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  • Question

  • Thanks for the update. Will this delay the release of the Power Pack? Will this patch and the Power Pack be released at the same time?

     

    Monday, March 10, 2008 7:00 PM

Answers

All replies

  • I moved this from being a response in the KB update thread to being a separate thread.

     

    We have always planned on holding the release of Power Pack 1 until we had the data corruption issue resolved.   The Power Pack 1 code was "put on the shelf" in early January, as the team switched focus to working on the data corruption issue.  There is some new functionality in Power Pack 1 like the ability to backup your Shared Folders to an external hard drive attached to your home server that some home server users have asked us to ship.  There also is some new remote access functionality (photo thumbnails, multi-file uploads), and a collection of fixes.

     

    Knowing that the home server team has a current estimate of June, 2008 for the fix for the data corruption issue, do people believe that the team should "dust off" the Power Pack 1 code and release prior to a fix for the data corruption issue? 

     

     

     

     

     

     

    Monday, March 10, 2008 7:31 PM
  • Actually, the feature of Power Pack 1 that I need urgently is the 64 bit WHS connector. Not that the other features are not welcome, they are just not as important in comparison. And yes: If you could provide this without affecting the corruption bux fix schedule, I would appreciate it.

     

    Regards, Martin

     

    Monday, March 10, 2008 7:45 PM
  •  T. Headrick wrote:
    I moved this from being a response in the KB update thread to being a separate thread.

     

    We have always planned on holding the release of Power Pack 1 until we had the data corruption issue resolved.   The Power Pack 1 code was "put on the shelf" in early January, as the team switched focus to working on the data corruption issue.  There is some new functionality in Power Pack 1 like the ability to backup your Shared Folders to an external hard drive attached to your home server that some home server users have asked us to ship.  There also is some new remote access functionality (photo thumbnails, multi-file uploads), and a collection of fixes.

     

    Knowing that the home server team has a current estimate of June, 2008 for the fix for the data corruption issue, do people believe that the team should "dust off" the Power Pack 1 code and release prior to a fix for the data corruption issue?

     

    First, let me start off by saying that I have not been bitten by any corruption with my data and I continue to store music/videos/pics/personal data on my server (I just don't edit anything while it's stored there; I copy it to my workstation, edit it, then move it back).  (However, I'm sure people that have experienced that problem will have a different opinion.)  IMO, I don't see any reason to hold the PP1 code back and wait until the data corruption patch is released (unless the PP1 code makes the data corruption happen more frequently, which I seriously doubt is the case, judging by the detailed explanation given as to what causes the problem).  I, for one, am looking forward to the new features of PP1 and would like to get it sooner rather than later.

    Monday, March 10, 2008 7:49 PM
    Moderator
  •  Tinue wrote:

    Actually, the feature of Power Pack 1 that I need urgently is the 64 bit WHS connector.

     

    Agreed.

    Monday, March 10, 2008 7:55 PM
  • Since I use it only for backup, with no editing at this time, I vote for release of any new features as soon as they are completed and felt to be solid.

    Monday, March 10, 2008 7:58 PM
  • I also agree to get the PP1 asap. The corruption bug should not refrain from having any other new features, unless they harm the WHS. We have to move forward, not backward. Let the guys at MSFT do their job and when they are ready to release the corruption patch, they just do so.

     

    Klode

     

    Monday, March 10, 2008 8:46 PM
    Moderator
  •  

    Yeah, I too say get it out the door - as long as the team thinks it won't compromise the corruption fix. I've put a lot of time and effort into ensuring our network has sufficient redundancy to not be affected should any corruption occur - and am continuing some experimentation - so I'm cautiously confident of the WHS box. But with three months or so to wait, anything that gives me a sense of 'moving forward' before then would be welcome...

     

    Bill

    Monday, March 10, 2008 8:49 PM
  • When it comes to 'features' versus rock-solid, assured, bug-free data storage, I'd push 'features' onto the back burner.

     

    The problems at present are -

     

    (a) I don't know whether my so-far still intact data will suddenly get corrupted.

    (There have been many reports of corruption appearing out-of-the-blue.)

     

    (b) There are no guaranteed checks that I can run on my system to clarify whether my data is even vulnerable.

    I don't know if it is vulnerable, and I don't know that it isn't vulnerable. That's in spite of the KB updates, and in spite of my fully understanding the "work-arounds".

     

    (c) In order to reduce my (possible) vulnerability, I have turned OFF folder sharing / DE on all shares.

     

    (d) As a way of coping with all the above, and to keep my WHS-hopes alive, I'm spending some time each day to progressively verify a portion of my thousands of files.

     

    In the meantime I'm running a handicapped (no duplication) backup server (WHS) with fingers and toes crossed, and unable therefore to reclaim the GB of HDD storage I hoped to release by trusting some of it to WHS.

     

    So ... you bet I want the fix first, earliest, soonest, ASAP, without delay, and I don't care a monkey's about any further features or bells or whistles or other boast-worthy extras from the WHS Development Team.

     

    I vote that you get the fundamentals sorted first please!!

     

    Colin P.

    Monday, March 10, 2008 8:55 PM
  •  CSPea wrote:

    When it comes to 'features' versus rock-solid, assured, bug-free data storage, I'd push 'features' onto the back burner.

     

    The problems at present are -

     

    (a) I don't know whether my so-far still intact data will suddenly get corrupted.

    (There have been many reports of corruption appearing out-of-the-blue.)

     

    (b) There are no guaranteed checks that I can run on my system to clarify whether my data is even vulnerable.

    I don't know if it is vulnerable, and I don't know that it isn't vulnerable. That's in spite of the KB updates, and in spite of my fully understanding the "work-arounds".

     

    (c) In order to reduce my (possible) vulnerability, I have turned OFF folder sharing / DE on all shares.

     

    (d) As a way of coping with all the above, and to keep my WHS-hopes alive, I'm spending some time each day to progressively verify a portion of my thousands of files.

     

    In the meantime I'm running a handicapped (no duplication) backup server (WHS) with fingers and toes crossed, and unable therefore to reclaim the GB of HDD storage I hoped to release by trusting some of it to WHS.

