.

I have used 3rd party tools to perform remote access and have had success with them, however, the less I need to have running on startup the better.

Come on Microsoft, lets get the remote access for home editions out there, those that now what it's for and how to use it, understand the risks. Your average home users typically won't have a home server.

Monday, November 5, 2007 6:30 PM

Since this thread woke up again I wonder, if anyone could test this feater with the RTM of WHS to a Windows Home Edition. (I don't have one any more in my home due to exactly this limitation of Remotedesktop access.)

Since the webpage of my home server after login states "Access to any of your home computers" (translated back from German), this could (or should?) be implemented. I can see no word around the Windows version here.

The only strange part in the translated text is a statement about accessing your home computers, as if you are directly in your office? (My home computers are usually not in my office ...)

Wording in this part is far from perfect ...

Best greetings from Germany

Olaf

Monday, November 5, 2007 8:58 PM

Moderator

You can request to Offer Remote Assistance, use this shortcut below (Start, Run and paste it) on a client machine and it opens a Help and Support window in XP asking for the IP address. Once you enter it it will prompt the user on the machine if they wish to be remoted, and they then also have to allow you to take control of the keyboard & mouse.

Therefore it may be possible to build a console pluggin on WHS to maybe get it to work so you can remote XP Home and Vista Home versions. Not sure if server has the software in it to offer remote assistance though???? I would presume that it does. Writing a pluggin's out of my league but someone with the nouse may be able to get it to work.

Hope that helps a bit.

hcp://CN=Microsoft%20Corporation,L=Redmond,S=Washington,C=US/Remote%20Assistance/Escalation/Unsolicited/unsolicitedrcui.htm

Cheers

Paul

Monday, November 5, 2007 11:46 PM

Offering Remote Assistance is nothing single sided (I asked before to add this functionality to WHS since it is often more important for supporting the familiy seeing what they see than having Remotedesktop connection).

But to have this function, also configuration changes on client side must be performed (besides ticking the checkbox in system properties and adding helper accounts to the appropriate local group). On Pro versions done with Group Policy Editor, on home versions one would have to add appropriate registry keys.

Officially not supported, since it is declared as a feature in Domain environment, but I heard from users, who applied this successfully to a workgroup environment as well.

This should have been a simple component of the Connector software setup. Maybe one of the next versions?

Best greetings from Germany

Olaf

Tuesday, November 6, 2007 8:25 AM

Moderator

Windows Live Messenger allows for Remote Assistance from any version of Windows (XP/Vista) to any version of Windows (XP/Vista)...I can't see why WHS can't support a similar feature.

Tuesday, November 13, 2007 3:26 PM

Please help here. I installed logmein in the server. Works great reaching out. But when Im out of my home and I try to use logmein to my WHS, it ask me NAME and PASSWORD. I do not know what to put in there because WHS only has one name (I believe) 'administrator". If I use it and try to input the master password it gives me a real long letter about report to MS I guess about this problem, it wont let in.. Can you give me ideas how to create name on WHS so I can LOG IN into this server....thanks Sam

I answer my own question: Finally after a couple days I tried logmein as administrator all caps and my PW created when I installed WHS and viola..I was in or on....then I that time the computer asked to use/ creat another name and PW . Now is working just fine. I belive MS eventually will buy logmein....

Friday, December 7, 2007 2:51 AM

You really do not need to install logmein onto the home console at all. You should be able to remote control the home server from the web by default.

The main reason to use logmein is so that you can remote control the work stations that are using XP home edition, and Vista Home Editions that do not have built in remote desktop support.

I hope this is helpful

Charles

Friday, December 7, 2007 9:20 PM

Thank you Charles...well I just installed WHS....and of course I'm learning a lot....still do not know my way around yet. I had use logmein for the last 2 years it has so many good features like I can see all my computers and family members at one time to see which is off/on at one time. And of course do updates repairs etc. First night after the installation (everybody was sleep) and I wanted to try it from 200 miles from my home, logmein was there..... I lke the fact it tells me how long a computer has been off and stuff like that. One problem I still having with WHS, is after is turned on it doesnt get on line inmediatly, and I have to find out way, which could be the router. Thanks again Charles and have Nice and Safe Holidays...Sam

Friday, December 7, 2007 9:32 PM

I purchased the WHS with the understanding it would allow me to remtoe into my home computers - as advertised.

What's the point of requiring this feature only be usable for Vista Business versions? They are marketing the Windows Home Server to the HOME market, which buys computers with Vista Home versions. This is another major MS Marketing team blunder and needs to be corrected.

