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WHS On MSDN - A Must! RRS feed

  • Question

  • Hi, now that you are at RC1 I thought I should point out something. I think my work place might be interested in developing 3rd party commercial apps for WHS, but it will be a no go until we get WHS on MSDN. We pay big bucks for or MSDN license and it would be nice to get the downloads so we can setup our development servers. So can you tell me when and if we will get RC1 on MSDN and ensure that future release will also be on MSDN? That would make the idea of doing commercial apps much easier to sell.

    Thanks
    Wednesday, June 13, 2007 6:05 PM

Answers

  • My understanding is that it will not be available through MSDN at launch. This situation may change subsequently - as far as I know, there hasn't been an update from the WHS Team so presumably they don't have any news at present.

     

    I have been corrected that the eval period will be 120 days rather than the 180 days that the RC is, but if you want to use it beyond that period then you'll need fresh keys (fresh downloads and probably a fresh VM), or to buy a copy of the software if that period is not long enough.

     

    Remember that for the purposes of the SDK you only need the handful of DLLs, though obviously you'll need a machine to test the results.

     

    In my case I'll be using it at home so I'll be buying a copy anyway.

    Monday, August 6, 2007 11:15 PM
  • I'm sorry, but you've already had a straight answer (just not the one you're looking for):

    WHS will not be available on MSDN at this time.

    It's always possible that Microsoft will change their minds at some point in the future, like they did with MCE, but for now, no MSDN.
    Tuesday, September 18, 2007 12:19 AM
    Moderator

All replies

  •  

     

    We are working on updating the MSDN articles. They will be published as soon as possible.

    Wednesday, June 13, 2007 8:10 PM
  • So we will be able to download an Development copy from MSDN. Do you know when that might be available?
    Tuesday, June 19, 2007 4:54 PM
  •  

    I am not sure at this time if it'll be in a downloadable package, but I'll give your request to who's responsible for this matter.

    Wednesday, June 20, 2007 6:18 PM
  • MSDN subscriptions typically don't include home SKUs. Commecrial developers wantng to develop for home products generally have to purchase them.
    Wednesday, June 20, 2007 9:40 PM
  • Anybody can get the RC1 code by signing up at http://connect.microsoft.com/WindowsHomeServer
    Thursday, June 21, 2007 5:00 PM
  • Not sure exactly what you mean by "home SKUs" but all OS level and up MSDN subscriptions include every new MS OS including "home" oriented ones. At this moment, downloads, media, and keys are avialable for Vista Basic and Home Premium, XP Home and MCE, Windows for Workgroups, Windows 3.11, DOS 6.0 and DOS 6.22. Interestingly, 95, 98, and ME are missing although I know they were there at one time.
    Thursday, June 21, 2007 7:37 PM
  • I have to agree with HLaRoux. MSDN is there so developer don't have to buy every product. We don't use then for day - to - day use, but we do need access. How are we able to sell products for home SKUs if we can't test them, and there is 0 chance that we can afford to buy several copies of any product for each developer.


    Thursday, June 21, 2007 8:45 PM
  • I agree.  I have a very large group of developers and pay quite a lot yearly for MSDN licenses so we DO NOT have to worry about buying all the different SKUs MS comes out with.  Just look at Vista!

     

    Now that WHS has been RTM, it should be posted on MSDN.

    Thursday, July 19, 2007 3:04 AM
  •  

    I'm very disappointed with the way this beta has ended.

     

    I've beta tested every o/s since the PDC release of NT 3.0 back in the early 1990's and this is the first time that I can remember that developers let alone testers have then been refused access to the released product.

     

    It’s a shame, the idea of WHS is I think brilliant the team have done very well.

    Thursday, July 19, 2007 2:39 PM
  • Neither developers not testers have been "refused access" to the released product.

     

    The software-only version (for those who want to buy the product) and 180-day trial versions will be available in due course, once WHS is released.

    Friday, July 20, 2007 12:58 AM
  • So, to be clear, MSDN developers will not be able to download WHS through their MSDN subscription; we will have to buy a copy of WHS if we want to use it for development (longer than the 180 day trial, that is)?

     

     

    Monday, August 6, 2007 4:57 PM
  • My understanding is that it will not be available through MSDN at launch. This situation may change subsequently - as far as I know, there hasn't been an update from the WHS Team so presumably they don't have any news at present.