     

    So ... you bet I want the fix first, earliest, soonest, ASAP, without delay, and I don't care a monkey's about any further features or bells or whistles or other boast-worthy extras from the WHS Development Team.

     

    I vote that you get the fundamentals sorted first please!!

     

    Colin P.

     

    I would agree with you except, based on what Todd is implying by his comments, it sounds to me like PP1 is already done.  If that assumption is correct (and PP1 doesn't make the corruption problem worse obviously), there is no reason not to release it now.  (Now if code still needs to be written for PP1, which would take away time and effort from the WHS team completely fixing the corruption problem, I completely agree with you.)

     

     

    Monday, March 10, 2008 9:16 PM
    Moderator
  • Here are my two cents/questions:

    • Did the whole team really need to focus on this bug? That kind of surprises me.
    • Given where the bug is, it seems like only a small group can fix it. So, the rest could move back to PP1.
    • If you wait to release PP1 and the bug fix togeather, could you add some more features to PP1?
    • I am just interested, does the bug exist in Server 2003/Server 2008 but only manifests itself in WHS?

    I am really enjoying WHS. I am looking forward to this fix and PP1.

     

    Monday, March 10, 2008 9:26 PM
  • Colin, I think you misunderstand what Todd is proposing (which is why I kind of hoped he wouldn't propose it Smile ).

    Microsoft believes that PP1 is effectively done. There have been no changes to the code base since January. I assume that means that there are no potential show-stopper bugs in the tracking tools. What he has asked is whether Microsoft should sit on PP1 for three more months (or more) in order to make sure the fix for KB946676 is done or release it sooner.

    My own opinion is that Microsoft should release it. The server backup in particular can help alleviate the risk of file corruption due to KB946676. There are other "nice to haves" as well. This is a change from my opinion of many weeks ago when I told Todd (I think the best description would be "strongly worded but polite dismay" Smile ) that PP1 could go hang until the file corruption issue is fixed. I've changed my mind because I think getting server backup out into the field will help users.

    And if they decide to release it, it will have no impact on the effort to correct the file corruption issue. If I thought for a second that it would delay KB946676, I'd already have written another one of those emails full of "strongly worded but polite dismay." Which I haven't...
    Monday, March 10, 2008 9:31 PM
    Moderator
  • PP1 - server backup options and WHS 64 bit connector... Yes, bring it on!

    Monday, March 10, 2008 9:31 PM
  • Michael, the whole team doesn't need to focus on KB946676. For example, I doubt that the user interface people have been involved in more than a "let's try this" role. But PP1 is effectively in the can already; adding more features would mean another round of testing and bug fixing, which would delay it several more months (probably well past the June time frame).

    As for the bug, it's entirely within Windows Home Server. Windows Server 2003/2008 is not affected by this issue, as the KB article takes pains to make clear.
    Monday, March 10, 2008 9:35 PM
    Moderator
  •  CSPea wrote:

    When it comes to 'features' versus rock-solid, assured, bug-free data storage, I'd push 'features' onto the back burner.

     

    The problems at present are -

     

    ...

     

    (c) In order to reduce my (possible) vulnerability, I have turned OFF folder sharing / DE on all shares.

     

    ...

     

    So ... you bet I want the fix first, earliest, soonest, ASAP, without delay, and I don't care a monkey's about any further features or bells or whistles or other boast-worthy extras from the WHS Development Team.

     

    I vote that you get the fundamentals sorted first please!!

     

    Colin P.

     

    Colin - thanks for the feedback, 

     

    One comment on your assumption, just turning off Duplication on Shared Folders is not enough.  The easiest way to protect yourself is to have a single hard drive home server.  If you can't do that then you should heed the following advice:

     

    Until a software fix for Windows Home Server is available, users may choose to act to help limit the possibility of being affected by this issue.  In the Knowledge Base article http://support.microsoft.com/kb/946676 we suggest some precautionary measures that users may choose to take.

    ·      Employ Windows Explorer or a command line tool to copy files to and from the Windows Home Server

    ·      Do not use applications to directly edit or change files that are stored on Windows Home Server.

    ·      Do not use media management programs, such as Windows Media Player, to import files to the Windows Home Server. 

    ·      Do not redirect applications to access files that are stored in the Shared Folders, as some applications may make changes to the metadata of a file without explicit user action. 

     

    Monday, March 10, 2008 9:38 PM
  •  CSPea wrote:

    When it comes to 'features' versus rock-solid, assured, bug-free data storage, I'd push 'features' onto the back burner.

     

    The problems at present are -

     

    ...

     

    (c) In order to reduce my (possible) vulnerability, I have turned OFF folder sharing / DE on all shares.

     

    ...

     

    So ... you bet I want the fix first, earliest, soonest, ASAP, without delay, and I don't care a monkey's about any further features or bells or whistles or other boast-worthy extras from the WHS Development Team.

     

    I vote that you get the fundamentals sorted first please!!

     

    Colin P.

     

    Colin - thanks for the feedback, 

     

    One comment on your assumption, just turning off Duplication on Shared Folders is not enough.  The easiest way to protect yourself is to have a single hard drive home server.  If you can't do that then you should heed the following advice:

     

    Until a software fix for Windows Home Server is available, users may choose to act to help limit the possibility of being affected by this issue.  In the Knowledge Base article http://support.microsoft.com/kb/946676 we suggest some precautionary measures that users may choose to take.

    ·      Employ Windows Explorer or a command line tool to copy files to and from the Windows Home Server

    ·      Do not use applications to directly edit or change files that are stored on Windows Home Server.

    ·      Do not use media management programs, such as Windows Media Player, to import files to the Windows Home Server. 

    ·      Do not redirect applications to access files that are stored in the Shared Folders, as some applications may make changes to the metadata of a file without explicit user action. 

     

    Monday, March 10, 2008 9:38 PM
  •  kariya21 wrote:
    [....] based on what Todd is implying by his comments, it sounds to me like PP1 is already done.  If that assumption is correct (and PP1 doesn't make the corruption problem worse obviously), there is no reason not to release it now. [....]

     

    Yes, that would be an ideal scenario.

     

    Perhaps Todd could clarify whether (or by how much) the bug-fix might be delayed by 'dusting off' of PP1, along with the management of its release and the work needed to respond to (possible) new queries from the multitude of Users who would (I presume universally) adopt it?