Wednesday, December 26, 2007 7:50 PM

If you check the Learn section of the Windows Home Server minisite, you will see clearly stated under the Connect item what the requirements are for remote access, and what Microsoft operating systems will support that feature.

Unfortunately the Windows Home Server team doesn't have any way to make Remote Desktop connections work on versions of operating systems that those other teams decided not to offer that feature on, so that disclaimer in the marketing literature is about all you should expect to see.

Wednesday, December 26, 2007 8:40 PM

Moderator

Ken Warren wrote:

...the Windows Home Server team doesn't have any way to make Remote Desktop connections work on versions of operating systems that those other teams decided not to offer that feature on...

Both product marketing teams should be ''talking'.

Thursday, December 27, 2007 3:30 AM

I would bet that they have, and I would also bet that to date the Vista team has declined to add that functionality to the Vista home SKUs. The XP team isn't really relevant at this point; the next XP service pack is already in the pipeline, and I'd be surprised if it weren't the last XP service pack.

Thursday, December 27, 2007 4:33 AM

Moderator

I can understand the limitation for Vista Home... but Vista Premium is the defacto standard installed on most consumer PCs. I just wish the marketing teams looked at this from a value-add point of view. A consumer who is buying a Windows Home Server is making a significant investment in Microsoft ecosystem. It doesn't have to be free but the current cost of the anytime upgrade from Premium to Ultimate is ridiculous. Perhaps Microsoft could give WHS customers a significant break on upgrading. I wouldn't mind paying $99..for the ability to upgrade up to 3 computers to Ultimate. I can justify that...but the current $179/PC is ridiculous.

Thursday, December 27, 2007 10:23 PM

I just decided to go ahead bite the bullet by upgrading to Ultimate to the tune of $159. That wasn't so bad. I understand the views here that the Vista Premium should support RDP but it doesn't. I wasn't going to let my investment in the HP WHS get in the way of RDP so upgrading was the option I pursued.

I appreciate eveyone's input in this thread and everywhere else throughout this forum. I am learning a lot about this electronic whizzbine called WHS.

Saturday, December 29, 2007 2:05 AM

Close call for me. Now I know NOT to buy WHS. If I had bought it to use with my newly purchased PC with Vista Home Premium, I would feel CHEATED. I think this is a major snafu for Microsoft and a real marketing black eye.

Monday, December 31, 2007 8:43 PM

Well, I had the same thoughts as you did regarding the remote access for desktops running home editions of the OS's. I still went ahead and purchased home server and do not regret it. If remote access to your desktops is a key feature that you need/want, try Logmein Free. That is what I use and it works GREAT! This solution is FREE and I didn't have to upgrade to an OS that I really don't want.

As for the Snafu for MS well, those OS's don't have support for remote desktop as it is, and there are ways around that with other tools.

Am I disapointed that they don't offer it, yes, but I'm over that with the help of Logmein Free.

Charles Orndorff

Monday, December 31, 2007 11:26 PM

In regards to the statement, "As for the Snafu for MS well, those OS's don't have support for remote desktop as it is..."

I would bet that all versions of Vista have support for remote desktop but the home versions have it disabled. I would also bet that if Microsoft wanted to enable it for Home Premium, it would be a simple patch. Not supporting remote desktop for Home Premium is just a silly marketing trick and is a rip off for home customers. Especially considering that Windows XP Media Center did support remote desktop.

In regards to the statement, "Unfortunately the Windows Home Server team doesn't have any way to make Remote Desktop connections work on versions of operating systems that those other teams decided not to offer that feature on"

Baloney!!! They both work for Microsoft and they are certainly talking with each other. The WHS team needs to pressure the Vista team to do the right thing for Microsoft's customers.

My family has multiple computers in different locations of our house. I have Vista Ultimate on mine but the others are home premium. If I need to do some work on the basement computer, why should I have to leave my system's location to go and work on it. My feeling is that ALL versions of Vista should support remote desktop for administrative purposes and especially home premium. These systems should also support remote assistance for the local network without having to log into some internet site. If someone in my family is having a problem, I should be able to easily connect to their desktop and share it with them.

As far as using Logmein, why should I have to use third party software when all the software I need comes with Vista? It is just a matter of Microsoft not being so greedy and enabling that feature. Why open up another point of entry to my home systems that could possibly be comprimised?

Aside from this issue, WHS is a fantastic product and I would not want to be without it. There is certainly room for improvement but it is more than adequate for a version 1 product. I have the HP Mediasmart server and it works great. I hope the WHS team will use their influence to persuade the Vista team that not allowing remote desktop is a marketing blunder and will certainly affect sales of WHS as well as the satisfaction of WHS owners.

