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Why MSN Will Always be a Waste of Time RRS feed

  • Question

  • First let me say this. If MSN ever does buy Google. I will be the first one to slit my wrists. Most of the people making a living on the web will be out of a Job.

    It doesn't take a web guru to figure out MSN live doesn't have a clue on how to compete with the other major search engines. Just look at the forums. Not just here, but at any webmaster forum. MSN has forgotten one of the most important successes of the internet. Finding information. When they limit that ability to find information, whether it is delivered in a technically correct way or not. They are limiting a free exchange of Ideas and information.

    I have given up with these folks and I advise you to do the same. Unless they change their elitist attitude they will not get any better. I would not bother except I read the forums here to check on the improvement(or lack of) hoping maybe they will "get it". Well, not yet they haven't. This comment from the web moderator really inspired me to write this entry

    "There are a lot of reasons why sites don't get indexed or don't have the depth (number of pages indexed) webmasters would like."


    Maybe so, but unfortunately you, nor MSN knows them. I have two sites built the same way, same age. Both Joomla sites, with different content. One ranks the one does not. No need trying to figure out why,  because there is no reason.




    "One of the big challenges is ensuring that the sites linking to them are quality sites.  As a webmaster, you need to ensure not only that there is great content on your site, but that you get the right kind of people and sites linking to you. "



    That is the biggest load or Horse Pucky I have ever heard. Now we have to monitor who is linking to us? Get real Bret, I have 40 sites. How do you propose I divide up my time to monitor all of my back links? Even if I could I wouldn't, because YOU PROVIDE NO TRAFFIC !  You really are terrible.  I have wasted hours upon hours trying to get sites added to MSN Live.  Hours I could have spent on new sites or updating content.


     

    Ensure that your site follows our indexing guidelines. I recommend reading the techniques section.  A lot of sites that are ranking low, may have a issue that is being caused (whether inadvertantly or not) by items in this section.


    You can do all of that, but it won't help. Just look at the site at www.rpnewspaper.com. It's a new one I have been

    building for the last 4 months. Not indexed on MSN off course, but everyone else picked it up right away. If what you are wanting is only sites that are technically perfect then good luck with that. Some of the best information I get comes from the clunky looking sites. The Mom and Pop sites.


    Your real agenda is that MSN wants to control WHAT information gets indexed and they want to control WHO supplies that information and more importantly they would love to control WHERE the information is to be found.This is so MSN can market to Larger companies, who will buy more search related advertising. It is all about the money.


    In conclusion, If I am looking for widgets. I want to find widgets. I do not care if the finding of widgets is techically correct. I do not care who the widget dealer is back linked to. I just want to find widgets without a lot of hassle. Until they understand that, they will be a waste of our time.


    I do have widgets for sale. I even have Widgets that nobody else on the web has! I have Unique Widgets! But...you will have to go to GOOGLE or YAHOO to find them, they don't show up here.

    Tuesday, April 1, 2008 10:36 AM

Answers

  • Hi,

     

    I cannot tell you why your sites were blocked or not getting indexed. However, if you feel we made an error (and if we did I would like to apologize), I strongly suggest you try our reinclusion form. Filling out the form will kick off a (mostly) manual review of your sites.

     

    Brett

    Friday, April 4, 2008 9:58 PM

All replies

  • I agree with u,

    I just started reading this forum because of guess what? MSN doesn't index my site!!! I'm glad I read your post before I wasted more time trying to find out what I was doing wrong or missing in my site. I had the feeling that it wasn't me since, like u said, google has no problem indexing my site's pages.

    In my opinion Google has made it's market by actually trying to index all possible pages and then trying to rank it's relevancy, not by excluding what it thinks is not important. It's up to the user to says what's important and what's not. If the user wants to search a million pages, let him. You might find what YOU want in page number 50, not number 1 like the search engine thinks.

    Anyway, I'll be checking everynow and then to see if MSN actually understands the business they are in with Live Search.
    Wednesday, April 2, 2008 6:08 PM
  • I have to thank you, I myself was wondering why my web site was not showing up in MSN search yet its listed #1 in google & Yahoo using a set of key words I setup for publishing purposes which allowes me to insure indexing of the site. And as for them telling me I need to have great content  on my site... Well they need to get a grip, my content is my business.

     

    kk im done venting, thx again for the info

    Update: 02-06-2009 I'm listed in Live search, it took a long time to get there...?

