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Backup to second or third hard disk RRS feed

  • Question

  •  

    The "devine Team" decided that :

    they aren't considering internal backup as a viable option

     

    They decided that in spite of the many requests for this feature.

     

    It is clear that :

    - they do not care about what we want ....

    - they do not have the guts to come and say it in the forum themselves

    And we are not allowed to say that they are nothing more than a bunch of arrogant technicians ?

     

    Saturday, July 28, 2007 11:32 AM

Answers

  • "It is clear that :

    - they do not care about what we want ...."

    Many of the new features in the beta were user driven.

     

    "they do not have the guts to come and say it in the forum themselves"

    I guess you didn't bother to read this - http://forums.microsoft.com/WindowsOneCare/ShowPost.aspx?PostID=1924436&SiteID=2

     

    "And we are not allowed to say that they are nothing more than a bunch of arrogant technicians ?"

    You can say anything you like here, as long as it is on topic and meets forum standards. There is no accuracy requirement.

     

    Saturday, July 28, 2007 3:39 PM
    Moderator

All replies

  • "It is clear that :

    - they do not care about what we want ...."

    Many of the new features in the beta were user driven.

     

    "they do not have the guts to come and say it in the forum themselves"

    I guess you didn't bother to read this - http://forums.microsoft.com/WindowsOneCare/ShowPost.aspx?PostID=1924436&SiteID=2

     

    "And we are not allowed to say that they are nothing more than a bunch of arrogant technicians ?"

    You can say anything you like here, as long as it is on topic and meets forum standards. There is no accuracy requirement.

     

    Saturday, July 28, 2007 3:39 PM
    Moderator
  • I agree MS-Adict. It seems they do not care what we want. They have it in their mind this is the way they want to do it and the heck with what the customers want. They know better than we do as to what we should have and want. Oh, you don't need to backup to an internal drive. We know better than you do that it's not proper to do this so, we will not allow you to do it, even though we know we could provide a warning and even though our competition listens to their customers.

     

    Least that's the way it seems to me. What the customer wants isn't important to them. They seem to think either you like what we do or you leave and go somewhere else. They could care less it seems.

     

    This is what I have come away with from the FAQ and from what OneCarebear has stated in messages here as to what will happen.

     

    I guess they want to cripple OneCare as much as they can in order to give you one more reason to buy one of their other products.

    Monday, July 30, 2007 7:42 PM
  • I don't want to turn this into an argument, but I will disagree. I think that there are good reasons to not allow backup to an internal drive, though you may not agree with them. There are alternatives for backup - some free - that will allow the internal drive as a destination. You can disable the OneCare backup if desired. However, for the target audience, the OneCare backup is very good and much better than no backup.

    I also know that the OneCare team values our feedback. They may still decide that an internal backup destination is okay for an advanced user and provide it. Heck, we have external drives and network shares because customers asked for them.

    -steve

    Tuesday, July 31, 2007 1:21 AM
    Moderator
  • That's just it, the more they make these changes, the smaller their target audience becomes. Why not have a target audience of hmm, i don't know, let's say everyone?

     

    No matter what they think, they are not listening to their customers that are telling them what is needed and wanted out here.

     

    My posting are definately not designed to start any sort of argument. I'm just trying to provide feedback but, it just ticks me off that they don't seem to care one bit what we say, no matter how much we point out their bad logic. No matter how much we show them we need it done the right way.

     

    Tuesday, July 31, 2007 3:14 AM
  • No arguments from me, Scortch, regarding the fact that not everyone is satisfied with the options available.

     

    I'll repeat the history here - when OneCare first went to beta several years ago, the *only* backup destination that was allowed was CD or DVD - that's it.

    We, the users, asked for more options. If I had to rank the variety of requests that I recall reading:

    1. External Disks

    2. Network Attached Storage

    3. Network Shares on a server or other PC in the home

    4. Flash drives

    5. Internal disks

    We got number 1 and 4 by the time 1.0 was released to production.