Rick Webster

Tuesday, January 1, 2008 6:37 PM

Rick Webster wrote:

Baloney!!! They both work for Microsoft and they are certainly talking with each other. The WHS team needs to pressure the Vista team to do the right thing for Microsoft's customers.

Unfortunately, all the Vista team needs to do is say "We like the feature sets of the various SKUs the way they are." and the WHS team has no recourse. Which is the situation; for whatever reasons the Vista team doesn't want the home SKUs of Vista to be able to accept incoming Remote Desktop connections. The WHS team can't force the Vista team to do anything and (to date) persuasion hasn't gotten them anywhere.

Wednesday, January 2, 2008 11:45 PM

Moderator

Don't get me wrong, I have been enjoying Windows Home Server...less the whole Remote Access debacle. As I mentioned before, Vista Ultimate is too expensive to enable remote access. Its hard to justify $179/PC when I bought the WHS for $549. I'd spend more than half that to turn on remote access for two desktop computers...just not worth it. Currently there are no other draws to Vista Ultimate either. Hopefully there are some announcements at CES this Sunday in regards to WHS. It would be acceptable to me at least, if Microsoft were to offer a $99 Vista Ultimate anytime upgrade for 2 PCs.

Wednesday, January 2, 2008 11:57 PM

If we see all these Remotedesktop sharing tools currently available in Windows or applications (Remote Assistance, Messenger etc.) I also wonder, why this kind of remote access cannot be made part of the WHS console software functionality at least for the Home SKUs. There would still somebody have to be logged in on the client, but this would already help to perform many of the wanted tasks and much more important to see the same, what the current user sees.

Best greetings from Germany

Olaf

Thursday, January 3, 2008 9:50 AM

Moderator

Ken Warren wrote:

Rick Webster wrote:

Baloney!!! They both work for Microsoft and they are certainly talking with each other. The WHS team needs to pressure the Vista team to do the right thing for Microsoft's customers.

I work in the corporate world and see the same "Baloney" in my organization. The Vista Team and the WHS both have a common higher headquarters which can make the decision for them both. Maybe this request has been made via this channel, maybe not. Since none of us are on either team, it's speculation on our part (unless Ken has a direct connection to someone on either team).

It's clear to all of us home users with "home" OS versions of XP or Vista that this feature is needed. It is certainly possible for the feature to be added. While not condoning the practice, it's well known that all versions of XP and Vista can be made to accept remote desktop connections for those so inclined - so it is technically possible.

This debate is going to go on, and on, and on.....

Friday, January 4, 2008 7:43 PM

I do have direct connections inside Microsoft, by virtue of being a Microsoft MVP. I interact with the Windows Home Server product group regularly, so what I know in this case comes from them, from information that's publicly available to all, and from "common knowledge" in the tech community.

The Windows Home Server product group has approached the Vista product group about this, and has been rebuffed. That is the official word from the WHS group. I would guess that they were rebuffed because the Vista product group, like the XP product group before them, differentiates the home and business SKUs of Vista along functional lines. The home SKUs don't support Active Directory, incoming Remote Desktop connections (Remote Assistance is somewhat different, because it shares one desktop between two users), Previous Versions functionality, and several other features that are seen as more "business oriented". And the business SKUs don't support some features, like Media Center and other home-and-family oriented functions. That information is all freely available directly from Microsoft.

Whether the initial decision was purely because the Vista product group didn't see why home users would ever want Remote Desktop functionality or (as some have speculated) because they wanted to charge more for the business SKUs, and force businesses to buy them instead of the home SKUs, at this point the Vista product group seems to be unwilling to change their products to suit the desires of Windows Home Server users. The Windows Home Server team is well aware of the desire for the enthusiast community for this capability on home SKUs, but they have not been able to persuade the Vista product group.

Telling the Windows Home Server product group that you want/need/demand this functionality isn't going to help. You're preaching to the choir, and they've done (as far as I can tell) all they can already. You need to tell the Vista product group. I suggest voting with your wallet: don't buy Vista, buy XP Professional or MCE 2005. There is at least one more service pack coming out for XP, after all, and it will be supported for some time to come. If you have the opportunity, attend a Microsoft event in your area and work the conversation around to this, and make sure that you tell Microsoft directly that you decided to buy XP Professional because you refuse to buy Vista Ultimate just for this one feature, and the business SKUs don't have other features that you require. (Expect this to be a hard sell; Vista Ultimate doesn't cost much more than XP Professional did a year ago.)