     

    I have been corrected that the eval period will be 120 days rather than the 180 days that the RC is, but if you want to use it beyond that period then you'll need fresh keys (fresh downloads and probably a fresh VM), or to buy a copy of the software if that period is not long enough.

     

    Remember that for the purposes of the SDK you only need the handful of DLLs, though obviously you'll need a machine to test the results.

     

    In my case I'll be using it at home so I'll be buying a copy anyway.

    Monday, August 6, 2007 11:15 PM
  • To the extent that the WHS team is listening to the forums for feedback, I agree with the many others in the forums who feel that WHS should be available for at some some MSDN subscription levels.

    I understand the argument about "home SKUs" not being available over MSDN, but it doesn't apply here. We're not talking about Halo or Flight Simulator -- it's a server product that Microsoft is trying to get developers excited about developing for as a platform. No different than the Vista or Windows XP Home SKUs, which are included in MSDN.

    The DevDiv/MSDN folks did the right thing a while back by changing their minds on the Expression products and including those in MSDN. I'm hoping that feedback from the development community will lead to the same result here.

    I'll be purchasing WHS for my home use either way, but I'm not excited about having to buy additional retail licenses just to properly test applications/add-ins that target WHS. I don't find the "120-day demo" option to be adequate for the development community either... it's great for those who want to take it for a test drive as an end-use, but not so much for a developer who's going to want to build on the platform beyond a four month time period.


    Monday, August 13, 2007 3:48 AM
  •  

    I have an MSDN licence.  Personally I won't be touching WHS as a target platform if I can't get hold of it though MSDN.   It's dissapointing, but that's Microsoft's call. 

     

    I'm not going through setting the whole thing up everytime someone has reported a bug in my plugin.

     

    Why?  My theory is money.  The first wave of people purchasing this thing will probably be the geeks.   Wait for the push it will get through TechEd.

     

    Cheers,

    Matt.

    Tuesday, August 14, 2007 12:57 PM
  •  

    As buggy as the RC was for me, I'm going to wait until v2 before i make any plans or a purchace with WHS.
    Tuesday, August 14, 2007 2:26 PM
  • and it gets worse, just read on the “MS Windows Home Server” blog (http://mswhs.com/2007/08/14/bits-bobs/)  that Microsoft are “likely”  NOT going to release the evaluation via download but charge us for they to post us a copy!!!

    They really want to extract the maximum amount of money from us don’t they.

    I will be buying a copy as soon as the distributer I use has one in stock, but I will not be developing against a copy I will be using for real at home. I also will not develop against an evaluation copy that I have to rebuild every 120 days, because sods law says that I will be trying to debug a customer issue when the eval runs out.

     

    Are they trying to stop they micro ISV from developing for WHS or is Microsoft short of cash?

     

     

     

     

    Wednesday, August 15, 2007 7:36 AM
  • Well, this is Philip's opinion, not the official word of course.

     

    However, it's possible that MS may take this approach in order to avoid the problems that have been experienced here by some users regarding the disk images and DVD drives. The cost for mailing the disk is usually minimal - it's not exactly a money spinner.

     

    So, you don't trust your add-in enough to run it on your own machine, eh? Wink

    Wednesday, August 15, 2007 1:07 PM
  •  

    There’s  a difference between running released code and developing, testing and researching what you can do!

     

    I’m not going to use it for testing while say the wife is trying to stream music from it, it would not go down to good.

    Wednesday, August 15, 2007 1:30 PM
  • I agree, but couldn't resist pulling your leg!

    (And you're absolutely right there!)

    Wednesday, August 15, 2007 2:08 PM
  • The evaluation will NOT be available for download. It will be a disk kit, that you pay S&H for, and get pressed disks from MS.

     

    Monday, August 20, 2007 1:30 AM
    Moderator
  • So it gets even better.  A bug is reported by one of my customers, I boot up Home Server to replicate, and it's expired.  So now I have to pay and order another disk set, wait for delivery, reinstall and possibly reconfigure the whole development environment before I can even start fixing the code.

     

    Doesn't make much sense to me.

     

    Cheers,

    Matt.