    We got number 2 and 3 when we got the 1.5 beta

    Number 3 has been enhanced with this beta.

    During the 1.5 beta, the new clamor was for number 5 and the outcry has been loud. I am not privy to the schedule of development and planning for OneCare, but my suspicion, based on experience with development projects, is that the 2.0 feature set was on the table when 1.0 was in beta and was firmed up by the time 1.5 went to beta last October. What we are seeing now in 2.0 was developed between October and the release to public beta.

    While I still don't think that backing up to an internal disk is a good idea, there is now a workaround that allows this to happen via creating a Network Share, multi-PC management, and centralized storage. I know that the backup team noted, in the FAQ that they posted, that internal backup destinations were not considered to be a good idea by them. They also communicated that they are working on trying to allow eSATA drives as a valid backup destination. I think that we may end up seeing Internal destination supported with a warning message in order to support eSATA which is usually seen as internal.

    Will we see this for 2.0? Perhaps not, but based on hstory, I am confident that the people responsible for making the feature decisions for OneCare design listen to our feedback.

     

    -steve

     

    Tuesday, July 31, 2007 5:12 PM
    Moderator
  • In case you haven't noticed, the FAQ posted by the Team also indicates that the Network Share workaround will be available for any OneCare PC by the time 2.0 is released. This means that backup to any hard drive that can be shared by Windows will be possible when OneCare 2.0 is released.

     

    1.      Why am I disallowed to backup to an internal drive, even if it is a separate drive?

     

    We feel it is not proper protection for your data to allow a backup of your data to be targeted to the same drive that contains the data.  If the disk failed, the data and the backup would both be lost.  If you have two hard disks in your machine, we still disallow this action.  This is because our design center is for a user that may not completely understand the nature of the problem addressed here.  If we checked the second disk and saw there was no data on the disk and therefore allowed the user to target the second disk, there is nothing that would keep data from being written to the second disk subsequently.  We feel it is important to protect the data and not allow a case that could result in data loss.

     

    This said, we have heard your feedback and we are moving in a direction that will prevent data loss from our users and still allow advanced user that understand the risks take this action.  In 2.0, we allow network share to be created locally and then a backup can be targeted to this network share.  We feel that this is a way advanced users can have the support that they desire and other users are protected from possible data loss.

     

    We currently support this in centralized backup and we are moving in the 2.0 version to support this work around in the local (non-centralized) backup.  This capability should be available by the final release.

     

    At this point, I see no real complaint remaining, since you only need to perform the sharing operation once on a newly formatted drive. This is so minimally difficult that anyone can do it, so the problem at that point won't exist.

     

    OneCareBear

    Tuesday, July 31, 2007 8:43 PM
    Moderator
  • @ OneCareBear

     

     

    I am sure that you are not happy with this wonderfull news after all the fuzz you made yourself about backing up to a second or third hard disk

     

    Wednesday, August 1, 2007 10:39 AM
  • On the contrary, it really doesn't bother me at all. In fact if you'd actually read my posts in the other thread you'd have realized that I indicated that a workaround was needed, I just didn't want to see 'Internal Drive' listed as an easy backup option since it's placing the data at risk of loss.

     

    If someone chooses to do this via the workaround, they have chosen to bypass the easy selection list method that the non-technical user is more likely to use. This means they understand how to manually create and browse to that same share, so they also understand what they are choosing to do.

     

    OneCareBear

     

     

    Wednesday, August 1, 2007 11:57 AM
    Moderator
  • It is silly for MS to assume home users are configured in a network.

    I just want to back my stuff up....

    ...

    every other backup sofware I have used allows you to backup to a second or third drive.. except MS... silly.

     

    Thursday, November 27, 2008 6:20 AM
  • Hello MarkH001, see this post for a workaround that will allow you to use an internal drive as a backup destination - http://forums.microsoft.com/WindowsOneCare/ShowPost.aspx?PostID=2582583&SiteID=2

    Thursday, November 27, 2008 12:37 PM
    Moderator