    • Edited by drjaam Friday, February 6, 2009 8:36 PM
    Friday, April 4, 2008 8:44 PM
  • Hi,

     

    I cannot tell you why your sites were blocked or not getting indexed. However, if you feel we made an error (and if we did I would like to apologize), I strongly suggest you try our reinclusion form. Filling out the form will kick off a (mostly) manual review of your sites.

     

    Brett

    Friday, April 4, 2008 9:58 PM
  • Then do something about it.
    Here is what I am doing about it.
    To help cure the problem I am adding to the bottom of the home page of all the web sites I build and run, and encourge everyone else to do the same or something similar, (http://www.americanbandogs.com) you will not find this or any of my sites listed in MSN. No link farms or link pages, no hidden text, not even any errors w3 compliant and tagged as such, but some how accussed of spam and been dropped on  5 sites so far.

    We are sorry for the inconvience of not being able to find this site on MSN live. This Site and many other quality sites are not being indexed by MSN live. Improve your search results and see what sites you have been missing, use google.
    If you are using Internet Explorer here is a link to update it to IE7 with Google set as the search engine.


    IE7 UPGRADE


    This is giving MSN more respect then it has shown many sites. There is no rules or laws saying that they have to index any web site, but if they are going to be a search engine, then they need to do it right or let all the users know that are a lot more sites available that they don't even list. Even Google offers you the other search engines, I guess they feel they have done their job right and not affraid of loosing any users.



    Sunday, April 6, 2008 8:36 PM
  • I have the same problem with my website. I am No. 1 in Google and No. 1 in Yahoo! with my keywords but with live search... Zilch! Nada! None! Not existing! I have submitted my site a couple of times... and guess what... more nothing! It's been six months and my site was still not indexed for my keywords. I didn't even make it to the last page of the search.

    The funny thing about this is my domain name contains the keywords. Actually, the domain name is made up of only the two keywords. That's why I can't believe it that I didn't make it even on the last page. My site was under Google's radar after 2 months. Yahoo! placed us No. 1 after 3 months. But how come we we not in MSN's radar?



    I'm really wondering what "quality content" means to live search. I didn't even find quality content with the keywords I used when i tried to use MSN search for the keywords. In short, when I used MSN, I didn't find what I was looking for.

    I hope MSN realizes that "quality content" means the website has quality content. Period. It means that when a person types in the keywords, he gets some relevant information with those keywords. It's just that plain simple.
    Monday, July 28, 2008 7:49 PM
  • Hi there

     

    Great, I've found like minded users of MSN's webmaster tools. I drop in this forum from time to time just to see if there have been any developments, usually there aren't any. But you lot have got it bang on, your thoughts are my thoughts. We all know we are wasting our time here, we all know that the only true search engines worth running after are mighty Google and Yahoo. The funny thing though, is that we don't have to run after them, they come and find us. Anyone altering their site to pander to MSN's so called guidelines is wasting their time, the sooner they come to terms with that the better.

    Good luck to you all in this thread, you all seem to know what you're talking about, perhaps MSN should sign you all up to develop their webmaster tools, they might actually understand what is going on in the real world then.

     

    Mark

    Friday, August 8, 2008 7:07 PM
  • I definitely agree with Mark. Webmaster tools are both useless and unpredictable. A couple of weeks ago, my site could be validated, now all I get is "The site address isn't valid." in the "add a site" section. That was after I contacted the support because my site wasn't appearing in the search results. Moral of the story: contacting the support team is not only useless, it may actually make things worse. All I received in my email box was a friggin POLL about my satisfaction with live services. It would crack me up if I wasn't doing this for a living. I'll just forget about MSN from now on.
    Monday, August 11, 2008 6:32 AM
  •  lappydoods wrote:
    I have the same problem with my website. I am No. 1 in Google and No. 1 in Yahoo! with my keywords but with live search... Zilch! Nada! None! Not existing! I have submitted my site a couple of times... and guess what... more nothing! It's been six months and my site was still not indexed for my keywords. I didn't even make it to the last page of the search.


    Same here :-(
    Monday, August 11, 2008 1:59 PM
  •  Jarod_ wrote:
     lappydoods wrote:
    I have the same problem with my website. I am No. 1 in Google and No. 1 in Yahoo! with my keywords but with live search... Zilch! Nada! None! Not existing! I have submitted my site a couple of times... and guess what... more nothing! It's been six months and my site was still not indexed for my keywords. I didn't even make it to the last page of the search.