Friday, January 4, 2008 10:35 PM

Moderator

Not accessible to normal user or not accessible at all.

Monday, January 7, 2008 6:58 AM

I see that it's been a while since these flames have been fanned and as a recent user of WHS and a long time MS supporter, I have to say this may be the beginning of the end - at least for me. This thread has made the it excrutiatingly obivious that any "HOME" product should work with other "HOME" products. I fit the profile of probably half of MS users. I have sevral home computers all running XP home or Vista premium; I am the family IT support and I am at home available to provide IT support about 2 to 4 hours on a good day. The reason I got WHS was to be able to reach out and touch all of the computers on my home network. Oh, and btw, I don't have a corporate budget to but a $400 OS on each and every computer I own.

Conclusion: maybe it is time to look into other OSes, even open source, since it no longer makes sense to work with a single vendor. I am a very dissatified customer even if MS doesn't care.

Proposed as answer by dSTeVek Tuesday, September 9, 2008 2:27 AM
Unproposed as answer by Ken WarrenModerator Friday, October 17, 2008 12:27 PM

Friday, August 22, 2008 7:33 PM

Unfortunately, this will need to be escalated to the Ballmer level to get it corrected - and we haven't achieved that, yet.

The WHS marketing team indicates they cannot influence the Windows Vista marketing team to open up the remote access on the Vista home products - even the "Premium" version.

It's clear that the Vista marketing team is incapable of understanding this fundamental marketing blunder. Considering the Vista marketing disaster, I am amazed the whole Vista marketing team hasn't been axed. IMO, Vista is a very good product - I've grown to like it better than XP and recommend it to friends and family. Unfortunately, it has a very bad public stigma - and that is marketing's fault! Apple is clearly out marketing Vista...

WHS is an awesome add on for the Vista product - it's just amazing they can't see this...

Someone really needs to talk to Ballmer about this.

Tuesday, September 9, 2008 2:51 AM

Is there a way to petition Mr. Ballmer? If so, I would sign on in a heart beat.

The other solution, and this is within the purvey of the WHS team, is to correctly brand the product as the Windows Professional Server. Blaming the Vista team is a cop out.

Dr. Mike

Tuesday, September 9, 2008 9:12 PM

makenworthy said:

Conclusion: maybe it is time to look into other OSes, even open source, since it no longer makes sense to work with a single vendor. I am a very dissatified customer even if MS doesn't care.

While I agree this is an annoying misstep on the part of MS, a couple points... it doesn't cost $400 per PC to install Vista Ultimate or Business Edition. And if you are frustrated with lack of integration go ahead and jump into Linux where complaints that something doesn't work right are usually met with "fix it yourself". I think we should keep talking about this so it doesn't drop off the radar, but honestly, threatening to switch to another OS probably doesn't help the cause.

Sunday, October 5, 2008 3:48 AM

It is, admittedly, an odd feature to tout when Professional/Business/Ultimate versions of Windows XP and Vista already support client-to-client RDP connections. Why add a potentially unnecessary "middleman"?

...Actually, now that I think about it, I think the point is a (relatively) secured connection to the home PCs from the outside, as the connection to the Home Server would be SSL/TLS encrypted (by virtue of the https://), which would probably be easier than trying to set up a VPN connection or SSH tunnel (as I would) to tunnel RDP through... Unless I don't know the mechanism by which the RDP connections are made the clients from the outside (I assume it's via the website). Isn't there an ActiveX control that allows the Web RDP session or have I just imagined that?

I understand the technical reasons why Home editions lack RDP, but Home editions do allow Remote Assistance connections. Would it be computationally impossible to have the Connector tie into the RA aspect of Windows Home versions? It wouldn't allow those clients to initiate outgoing connections to another Home edition client, but it would allow a user on the outside to access their Home edition PC via their Home Server from the outside.

Just my two cents.

Edited by Mitchell Hennessy Friday, October 17, 2008 12:05 AM

Friday, October 17, 2008 12:00 AM

Mitchell, what you describe (Remote Assistance) is effectively what Live Mesh does. There are problems with Remote Assistance in this scenario, however. The big ones are that it has no login UI, and it's driven from the wrong end. If a home computer is on, and someone is logged in, then they can share their desktop using Remote Assistance. If nobody is logged in however, there's no way to initiate a Remote Assistance connection from afar, and no way to log in if you could.

I'm not on the WHS team, I just post a lot. :)

Friday, October 17, 2008 12:31 PM

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Remote connection to PC, should handle *all* versions of XP and Vista, especially home versions

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Remote connection to PC, should handle all versions of XP and Vista, especially home versions