    Tuesday, August 21, 2007 1:21 AM
  • I sympathize with your situation, Matt, but I would have been very hesitant to provision clients on a beta OS, even with the imminent OEM release.
    Thursday, August 23, 2007 1:46 AM
  • Sorry for the confusion, but I'm talking about after release.  I agree with you about betas.  

     

    I'm not going to bother with Home Server as a platform if I can't get it though MSDN for the reasons stated.  I got enough platforms that my software can run on to worry about this one given the extra hassles of availibility.

     

    Cheers,

    Matt.

    Thursday, August 23, 2007 10:26 AM
  • Matt -

    I'm not sure how the thread got so far off track, but you've hit the nail on the head. The contest they're currently running, along with all the hype over the SDK, is clearly intended to get developers excited about WHS as a platform. Not making it available via MSDN sends just the opposite message

    Anyone who's been an MSDN subscriber at the Universal/Team System level for a while, and has seen the types/SKUs available when a new platform is released, sees that there's an inconsistency with this policy.

    Jeff
    Thursday, August 23, 2007 4:41 PM
  •  

    I think it’s all down to money.

     

    Because the oem cost is so low they want to have some return on their costs before they release it via msdn. I guess that they are assuming that developers are just going to buy copies.

     

    But I have a feeling that the majority of developers for WHS are going to be micro isv’s who will not have the spare cash to buy more than one copy.  But I’m willing to bet that they will be buying one for their home use!

     

     

    Thursday, August 23, 2007 6:31 PM
  •  

    Umm, since when do MSDN subscriptions not include home product skus?  Both Windows XP Home Edition and every copy of Windows Vista are in my subscription.  I cannot imagine why Windows Home Server would not be included.  I have jumped in a little late into this product, but I have a few ideas on what I can add to the product, but now I can't access it.

     

    If Microsoft wants ISVs to develop for the product, it needs to be part of the MSDN subscription.

    Wednesday, August 29, 2007 5:19 PM
  • mildlymad = 100% agreement.

    This is par for the course and exactly how M$ treated us to Media Center.   Beta, and pilot groups.  Develop cool toys for MCE, release to the public and no MSDN for 6 months.

    Deja Vu...

     

    Tuesday, September 4, 2007 5:41 PM
  • Another bump.  No MSDN = No Dev.
    Sunday, September 9, 2007 4:13 PM
  • Just another MSDN Subscriber\MS Partner\ISV looking forward to WHS on MSDN... I will be purchasing WHS for my home but wouuld like to have it as part of my dev environment here at work to play\experiment with.  It shouldn't be this hard to get a straight answer on this... very frustrating.

    Monday, September 17, 2007 11:03 PM
  • I'm sorry, but you've already had a straight answer (just not the one you're looking for):

    WHS will not be available on MSDN at this time.

    It's always possible that Microsoft will change their minds at some point in the future, like they did with MCE, but for now, no MSDN.
    Tuesday, September 18, 2007 12:19 AM
    Moderator
  • K, thanks you're right there are plenty of straight answers and none I like. I understand that it’s not available at this time and that it might be in the future but I want to know why?  I'll assume it’s just a business decision on MS's part and I won't be privy to it but at least MS is consistent at being inconsistent  (don't take that the wrong way, I'm a big time MS fan boy).  I just figured that with the way the whole MCE thing went down, MS saw that as a mistake; one of my biggest gripes with anyone is making the same mistake twice... I think most of us here see WHS as a huge opportunity that the smaller ISV's can get behind from the start but feel shackled by these unnecessary policies (and I'm not only referring to getting it via MSDN, just getting it period)

     

    I just don't get why they would keep products out of the hands of the developers that can only enhance the product, hopefully make it more popular and facilitate its transition to the main stream.  I'm excited about trying to develop for WHS now, not a year from now or if and when it becomes available...

     

    Anyways... sorry for venting, I will just have to patiently and humbly wait.

    Tuesday, September 18, 2007 4:02 PM
  • I've got to chime in as well.

     

    I just don't get the thinking at Microsoft sometimes.  People pay a fair price for MSDN subscriptions.  Sure if you look at the cost of the associated software it is a fabulous deal, but then I bet a significant percentage of people don't utilize even half of what they get.  The key is having access to all Microsoft technologies and products when you need it.  I really like to know that if I have to start digging into something from Microsoft that I have a good chance of having it in the bag-o-msdn tricks.