     

    I accept that it's impossible to give absolute time-predictions, but it would be really good not to feel teased by yet another "guess" or "hope" or "implication" that the (IMO) all-important bug-fix would not be significantly postponed, by pulling PP1 back to a higher priority.

     

    Colin P.

     

    (Quick edit to acknowledge your follow-up points Ken and Todd. And I'll replying to you both (below) soonest.)

     

    Monday, March 10, 2008 9:39 PM
  • Please release the pack now, I believe the additional features are far to beneficial to leave people waiting any longer. The corruption bug only occurs for a few in very particular conditions. The fix for this should released as an individual hotfix when it is ready.

     

    Please release it now, if not as an auto update, as a manual download.

     

    I want to be able to back up my Vista 64 machine!

     

    You cannot say for definite when the hot fix will be ready so the pack should be released now. Everyone has been itching for it since January now.

    Monday, March 10, 2008 9:42 PM
  •  MichaelWacey wrote:

    Here are my two cents/questions:

    • Did the whole team really need to focus on this bug? That kind of surprises me.
    • Given where the bug is, it seems like only a small group can fix it. So, the rest could move back to PP1.
    • If you wait to release PP1 and the bug fix togeather, could you add some more features to PP1?
    • I am just interested, does the bug exist in Server 2003/Server 2008 but only manifests itself in WHS?

    I am really enjoying WHS. I am looking forward to this fix and PP1.

     

     

    Michael:

    • There are a lot of individual applications that require manual testing.  This requires people.
    • Yes, it is a small group of developers working on coding the fix,  Other developers are writing additional automated test harnesses with members of the test team.  Other members of the test team and members of the PM team are working on running manual tests and stress tests with the file system mini filter.
    • No new features for Power Pack 1 - the product has already been localized.  Sorry.
    • As documented in the KB article, this only affects Windows Home Server.  It has no bearing on Windows Server 2003, Windows Server 2008, Windows Small Business Server, etc.
    Monday, March 10, 2008 9:44 PM
  •  CSPea wrote:
    Yes, that would be an ideal scenario.

     

    Perhaps Todd could clarify whether (or by how much) the bug-fix might be delayed by 'dusting off' of PP1, along with the management of its release and the work needed to respond to (possible) new queries from the multitude of Users who would (I presume universally) adopt it?

     

    I accept that it's impossible to give absolute time-predictions, but it would be really good not to feel teased by yet another "guess" or "hope" or "implication" that the (IMO) all-important bug-fix would not be significantly postponed, by pulling PP1 back to a higher priority.

     

    Colin P.

     

    I can't possibly imagine for a second that Todd (or anyone else at MS for that matter) would believe that PP1 has a higher priority than fixing the data corruption bug.  (IMO, if there was even a remote possibility that releasing PP1 now would have any affect on the timetable for the release of the data corruption fix, I doubt Todd would even have brought it up in the first place.)

    Monday, March 10, 2008 9:47 PM
    Moderator
  • Please please release it now! :-) I've got 3 x64 machine waiting to be switched over to Homeserver as soon as it is released. And I've not had the corruption issues.

    Monday, March 10, 2008 9:49 PM
  •  CSPea wrote:

     

    Perhaps Todd could clarify whether (or by how much) the bug-fix might be delayed by 'dusting off' of PP1, along with the management of its release and the work needed to respond to (possible) new queries from the multitude of Users who would (I presume universally) adopt it?

     

    ...

     

    Colin P.

     

     

    If Power Pack 1 gets released prior to the fix for the data corruption issue, it will provide little or no impact to the majority of the members of the home server team.  Since January, the only people spending any time on Power Pack 1 have been the localization team (as we will eventually ship Japanese and 3 Chinese language versions), the beta support and sustained engineering teams (which has been triaging incoming issues identified by our beta testers, partners and customer support teams) to see if there were any new issues uncovered that were "show-stoppers", release management and operations teams.

     

    Clarifying one issue - we will hold the release of Power Pack 1 for the new language versions (Japanese and Chinese) for the data corruption issue - since they will ship on new media.  The only thing under consideration, the only thing that I am garnering feedback on is how the community feels about shipping Power Pack 1 for English, German, French and Spanish via Windows Update to existing users prior to the data corruption issue being resolved 

    Monday, March 10, 2008 9:54 PM
  •  

    From my point of view I would like to see PP1 released as there are many features which I would like to take advantage of. As many people have said before, as long as the release of PP1 doesn't hinder or impact on the bug fix, then I can't see any reason for keeping it back. Maybe rather than releasing it through Windows Update, it could be a manual update you have to download until the bug fix is complete. That way people can have the choice.

     

    Bring it on!!  ;0)

    Monday, March 10, 2008 10:00 PM
  • At my vote for now.  I too have x64 machines that I have not been able to backup.  The thing I am MOST looking forward to is the 64-bit connector!! 
    Monday, March 10, 2008 10:03 PM
  • I also vote for releasing the Power Pack 1. I have 2 computers on Vista 64 and deperately want to be able to backup these compters on WHS. Anyone who has 64 bit versions of VISTA is missing out on one of the few safe areas of use on WHS, computer backup.

    SO my vote is to released PP1.
    Monday, March 10, 2008 10:05 PM
  • Thanks Ken for your candid reply.

     

     Ken Warren wrote:
    Colin, I think you misunderstand what Todd is proposing (which is why I kind of hoped he wouldn't propose it ).

    Microsoft believes that PP1 is effectively done. There have been no changes to the code base since January. I assume that means that there are no potential show-stopper bugs in the tracking tools. What he has asked is whether Microsoft should sit on PP1 for three more months (or more) in order to make sure the fix for KB946676 is done or release it sooner.

    My own opinion is that Microsoft should release it. The server backup in particular can help alleviate the risk of file corruption due to KB946676. There are other "nice to haves" as well. This is a change from my opinion of many weeks ago when I told Todd (I think the best description would be "strongly worded but polite dismay" ) that PP1 could go hang until the file corruption issue is fixed. I've changed my mind because I think getting server backup out into the field will help users.