    Same here :-(

     

    Same exact thing here, but sometimes, somehow, MAGICALLY MSN ranks my site well and then POOF...its gone again even if my pages haven't changed. LOL

     

    Oh well...MSN is just very inconsisten right now.

     

     

    Thanks

    Monday, August 11, 2008 8:08 PM
  • I took rpnewspaper's advice and had a look at his website newspaper.com.  The claim was that all the other search engines had picked this up, but Live missed the boat.

     

    I did searches for "news in motion".  This seemed reasonable because this term appears three times in the four paragraphs of text on the home page.  Four paragraphs, totaling 174 words.  This is the only page of this website, as far as I could tell.

     

    For searches on "news in motion", newspaper.com ranked # 7 at ask.com, # 1 at yahoo.com, and # 1 at altavista.com.  It was not in the first 420 results in a google.com search.  It was not in the first 420 results in a live.com search.  I stopped looking through the results after 420 at google.com and live.com.

     

    So, Live matches Google in ranking newspaper.com lower than #420.

     

    I then checked on the number of backlinks that google.com lists for newspaper.com.  It listed 4.  This strikes me as a tad on the low side to expect instant recognition of a website that contains a total of less than 200 words of text.

     

    One of the links google found was on this page --> www.killerstartups.com/tag/emergency/ 

     

    I looked for newspaper.com on the page, but couldn't find it.  It is, however, in the HTML code within a CSS span that says display:none.  This doesn't strike me as strictly above board - could killerstartups.com be another of the 40 websites that keep rpnewspaper so busy that he can't find time to check backlinks?

     

    Based on the information I uncovered, I would say it is just a bit premature to condemn Live for not casting out palm leaves because rpnewspaper had honored the internet with newspaper.com.

     

    ... Duane

    Thursday, August 14, 2008 2:22 PM
  • "Based on the information I uncovered, I would say it is just a bit premature to condemn Live for not casting out palm leaves because rpnewspaper had honored the internet with newspaper.com."

    Well that is because you took a lot of time but you  went to the wrong site. My site is RPNEWSPAPER.com not newspaper.com which is the one you researched. In my haste to complain I left of the rp off of the name, so my bad.

    For what it's worth. I had to change my structure to get listed in msn. For some reason they would not index me if I installed Joomal installlation in a folder other than the root folder. Google had no problem with this. I have now restructured the site and moved the main part of the site to the root. I have had to do this on a lot of them. My search position dropped in google after doing this and my positions in MSN are dismal.
    Friday, November 14, 2008 11:52 AM
  •  rpnewspaper wrote:
    For what it's worth. I had to change my structure to get listed in msn. For some reason they would not index me if I installed Joomal installlation in a folder other than the root folder. Google had no problem with this. I have now restructured the site and moved the main part of the site to the root. I have had to do this on a lot of them. My search position dropped in google after doing this and my positions in MSN are dismal.


    I too have given up on msn.

    I too am a Joomla user, and have the same structures on two sites - one has numerous pages indexed by msn, the other is abismal (but my number #1 site in Google and Yahoo). Other SEs index all - no issues, no blocks - no problems - high in SERPs.

    Having attempted to raise the issues with msn here (especially a canonicalisation problem which msn can't give me an explanation for), I got the assurance of "help" but in reality it was the brush off - very disappointing. It appears that msn respond selectively. So I'm coming to the conclusion that there are multiple issues (not with my site) but with msn.

    However, if msn care to revisit my problem (after almost a month of ignoring it) then you can see it here:

    http://forums.microsoft.com/webmaster/ShowPost.aspx?PostID=4068190&SiteID=79

    Failing this, then perhaps someone can tell me where I can remove all my indexed pages, in order I can re-submit them, as the ones indexed are a joke.







    Monday, December 1, 2008 3:44 PM
  • Give it time remember since MSN broke Brett sits there and crawls the web, typing out the infomation on every page, well only a few pages, as he only types with one finger. The poor man is trying to do what google bot does but he just can't keep up.

     

     

    Monday, December 1, 2008 4:45 PM
  • I cannot tell you why your sites were blocked or not getting indexed. However, if you feel we made an error (and if we did I would like to apologize), I strongly suggest you try our reinclusion form. Filling out the form will kick off a (mostly) manual review of your sites.

     

    Brett


    With all due respect Brett, it doesn't work.  I have tried that more than once.  "Live is Broke"


    Respectfully Yours,


    Robert Warren

    Monday, December 1, 2008 5:24 PM