     

    From Microsofts perspective MSDN Subscriptions should be a HUGE vehicle to get developers on board with new technologies.  Why the heck can't Microsoft recognize the value of making things easy and cheap for the people that will evangelize and develop new solutions/addons for their products?

     

    Sure Microsoft will lose a little revenue for those MSDN subscribers that use something like WHS for their own personal use, but come on, think of the bigger picture here.  How many developers that would not have otherwise even been aware of WHS will pick it up and create cool new stuff for it?

     

    It continues to dissapoint me when Microsoft makes decisions like this...

     

     

    Tuesday, September 25, 2007 4:05 PM
  • I wonder if this is connected to the fact that, in general, they see the market as through the hardware vendors, at least initially and this is to give them a clear run at the market place.

    As far as costs are concerned, I've gone ahead and bought myself a copy, if I get one by MSDN, all well and good - it will be put to good use!

     

    Colin

     

    Tuesday, September 25, 2007 5:37 PM
  •  

    I think I'm just echoing what's already been said:  I'm disappointed that WHS won't be available for download at all whatever the version.  I'm confused on the reasoning since the WHS team does seem to want to encourage development on the product.  I am purchasing my own personal copy for home use but I'm sure as heck not going to use it for developing apps - that's suicidal.  And above all, I'm really frustrated that the open communication and transparency that was evident when the WHS beta first kicked off has gone slightly opaque and we're not hearing the reasons behind the decisions that we see as nonsensical. 

     

    I'm sure someone at MS has their reasons for the decisions that have been made.  I just wish there was an explanation to go along with those decisions.  Wishful thinking, I'm sure.

    Tuesday, September 25, 2007 7:14 PM
  • then *another* reason not to continue my MSDN subscription;  with the number of alternatives mushrooming along with MS's apparent lack of support for single ot small development teams, the return on the investment continues to decline

    Tuesday, September 25, 2007 10:13 PM
  • Here is some potentially good news... glad I didn't immediately order an OEM license for development use.

    http://blogs.msdn.com/msdnsubscriptions/archive/2007/10/08/product-availability-for-vista-sp1-xp-sp3-and-windows-home-server.aspx
    Wednesday, October 10, 2007 12:05 AM
  • This is good news  - at least they are considering it now, and it appears to be a matter of when rather than if it will appear on MSDN.

     

    In the mean time, is there any way of getting hold of the RC version? I have signed up for Connect and have got a Product Key but cannot find anywhere to request the software from. Normally its the key that is harder to get hold of!

    Wednesday, October 17, 2007 2:34 PM
  •  

    Sorry Adrockx but the RC software is no longer available for download. You can still get keys because Microsoft cannot shut that feature off.


    You should be able to order the 120 day evaluation version from the MS website shortly though.

     

    Andrew

    Wednesday, October 17, 2007 4:40 PM
    Moderator
  • I would just like to add my little two cents into the mix. I am also an MSDN subscriber, and I will not be considering WHS as a potential development platform without access to easily download the software through my MSDN account.

    Reloading a trial version every 120 days would make for a maddening dev platform, and I seriously doubt many of us would even consider it. I am also offended that MS would attempt to squeeze even more profit out of developers by forcing us to buy retail licenses of the software when we are already shelling out big bucks for MSDN subscriptions.

    It does look like they will be granting our wish at some point, but the sooner the better! I just tire over the fight to get our hands on every new piece of interesting software. As others have said, this really is like MCE all over again.
    Saturday, October 27, 2007 7:37 AM
  • I do hope it comes out soon. We are starting to do the budgets for next year's projects. I was hoping to include projects with WHS, but if it is not on MSDN they won't allow any projects to be developed for it. I just hoping they get in on MSDN before everyone's budgets are done. I don't want to have to wait a whole year until budget time again. I would help if they just told us WHEN it is going to be on MSDN.

    Monday, October 29, 2007 3:16 PM
  • As has already been posted, they are looking into putting it on MSDN, its not a done deal, and as such they cant say when.

     

    There will be a 120 day evaluation edition you could always work on in the short term

     

    Andrew

     

    Monday, October 29, 2007 4:01 PM
    Moderator
  •  

    Does anyone know if the 120day eval can be converted to a licensed version (MSDN or retail) without a reinstall?