    And if they decide to release it, it will have no impact on the effort to correct the file corruption issue. If I thought for a second that it would delay KB946676, I'd already have written another one of those emails full of "strongly worded but polite dismay." Which I haven't...

     

    I now understand that PP1 is all-but ready for release, and having calmed down a bit from my earlier desk-thumping mood about "where's my bug-fix???", I can see the appettite here for some feel-good from the extras in PP1, not least the 64-bit Connector part.

     

    However, I'd still grumble a bit about this apparent benefit, which was mentioned also (in a way) in another posting -

     Ken Warren wrote:
    [...]The server backup in particular can help alleviate the risk of file corruption

     

    I already use rotating off-site USB drives as my fall-back backup, as well as JungleDisk/Amazon S3 for some critical data, "to be sure to be sure". So - regarding the PP1 opportunity to make further backups of my WHS shares - while WHS is in this uncertain state I haven't even started trusting it as a component in my backup regime. And I won't feel able to do so until after the bug-fix (remember, I'm using three SATA drives, not just one). And those multiple HDD/spindles in my PCs must continue to hang on to their duplicate-copies of my data until I'm really really sure I can yield it at last to WHS.

     

    But progress is progress, and we're getting there ...

    Colin P.

     

    Monday, March 10, 2008 10:06 PM
  • Joker: Have you shipped a million of those things?!
    Scientist at Axis Chemical Factory: Yes, sir.
    Joker: Ship 'em all! We're gonna take 'em out a whole new door!

    Yes, yes, please ship out ASAP via WU!  I have one x64 Vista machine already and PP1 is the only thing keeping me from upgrading my primary desktop to x64 Ultimate.  As Ken mentioned before I think, having a backup feature for the server itself may actually save some folks' bacon if the corruption bug strikes.  Nothing robcopy can't solve for sure but it would be nice to have
    Monday, March 10, 2008 10:07 PM
  • If it's ready to release then please do so. It seems silly to hold PP1 back for an issue that will remain in place anyway untill June or later. The data corruption issue is something we are working around anywy.

     

    PLEASE RELEASE PP! :-)

     

    Rich

     

    Monday, March 10, 2008 10:11 PM
  • Given that MS is currently recommending a single drive setup for WHS and the fact that Power Pack 1 includes a built in backup solution I would say release the Power Pack ASAP. At least then anyone who takes the MS advice of using a single drive can backup their data using WHS software.

     

    I would however agree with Leod and ask that it is released as an optional download rather than sent down via Windows Update. At least then Home Server users have the option of installing it if they want it straight away and there's less chance of upsetting any users who may already be suffering with the corruption issue who want to wait to install the Power Pack until the issue is resolved.

    Monday, March 10, 2008 10:12 PM
  •  T. Headrick wrote:
     CSPea wrote:

     

    Perhaps Todd could clarify whether (or by how much) the bug-fix might be delayed by 'dusting off' of PP1, along with the management of its release and the work needed to respond to (possible) new queries from the multitude of Users who would (I presume universally) adopt it?

     

    ...

     

    Colin P.

     

     

    If Power Pack 1 gets released prior to the fix for the data corruption issue, it will provide little or no impact to the majority of the members of the home server team.  Since January, the only people spending any time on Power Pack 1 have been the localization team (as we will eventually ship Japanese and 3 Chinese language versions), the beta support and sustained engineering teams (which has been triaging incoming issues identified by our beta testers, partners and customer support teams) to see if there were any new issues uncovered that were "show-stoppers", release management and operations teams.

     

    Clarifying one issue - we will hold the release of Power Pack 1 for the new language versions (Japanese and Chinese) for the data corruption issue - since they will ship on new media.  The only thing under consideration, the only thing that I am garnering feedback on is how the community feels about shipping Power Pack 1 for English, German, French and Spanish via Windows Update to existing users prior to the data corruption issue being resolved 

     

    Thank you Todd for this very full reply, and clarification.

     

    Given this more complete 'situation report', and also acknowledging the evident hunger by respondents so far in this thread for PP1's extras, I'll take a deep breath and wait for the fix ...

     

    But I do have more questions which I have added to my later reply to your other post below.

     

    Regards,

    Colin

     

    Monday, March 10, 2008 10:16 PM
  • I vote to release PP1 now. I have not had any problems, but I would love the ability to use the folder backup feature

    along with the other updates.

    I want to also thank the WHS team for a great product. I have used the pc restore twice now and it has been a lifesaver.

     

    Thanks,

    Jim

    Monday, March 10, 2008 10:18 PM
  • Please release PP1.

    I believe this software, especially the backup solution, will allivate the corruption issue with an easy way for uses to feel safe with their data on an offsite backup of there most precious data.

     

     

    Monday, March 10, 2008 10:20 PM
  • fix the bug! its a bug - fix it. bug=bad. FIX the BUG.etc. pp1 can wait.

     

    Monday, March 10, 2008 10:22 PM
  • It would certainly be a good thing to release PP1 now.... it doesn't worsen the data corruption problem in any way. At the same time a lot of users (including myself) will be happy to get x64 compatibility. It also good to get the users started on the new connector update process so that the data corruption patch later this year can be more easily deployed. Not to forget all the other new features in PP1....

     

    Gregor

    Monday, March 10, 2008 10:23 PM
  • Tom,

    Thank you for sharing this with us.

     

    I personally think the ability to backup WHS shares is a very valuable feature for safegarding against data loss. Also the 64bit connector is a much wanted feature of PP1 for some of us.

    On the other hand, releasing PP1 could also stress support on any problem that could come with it. Please don't get me wrong. I'm sure you wil not release PP1 if it is not done, but being a professional developer myself I know that any release may contain some minor problems that need attention.

     

    I personally would be fine with *any* decision the WHS-Team makes on this. If they feel they can safely release PP1 without this interfering with solving the current curruption issue: Great! Please do so! Can't wait!

     

    (Btw: My WHS has been stable from day one (nov '07) and I am abled to work arround the corruption isssue. I will install as soon as you release PP1)

     

    Monday, March 10, 2008 10:26 PM
    Moderator
  •  ive_been_expecting_u wrote:

    Given that MS is currently recommending a single drive setup for WHS and the fact that Power Pack 1 includes a built in backup solution I would say release the Power Pack ASAP. At least then anyone who takes the MS advice of using a single drive can backup their data using WHS software.