    Monday, October 29, 2007 4:05 PM
  • I know they are looking into putting it on msdn, but I can not go to the management and ask for 200k for project X for WHS without telling them when my developers can get it from MSDN. What if it takes 6 months or even a year longer than planed to happen? No, the risk is far too high. I need a date it is going to happen. I don't care if it is not till July, but I need to know when.

    Monday, October 29, 2007 4:11 PM
  • Then I think you are out of luck because they have stated they are investigating it - these things can take a considerable amount of time so I wouldnt expect to hear anything for a few more months at least.

     

    And dont forget, there is always the possibility that it WONT appear on MSDN.

     

     

    Andrew

     

    Monday, October 29, 2007 4:15 PM
    Moderator
  • If your worried about a $180 piece of software, in a 200K budget, theres' something wrong!

    Just pop down the road and buy a copy, like the rest of us has done. It will give you the head start over the people who say they won't start developing until they get it via MSDN.

     

    Colin

    Monday, October 29, 2007 5:34 PM
  • We don't purchase expensive MSDN licences to then have to “just pop down the road and buy a copy” of something that falls into a category of software that is normally covered by our expensive MSDN licences !

     

    I have bought a copy for home use and I’m making a lot of use of it, but I will not use it for development.

     

    I also will not use an evaluation copy for any purpose within a product life cycle except for helping in the selling phase.

     

    Monday, October 29, 2007 5:50 PM
  • To be honest, I think that has been covered in depth in this thread and also in others.

     

    WHS is not currently on MSDN, it may eventually be part of it, but today it is not.

     

    Im not sure that I would agree that WHS "falls into a category of software that is normally covered by our expensive MSDN licences !" - WHS is a new and unique offering from Microsoft, even if it does say SERVER in the title.

     

    Although, I also do think that it should be included as part of MSDN before the backlash starts.... :-)

     

    At the end of the day, if companies want to start writing software for WHS, and effectively make money out of the product, then they can either buy a copy or two at $180 in the short term, or wait until it appears on MSDN, if it ever does. I can understand why companies wouldnt want to buy copies of software that may eventually appear on MSDN, but I would imagine that if there was a statement from Microsoft today that said "It will never ever ever appear on MSDN" then those same companies are unlikely to say "well ok then, we wont write software and sell it because you wont give it to us as part of our subscription" - they would go out and buy copies of the software in order to develop their own software and make money from it, just like every other company out there that wants to make money.

     

    Andrew 

     

    Monday, October 29, 2007 7:00 PM
    Moderator
  • I'm with Colin on this, and I do have MSDN and I don't have a 2k budget!

     

    (Good summary, Andrew)

    Monday, October 29, 2007 8:25 PM
  • I was just using 200k as an example. Anyway, for a software product that is not a lot.  According to Salary.com the average salary for a level 1 programmer is ~50k a year. Add in Taxes, 401k, health care, etc you are looking at a conservative cost of 70k a year per programmer. So let's say we are just using these straight out of college programmers, we are looking at about 34.4 programmer months. Now even for a very small team, say 4 -6 developers, we are looking at 5 - 8 months of funding.

     

    If we do something strange like add developers that have experience or a project manager that budget gets used up fast. Now $200 might not seem like very much, but when your budget is tight, it does. Then you add the need to do something crazy like test it on different hardware, or different network setups, so you need a few more copies. It adds up fast. It also looks really bad when you buy a MSDN license for the developers only to spend more money on development software.



    But I digress, sorry working on my Masters in Software Engineering, I let it get the better of me sometimes. Smile

    Monday, October 29, 2007 8:52 PM
  • :-)

     

    I think that even if WHS does appear on MSDN, it probably wont be for quite a while yet, so if companies want to get the jump on their competition they may have to bite the bullet and buy a few copies, or risk missing out on early opportunities.

     

    Andrew

     

    Monday, October 29, 2007 8:59 PM
    Moderator
  • I understand that big software houses with huge budgets should not have any problem buying as many copies of WHS as they need to develop their software. But here's the rub for me. MS has tried to court small developers into developing for WHS, and yet they still expect us to go out and buy the software when we already pay through the nose for MSDN.