     

    I agree too that MS should release the PP1 as soon as possible.

    I have suffered data corruption and lost 300+ photos. Since then I changed my WHS to single HDD, but I am still not sure how many other files have been already corrupted.

    I think MS should provide some sort of utility with PP1 to check data integrity.

    It would be disaster to back up data using PP1 to external HDD and then 2 years later to find out that data was already corrupted.

    My preferences are in order that …

    1- Provide us with a tool to check existing data first

    2- Release PP1

    3- Release fix when you ready

     My Best,

    Monday, March 10, 2008 10:31 PM
  • Release Power Pack One now. The only possible reason for not releasing it is it makes the corruption worse! If it doesn't do that then it should be released. It has the potential to help with the corruption! Please release it this week! Not next. If nessary then take some people from the team working on Vail to do what needs to be done, but release it already!

     

    Monday, March 10, 2008 10:47 PM
  •  T. Headrick wrote:

    I moved this from being a response in the KB update thread to being a separate thread.

    Knowing that the home server team has a current estimate of June, 2008 for the fix for the data corruption issue, do people believe that the team should "dust off" the Power Pack 1 code and release prior to a fix for the data corruption issue? 

     

    Ship it ASAP. The Backup functionality and the x64 connector are CRITICAL tools in helping mitigate the damage of this corruption nightmare. The fact that it will be a 7 month problem before a fix is already embarrasing, please don;t compound it.

    Monday, March 10, 2008 10:52 PM
  •  

    My vote is to release PP1 now.  Unless it makes the situation with the Data Corruption worse.  But, from what I have read, it doesn't do that.  The features it brings to the table are items that are needed now.  If it won't make bigger problems, then release the PP1 and then work on the data corruption issue separately.
    Monday, March 10, 2008 10:58 PM
  •  T. Headrick wrote:
     CSPea wrote:

    When it comes to 'features' versus rock-solid, assured, bug-free data storage, I'd push 'features' onto the back burner.

     

    The problems at present are -

     

    ...

     

    (c) In order to reduce my (possible) vulnerability, I have turned OFF folder sharing / DE on all shares.

     

    ...

     

    So ... you bet I want the fix first, earliest, soonest, ASAP, without delay, and I don't care a monkey's about any further features or bells or whistles or other boast-worthy extras from the WHS Development Team.

     

    I vote that you get the fundamentals sorted first please!!

     

    Colin P.

     

    Colin - thanks for the feedback, 

     

    One comment on your assumption, just turning off Duplication on Shared Folders is not enough.  The easiest way to protect yourself is to have a single hard drive home server.  If you can't do that then you should heed the following advice:

     

    Until a software fix for Windows Home Server is available, users may choose to act to help limit the possibility of being affected by this issue.  In the Knowledge Base article http://support.microsoft.com/kb/946676 we suggest some precautionary measures that users may choose to take.

    ·      Employ Windows Explorer or a command line tool to copy files to and from the Windows Home Server

    ·      Do not use applications to directly edit or change files that are stored on Windows Home Server.

    ·      Do not use media management programs, such as Windows Media Player, to import files to the Windows Home Server. 

    ·      Do not redirect applications to access files that are stored in the Shared Folders, as some applications may make changes to the metadata of a file without explicit user action. 

     

     

    Todd,

     

     T. Headrick wrote:
    [...] just turning off Duplication on Shared Folders is not enough [....] If you can't do that then you should heed the following advice ...

     

    Thankyou. But I fear increasingly that the scales are tilting against me and my data, and against my hopes for escaping this nebulous corruption bug!

     

    Given that -

    • I'm running three drives on my WHS.
    • I'm using SyncBackSE to do my regular backups, during which it does a write + re-read-verify of each file, and hence it conflicts with both your first and your fourth precautionary measures above.
    • I'm also using SyncBackSE to do occasional, manually triggered re-read verifications of earlier backups.
    • I do not know (as I mentioned earlier) what stress-test I could run to confirm (or refute) my system's vulnerability to the bug.

    then - even though SyncBackSE continues to report zero file differences in the backups it has made so far, maybe my wisest step would be (no sarcasm implied here) to switch WHS off and find an alternative host for my three (new) hard drives, and my new copy of SyncBackSE, at least until the bug-fix is realeased!?

     

    Perhaps my hope is in vain that I somehow fall among the apparently huge majority of WHS users who's system hardware will do a 100% thoroughly good job hosting WHS???  (That's a rhetorical question. No reply expected.)

     

    But here's a real question:  Is there really no testing or stress tool I can use to provoke this corruption on my system, or to prove that my system is not prone to the corruption problem?  Do I have to run on hope?

     

    (Sadly, I would reluctantly accept that Microsoft may choose not to release all the bug's finer details, for many reasons. But I had to ask anyway.)

     

    So - I'm teetering.  And it's only the techie part of me that is holding on.

     

    Colin P.

     

    Monday, March 10, 2008 11:00 PM
  • Hi,

    I emphatically urge the WHS team to focus first on testing and releasing the data corruption bug fix.

    More features mean there are more cases users may encounter the problem, as they will interact with the server more with the addition of new features. The scenarios for creating the problem while well understood by the technically inclined continues to grow for those who know little about whether they're replacing a file, not replacing a file, editing a file, etc.

    The message of releasing new features before the very fundamental feature of reliably storing my files is backward.

    Any time and testing that could possibly help get a fix for the corruption bug out faster should be Microsoft's top priority.

    j.


    Monday, March 10, 2008 11:01 PM
  • I'm all for shipping the powerpack now.  I can't really see why people would be against it, i'm sure microsoft wouldn't be considering shipping pp1 if was going to delay the corruption bug. 

    If its decided that its not going to be released now over windows update any chance of a standalone installer for those of us who want pp1 now?

    Monday, March 10, 2008 11:02 PM
  •  Darkone3 wrote:
    Release Power Pack One now. The only possible reason for not releasing it is it makes the corruption worse! If it doesn't do that then it should be released. It has the potential to help with the corruption! Please release it this week! Not next. If nessary then take some people from the team working on Vail to do what needs to be done, but release it already!