    And furthermore, retail, OEM, and trial licenses are really not suited for development. That is why MSDN exists. For example, the EULA in the OEM version of WHS states that the software is tied to the original hardware it is installed onto. Part of the testing cycle in development is testing on multiple hardware configurations. I simply can't afford to buy that many licenses of WHS. No, $180 is not unreasonable for home use. Multiply that by ten, twenty, thirty testing configurations, and it is simply not practical for a small developer to develop on this platform without availability on MSDN.

    I realize that MSDN availability may be many months down the road. But please don't insult the smaller developers for not wanting to spend thousands of dollars on software and/or break the EULA in order to develop on WHS. It's a simple fact that many of us are going to have to wait.

    And yes, the "big boys" are going to beat us out the gate. That's exactly why many of us are so upset by this delay. And I realize that I can do nothing about it. However, I do know that MS watches these forums, and they have already listened to what we have to say. Therefore, I like to get my $0.02 out there.
    Saturday, November 3, 2007 7:47 AM
  • Off topic I know - but the 120 day evaluation version is now available for order

    http://www.microsoft.com/windows/products/winfamily/windowshomeserver/eval.mspx

     

    Saturday, November 3, 2007 7:56 AM
  • I dont think anyone on here is trying "to insult the smaller developers for not wanting to spend thousands of dollars...." in fact, I think you will find that most people, myself included, agree that WHS SHOULD appear on MSDN. I think the issue on this thread really is that something is being considered / looked at / may happen / etc for WHS on MSDN and so people continually posting that they pay for MSDN licences and that MS are trying to rip them off is actually counterproductive.

     

    Yes, Microsoft do monitor these forums, and the WHS team are actually active participants in the forums. However, as has been posted a few times, its not the WHS team that decide if WHS goes on MSDN, its the MSDN guys, and they are looking into to.

     

    I can see how the delay is frustrating to smaller deveopers, but surely you could obtain a copy of the OEM software, or the 120 day eval, and start your development process in the mean time? I appreciate you cant test it on every hardware platform, but isnt something better than nothing?

     

    Andrew

     

     

     

    Saturday, November 3, 2007 8:11 AM
    Moderator
  •  Andrew Edney wrote:
    Yes, Microsoft do monitor these forums, and the WHS team are actually active participants in the forums. However, as has been posted a few times, its not the WHS team that decide if WHS goes on MSDN, its the MSDN guys, and they are looking into to.
    Actually, I'm pretty sure it's a joint effort. Sometimes a product team will want to "hold back" their initial release of a product for a few months for whatever reason. It can (obviously) cause some bad feelings among MSDN subscribers (who typically expect just about everything that Microsoft produces will be available to them instantly); look at the initial release of Windows Media Center Edition. Unfortunately, they have the impression that Microsoft promises they'll get everything, which isn't actually true; "widest range" is not the same as "everything".

    I'm on Microsoft's (and especially the WHS team's) side in this; it's their product; they get to decide when (or if) it's available on MSDN. I think it should be, but they aren't required to release it.
    Saturday, November 3, 2007 1:33 PM
    Moderator
  • I certainly don't expect software to show up on MSDN immediately, nor do I feel entitled to it. However, I do expect software that Microsoft is pushing on developers to be available becasue that is the purpose of MSDN. Like I said, the OEM license is not meant to be used in development, so I have no intention of using it to develop. If, for whatever reason, they cannot make software available on MSDN right away, then they should not wave the SDK in our faces and cheer us on to develop on their unavailable platform. That is what I take offense at, and I feel it is justified.

    I am very happy that the trial is finally available, though. I have ordered a copy, and I fully intend to load it and start making development plans, but I certainly can't release any software until I have a more functional test bet. As others have said, I do not want the headache of re-loading the trial software every time a customer has an issue.

    Again, I am not trying to complain, but it is a simple fact that based on Microsoft's licensing practices, MSDN is a practical necessity for software developers. I know they are working on MSDN availability, and I will be very happy if and when it finally arrives.
    Monday, November 5, 2007 4:55 AM
  • Well, here's something else to consider: It might simply be a licensing issue related to the fact that, like MCE, this is something that is really being pushed through OEM hardware channels as a turn-key solution. Since there are lots of big vendors (hardware and otherwise) that have MSDN subscriptions for all the obvious reasons, it wouldn't be at all surprising if this has been done to encourage vendors to sign up to be "WHS-approved" hardware vendors. This way, Microsoft gets a bunch of OEMs to produce/market/support WHS boxes, which helps to give mindshare and legitimacy to the "platform," and the selected OEMs get first crack at selling their hardware before any "other" hardware vendors/whoever can do so once WHS is available with their MSDN subscription.

    Thursday, November 15, 2007 12:22 AM
  • I agree, we did fight that fight with Media Center, and eventually won. I am just sick of the fight.

    Media Center 2002 and 2004 weren't even available as OEM software, so even end-users and smaller system builders were completely out of luck until the 2005 version (which was a lot more stable and feature-rich in any case). And again, MCE 2005 was available through MSDN eventually, so I hope that WHS will be as well.

    I have ordered my trial copy, and I am eager to receive it. I have been delighted with WHS, and proud to be a beta tester. I just hope that Microsoft continues to make their products available on MSDN if they want developers to pay attention to the platform. My subscription is up for renewal next month, and it would certainly take the sting out of that annual $500 "contribution" I pay!


    Tuesday, November 20, 2007 9:30 AM
  •  PrincessNybor wrote:
    I agree, we did fight that fight with Media Center, and eventually won. I am just sick of the fight.

    Media Center 2002 and 2004 weren't even available as OEM software, so even end-users and smaller system builders were completely out of luck until the 2005 version (which was a lot more stable and feature-rich in any case). And again, MCE 2005 was available through MSDN eventually, so I hope that WHS will be as well.

    I have ordered my trial copy, and I am eager to receive it. I have been delighted with WHS, and proud to be a beta tester. I just hope that Microsoft continues to make their products available on MSDN if they want developers to pay attention to the platform. My subscription is up for renewal next month, and it would certainly take the sting out of that annual $500 "contribution" I pay!


     

    That part also annoys me - waiting for the trial copy.  I find it obnoxious enough that I can't download the trial copy that I'm simply not going to bother.  The whole thing is just silly.  If you're not going to make it available on MSDN - whatever, but then they go on to say use the eval which you have to go through this whole ringamarole to "order". 

     

    "Hello, this is 1995 - I want my software distribution model back."

    Saturday, November 24, 2007 8:34 PM
  • I vote for WHS on the MSDN ASAP
    Tuesday, November 27, 2007 9:44 PM
  •  jvrobert wrote:

     PrincessNybor wrote:
    I agree, we did fight that fight with Media Center, and eventually won. I am just sick of the fight.

    Media Center 2002 and 2004 weren't even available as OEM software, so even end-users and smaller system builders were completely out of luck until the 2005 version (which was a lot more stable and feature-rich in any case). And again, MCE 2005 was available through MSDN eventually, so I hope that WHS will be as well.

    I have ordered my trial copy, and I am eager to receive it. I have been delighted with WHS, and proud to be a beta tester. I just hope that Microsoft continues to make their products available on MSDN if they want developers to pay attention to the platform. My subscription is up for renewal next month, and it would certainly take the sting out of that annual $500 "contribution" I pay!


     

    That part also annoys me - waiting for the trial copy.  I find it obnoxious enough that I can't download the trial copy that I'm simply not going to bother.  The whole thing is just silly.  If you're not going to make it available on MSDN - whatever, but then they go on to say use the eval which you have to go through this whole ringamarole to "order". 

     

    "Hello, this is 1995 - I want my software distribution model back."

    Agreed.
    Thursday, December 6, 2007 3:11 PM
  • Microsoft, my vote is also to get this on MSDN as soon as possible for us developers.  But, I would not be surprised if it is finally released to MSDN in January after the CES event as encouragement for us to start working on it.

    Monday, December 10, 2007 9:50 AM
  • I hope this is the case. I finally purchased a retail license and built a fresh server (see new sig for specs), and I love the product! I have a couple of add-ins in mind that I am working on, but I am loathe to test them on my own server. I depend on this thing too much now, and I'm not that confident in my own coding abilities.

    The trial version that MS sent me is currently installed on my old Athlon 64 box as a test bed, but again, 120 days is pretty slim for software development. I really hope we get access to this on MSDN soon.
    Monday, December 31, 2007 12:04 PM
  • I'm adding my vote...

     

    I just installed the trial of WHS to check it out.  It appears to be a great platform and I'd like to make some time to try out the SDK and develop some add-ins.  However, I will not be buying two copies (one for dev and one for home production) to make this possible when I already have a MSDN subscription that is supposed to include copies of all OS software.  MS if you want developers' support then you're going to have to include WHS in MSDN.