     



    I agree, ship PP1 as soon as possible. I've had no data corruption issues, but would sure feel better if I could do data backup easily which PP1 sounds like it will do.

    If it doesn't worsen corruption issues, backs up data before cooruption might occur, then get it out to the users!

    My little rant: I feel Microsoft should suspend sales of WHS until the corruption bug is fixed. It should offer full refunds to the people that want to voluntarily quit using WHS becuase of the corruption bug or offer a free upgrade to v2 when it is released (one or the other or bothSmile). I know that this would be costly, but would sure make the users feel better after investing hard earned dollars in WHS and the problems that have been encountered.

    Cruise
    Monday, March 10, 2008 11:03 PM
  • I think DeVRag got it right....

    A Check to see if the BUG got us yet...

     

    If you are saying that there will be no delay in the data corruption bug fix, then I say release it...only becuase the backup to external hd of your shares might mitigate any problem arising from the bug....

     

    Heres my situation:

     

    2.5 TB storage, 3 drives

    HP MediaMart Server ( which brings another problem ofthe SHADOW COPY feature being disabled and everyone being scared to enable it until we hear an official work why it was disabled).

    And I dont do anything but stream from it for the fear of the BUG

     

    One user said ( and Im paraphrasing ) ....I havent been hit by the bug....copy files on my hard drive, update them there, and transfer them back.  And seemed to imply that the bug was not a big deal...how is this not a big deal?!?!?  So I spent $1,000 ( with upgrades, etc ) on my server to be a CUT AND PASTE machine?!?!?

     

     

    BOTTOM LINE:  If it doesnt effect the bug fix, release it....but if it delays the fix, shelf it

     

    Monday, March 10, 2008 11:08 PM
  • I agree.  The main feature im looking for is 64bit support for the WHS Connector software.  Really need it as 3 computer sin my home are 64bit Vista systems.  As many i have not noticed any corruption errors since i installed WHS and would be happy for the fix to be june and the PP ASAP for the 64bit support.

    Monday, March 10, 2008 11:11 PM
  • Release the 64-bit software! Please!

     

    Some of my machines have no data to corrupt since they can't even connect because there is no 64-bit version.

     

     

    Monday, March 10, 2008 11:21 PM
  • My vote is for the release of PP1.

    Monday, March 10, 2008 11:24 PM
  • I agree...PP1 should be released ASAP.

     

    Monday, March 10, 2008 11:29 PM
  • Yes. Agreed with that..

     

     

    Monday, March 10, 2008 11:32 PM
  • Benefits Analysis says....What are you waiting for? . . . SHIP IT! 

    Monday, March 10, 2008 11:35 PM
  • You should release the already finished PP1 even though your still working on a bug fix.  PP1 contains a collection of fixes...thats good.  It contains 64-bit Connector...thats good.  And more importantly...it adds the capability to backup your Shared Folders to external storage.  Seems like a very worthy upgrade to me.

    Monday, March 10, 2008 11:35 PM
  • Ship it.  I really would like the 64-bit backup connector and the added remote features.
    Monday, March 10, 2008 11:37 PM
  • I must say, my hat is off to the spin control people at Microsoft. Smile Tell us in the morning that the corruption bug will not be fix for another 4 months at a minimum and in the afternoon throw a choice between Power Pack One and the corruption bug fix to us. As a comunity we are so very predictable. We will self destruct, as we fight over which comes first.

     

    People Power Pack One was out to the MVPs back in January remember att those great screen shots we saw of it? Give us the same power pack one you gave to the MVPs, it was good enough for them.

     

    Microsoft is such a poor small company it's not like it has a lot of employees or a lot of programmers, who know how to write code. This is bull, WHS was not written by one man, or even a handful of people. Its four months between now and June, and if Microsoft can't release Power Pack One now and the corruption fix in June the hire some more bodies!

     

    I'm not stupid, are you?

     

    Monday, March 10, 2008 11:43 PM
  • Please ship the update.  It's already been stated that the update is finished and won't hold up progress on the bug fix.  I am looking to upgrade my Vista Ultimate machine from 32 bit to 64 bit and this is really the only thing holding me back.  I'd also really like to use the "wake from sleep" feature and the server backup feature.  Ship it!
    Monday, March 10, 2008 11:49 PM
  • YES!! I really need the 64-bit connector! Even if you don't release the rest, please just release this...please!

     

    pq

    Monday, March 10, 2008 11:50 PM
  • I love my Home Server and beg you to release PP1 as soon as possible. My family and I use it daily remotely and some of the additions that PP1 are things that we have been waiting on with bated breath. Thank you for such a GREAT product. I sing its praises daily and do not know how I ever got along without it.

    Nathan
    Monday, March 10, 2008 11:51 PM
  • Another vote for shipping PP1.
    Monday, March 10, 2008 11:52 PM
  • Let's Get on with it. If you have code written for the corruption bug and are testing it. Then Dust off PP1 and get it to us!

     

    Monday, March 10, 2008 11:53 PM
  • Colin P, forgive me, I'm only an amateur - and this is a little off-topic. But aren't you 'over-testing'? - introducing variables that mightn't be there in normal use?

     

    I'm using three drives on WHS too. I built the (anti-corruption) redundancy on my system into the two desktops: extra drives to carry the master copy of everything important (backed up automatically daily). The shared files in WHS therefore are only copies. Everybody streams from WHS - no 'editing'. Any 'editing' work of any kind is done on the client-located masters then uploaded/sync'ed to WHS. I copy/move/sync to/from WHS using Directory Opus - not, strictly, the Explorer or command-line utility (i.e. Robocopy) as advised. No corruption since Dec 2007. How much confidence can I have in 'no corruption'? Believe me, much work goes on this network (including whilst it's backing up, balancing, etc etc), plenty of stress - but it's all 'normal' stress. Confidence? Cautious - but each day I use my rules without corruption makes me a little less so. And I think, with software and hardware, that's about as good as one can ever expect...

     

    Bill

    Monday, March 10, 2008 11:55 PM
  • My vote is to ship PP1.

    Tuesday, March 11, 2008 12:13 AM
  •  DevRag wrote:

    I think MS should provide some sort of utility with PP1 to check data integrity.

    It would be disaster to back up data using PP1 to external HDD and then 2 years later to find out that data was already corrupted.

    My preferences are in order that …

    1- Provide us with a tool to check existing data first

    2- Release PP1

    3- Release fix when you ready

    I agree.  I really wish there was a way to test for corrupted data on WHS.

     

    Beyond that, I say release PP1 now since it won't impact the schedule for the bug fix.

    -Tom

    Tuesday, March 11, 2008 12:18 AM
  •  

    One of the main complaints about WHS (besides the minor little Data Corruption bug ) is the lack of a 64-bit connector. Since backups are not affected, this feature alone would help many users deal with the corruption bug until the fix is released.  So since the code is written and the Corruption bug fix is going to take a few more months why not release it? 

     

    Doing so would probably generate some positive comments that this product desperately needs at this time.

     

    Plus I want to grant remote access to users and have them not see the computers tab, which I believe is a feature of PP1.  I really don't want to wait until June for that!!

    Tuesday, March 11, 2008 12:20 AM
  • Another vote for releasing PP1 ASAP.  It seems that it is ready, and we really need that 64 bit connector ASAP.

    Thanks!
    Tuesday, March 11, 2008 12:23 AM
  • Yep also agree. As long as it doesn't interfere with fixing that bug then why not?

    Tuesday, March 11, 2008 12:26 AM
  •  Jeevs wrote:
    Another vote for releasing PP1 ASAP.  It seems that it is ready, and we really need that 64 bit connector ASAP.

    Thanks!


    Power Pack 1 now please... I need the 64 bit WHS connector ASAP too.

    Tuesday, March 11, 2008 12:26 AM
  • Bring on Power Pack 1 and the server back-up functionality as soon as possible.

     

    Tuesday, March 11, 2008 12:35 AM
  • I say bring it out now.  Then release the data corruption update when that is done in June.  I have had no issues with data corruption.
    Tuesday, March 11, 2008 12:36 AM
  • I agree that the lack of a 64-bit connector is huge for me, so releasing the Power Pack 1 package is a priority that is not connected to the data corruption bug fix in my mind. If there's no deependency on the data corruption fix (and it sounds like there is not), then the best course of action is to release the other features ASAP. I think that will go a long way toward maintaining viability and interest, too.

    However, if there are additional risks associated with releasing PP1 before the data corruption fix is released, it's important to make sure people are aware. Doesn't look like that's the case, but of course it should be considered.

    Please dust off PP1 - and thanks for looking to the community for input.

    greg
    Tuesday, March 11, 2008 12:37 AM
  • I vote for the release there are many features I would like to have that it addresses.

     

    Tuesday, March 11, 2008 12:38 AM
  •  

    Just another vote for the release of PP1.  Keep the corruption fix separate from this.
    Tuesday, March 11, 2008 12:42 AM
    Moderator
  • Yes, so long as it doesn't further delay the data corruption fix, release PP1 now.

    Tuesday, March 11, 2008 12:42 AM
  • Please release Power Pack 1.  Like many others, I need the 64-bit connector too.
    Tuesday, March 11, 2008 12:43 AM
  • I would say that as long as releasing PP1 soon does not slow down or impact the bug fix MS should do it.  If for no other reason than to keep up interest in the user base and to help repair the badly damaged reputation of the WHS product.

    Tuesday, March 11, 2008 1:17 AM
  • My vote is for now. No point in delaying what could help with some of the issues. Being able to backup the server as well as the x64 connector will help me a great deal.

    I'm curious if there are any other undocumented bug fixes in the power pack?
    Tuesday, March 11, 2008 1:28 AM
  • If it's not affected by the data corruption bug then release it.  I'm moving to Vista x64 in a month and I would like to be able to use the x64 connector.

    Tuesday, March 11, 2008 1:32 AM
  • Hi Bill,

     

     bllr wrote:

    Colin P, forgive me, I'm only an amateur - and this is a little off-topic. But aren't you 'over-testing'? - introducing variables that mightn't be there in normal use?

     

    Over-testing ... no.  Not until I know my data hasn't been got-at by the bug, or until I know it has (which would neatly and ironically clarify my options).

     

    By over-testing I assume you mean those additional verify phases (re my post at 11pm UTC on Monday/yesterday), but I'm only running those extra scans as a search for (any) broken data.  And I'm running them deliberately days after the backup task that first stored them on WHS.  Once the fix has been released and has proven itself, I expect I'll become fully trusting of WHS and be able to drop those extra verify checks.

     

     bllr wrote:

    Cautious - but each day I use my rules without corruption makes me a little less so.

     

    My sense of unease would drop a little each day too if it wasn't for the unpredictable nature of the corruption bug. I see my extra steps simply as avoiding complacency - until I know for certain that my data is no more vulnerable to corruption than it would be with any 'normal' storage medium (nothing's perfect yet, sadly).

     

    And - like you, in the meantime I'm also using my PC's hard drives for that extra essential redundancy.

     

    Regards,

    Colin P.

     

    Tuesday, March 11, 2008 1:34 AM
  •  DevRag wrote:
    I have suffered data corruption and lost 300+ photos. Since then I changed my WHS to single HDD, but I am still not sure how many other files have been already corrupted.

    I know that Microsoft is still actively soliciting reproducible instances of file corruption, so I have to ask: Have you contacted them at whsforum@microsoft.com and posted a bug on Connect?
    Tuesday, March 11, 2008 1:35 AM
    Moderator
  •  

    Surely if the PowerPack is stabilised and complete and it's release will not cause the existing data corruption issue to get any worse, then release it.

     

    Whilst the data corruption issue is serious, it has been identified, reproduced and effective workarounds publicly disclosed. In my opinion the benefit of an x64 connector and the other assorted new functionality in PP1 outweighs the need to wait to incorporate the corruption fix.

     

    Ship!!

    Tuesday, March 11, 2008 1:55 AM
  •  JesD wrote:
    One user said ( and Im paraphrasing ) ....I havent been hit by the bug....copy files on my hard drive, update them there, and transfer them back.  And seemed to imply that the bug was not a big deal...how is this not a big deal?!?!?  So I spent $1,000 ( with upgrades, etc ) on my server to be a CUT AND PASTE machine?!?!?