     

    It seems that the value of a MSDN subscription is worth less every year, yet it costs more and more.  I still can't understand why I have to pay more to get TFS included...  Oh, and if I want to have access to all the TFS roles then I have to take out a 2nd mortgage...  Boy, do I miss the good ole days when MSDN Universal was around.  I wonder what kind of subscription plan I can get for Eclipse...

    Monday, January 21, 2008 5:40 PM
  • Microsoft have now stated that WHS WILL NOT appear as part of MSDN. Sorry guys!

     

    However, they are going to be providing support to ISVs who want to develops apps and add-ins for WHS.

     

    Andrew

     

    Monday, January 21, 2008 5:52 PM
    Moderator
  • Can you point to where this information is posted please Andrew, thanks.

     

    - a developer and MSDN subscriber -

    Monday, January 21, 2008 8:48 PM
  • Sure, I should have posted the link at the time :

     

    http://blogs.msdn.com/msdnsubscriptions/archive/2008/01/14/windows-home-server-a-follow-up.aspx

     

    It was also mentioned to the MVP's on the last MVP conference call.

     

    No reason was given, just that it was the decision that had been made.

     

    Andrew

     

    Monday, January 21, 2008 8:59 PM
    Moderator
  • I believe if your company wants to develop they should send e-mail to WHSISV@microsoft.com with company and product information to request to join partners program. This will give access to downloadable bits.

     

     

    Tuesday, January 29, 2008 8:09 PM
  •  

    I gave up on WHS going on MSDN and spent the money to purchase it. Yeah it sucks but sometimes you just got to suck up the cost and do what you need to do.
    Wednesday, January 30, 2008 3:09 AM
  • I also gave up on MDSN and have decided to spend my time and effort towards a linux home server project and develop apps for that platform instead. This whole project doesn't seem to be making much progress since the initial launch and these forums are filled with unresolved issues. The project team seems determined to drive this product and it's support into the ground. My two cents worth of frustration vented and I'm out of here.

     

     

    Friday, February 1, 2008 2:27 PM
  • I can’t help but thinking that our MSDN licenses have been devalued somewhat.

     

    The issue here is NOT the $180 dollar licenses, but rather the value of MSDN in general.

    It seems that decisions are being made very arbitrarily and this is going to hurt ISV's.

     

    Not because of the money, but because every one of us who want to work on this is going to have to explain this insanity to a business person at the company we work for.  Most people familiar with the MSDN program would assume WHS would be included.  The Visual Studio 2005 (pick our flavor)/MSDN level fiasco was hard enough to explain.   So now another story of Microsoft’s arbitrary decision making is going to travel up every ISVs decision making chain.

     

    Additionally, when it comes time to renew the MSDN license questions may now arise about its value, considering these arbitrary policy changes that seem to occur.  Departments may have to spend time justifying their exact use of MSDN and how it saves them money.

     

    Seems to me that Microsoft needs to stop listening to the bean counters and start doing more innovating!

     

    Build products that are so compelling, that you want to give every developers a copy.

    Otherwise what you’re really saying is that, the only people interested in this product are developers ( so you better not release it to MSDN ). 

     

     

    Christopher

     

    Friday, February 1, 2008 9:54 PM
  • Did anyone else notice the 2/5/08 update on the MSDN blog Andrew linked a few posts up? This makes it sound like the offering of WHS on MSDN is purely down to logistics at this point.

    2/5/08 Update: Thanks again for all of your feedback on the decision to not include WHS in MSDN Subscriptions. ALL of your feedback has been shared with the Product Group, and I believe they know realize that it would have been good and appropriate to have included it.

    Unfortunately there are valid logistical issues which make reversing this decision at this time not possible since Subscriber volumes were not included in their original planning. At the point they have the opportunity to make this available, I believe they will have a much more deliberate discussion and I believe it will be made available based on your feedback and several follow up discussions with the Product Group.



    Source

    I find this highly encouraging! Hopefully, we'll see WHS show up in MSDN somewhere down the line.
    Thursday, May 22, 2008 5:49 PM
  • What about WHS for ISV ????

     

    -Dieter

    Thursday, June 5, 2008 11:23 PM