     

    Since you are referring to my post, I will respond in kind:

     

    I have never, ever ONCE said it was not a big deal, nor was that what I was implying in any way, shape, or form (I've purposely avoided making comments in the continual "WHEN IS IT GOING TO BE FIXED???" posts here because of the monotonous rants that go on and on and on in those, which end up having no productive value at all).  Of course the data corruption issue is a huge problem.  Of course MS is working on it.  Of course the patch will be released when it's been properly tested and proven to work (whether it's June, July, August, or later).  (And yes, having to copy the file, then edit it, then move it back is a PITA.)  My point is: as MS has already said, there are a couple workarounds that work until the patch is released.  Since the code for PP1 is already done (which will keep the team focused on fixing the data corruption problem) and installing it will, I assume, not make the problem any worse, why not release PP1 now?

    Tuesday, March 11, 2008 2:05 AM
    Moderator
  • I also support shipping PP1 for reasons previously mentioned, most especially because it would allow back-up of data, thus helping to prevent corruption, or at least allowing you to fix it if something does become corrupt.

     

    -R

    Tuesday, March 11, 2008 2:10 AM
  • Knowing that the home server team has a current estimate of June, 2008 for the fix for the data corruption issue, do people believe that the team should "dust off" the Power Pack 1 code and release prior to a fix for the data corruption issue?

    Yes. Please release PP1 ASAP. Many of us really need full support for 64-bit Vista.
    Tuesday, March 11, 2008 2:13 AM
  • A release prior to the fix would at least give us an easier way to back up the server and/or shared folders.  That would be useful in the unlikely event of corruption.

    Tuesday, March 11, 2008 2:23 AM
  •  Woody963 wrote:

    A release prior to the fix would at least give us an easier way to back up the server and/or shared folders.  That would be useful in the unlikely event of corruption.

     

    FYI, PP1 does not allow you to backup the whole "server" (only the data stored in the network shares as well as the client PC backups, not the WHS OS partition itself).

    Tuesday, March 11, 2008 2:31 AM
    Moderator
  • Ship PP1 Now Please.....!!!

    If you are an HP MediaSmart owner-------PP1 is even more important as I was told by HP that they were going to ship THEIR promised extra goodies (Free AV,video packet tecnology, etc) when MS released PP1.....

     

    And if it has no effect on the "bug" one way or another...

     

    Why not???

     

    To let it sit on the shelf seems pointless......

     

    It also takes the sting out of waiting till June for the bug fix.

     

    Tuesday, March 11, 2008 2:48 AM
  •  calidan wrote:

    If it's not affected by the data corruption bug then release it.  I'm moving to Vista x64 in a month and I would like to be able to use the x64 connector.

     

    We are also thinking about moving to vista x64 when vista sp1 is released.... While these data corruption issues are disastrous, I think getting more features out the door is a better route... as long as PP release will have minimal impact on the release of the data fix.

     

    I am a bit surprised it is going to take until June to get this out... I've said april/may  all along though... Oh, well, is what it is....

     

    Even if PP is not released, I think the x64 connector should be put on the web for people to download... Heck, I doubt if it is tied into the PP anyway considering how the x32 connector works.  Makes no sense to attempt to say "all or nothing."  guess that would mess up the marketing department, but what the heck.

    Tuesday, March 11, 2008 2:53 AM
  • Chalk up another 'yes' vote for releasing Power Pack 1 now.

    Tuesday, March 11, 2008 3:04 AM
  •  T. Headrick wrote:

    I moved this from being a response in the KB update thread to being a separate thread.

     

    We have always planned on holding the release of Power Pack 1 until we had the data corruption issue resolved.   The Power Pack 1 code was "put on the shelf" in early January, as the team switched focus to working on the data corruption issue.  There is some new functionality in Power Pack 1 like the ability to backup your Shared Folders to an external hard drive attached to your home server that some home server users have asked us to ship.  There also is some new remote access functionality (photo thumbnails, multi-file uploads), and a collection of fixes.

     

    Knowing that the home server team has a current estimate of June, 2008 for the fix for the data corruption issue, do people believe that the team should "dust off" the Power Pack 1 code and release prior to a fix for the data corruption issue? 

     

     

     

     

     

     

     

    Please Pretty Please release it today.

     

     

    Tuesday, March 11, 2008 3:10 AM
  • Yes, please release ASAP. I like many others do not have data problems and need the 64 bit connector so I can backup all my systems wirh WHS.
    Tuesday, March 11, 2008 3:17 AM
  • My preference is that, if there is any work of any amount needed to get the PP out, all efforts be put towards the Data Corruption fix. I have not had the corruption problem only because I have not utilized my server for anything other than backup at this point. This is an unhappy state of affairs as the media sharing was 75% of the reason for which I purchased my HP Mediasmart server.
    Tuesday, March 11, 2008 3:46 AM
  • Todd

     

    Now for my techinical reasoning for releasing Power Pack 1 NOW.

     

    As stated WHS with one(1) Drive is not affected by the " Data" bug and such WHS will not have duplication, therefore if you have a Multi -Drive WHS and you do not add all dives to the Storage Pool and then use the Power Pack feature to "Back up" your "Shared Folders"  to the Non Storage Pool Drive/s you will be creating "Duplication " of your "Shared Folders" without risking "Data" loss by the "Data  Bug"

     

    Additionally the other features are compelling enough to release it even if you tag it as a "Beta" and only make it available to this Forum.

     

    Thanks and please correct my logic if need be.

     

    PS  I did not read evey entry in this post so I hope I not repeating a previous posting with the same logic.

     

     

     

    Tuesday, March 11, 2008 3:49 AM
  • Release it sooner rather than later . . .

     

    Tuesday, March 11, 2008 4:10 AM
  • Greetings,

     

    Focus on fixing the data corruption bug.  Dust off and resume work on Power Pack 1 only when the issue solved, plain and simple.

     

    Your customers, including myself, are relying on the Windows Home Server product in their day-to-day lives.  Granted, many people, including myself, have our important data backed up six ways from Sunday.  I'm using the Jungle Disk add- on to ensure that my essential data is backed up off site.  However, users who do that are the exception.  I would say that the prime candidates that you're aiming for with this product are not going to think ahead like that.  They will buy an HP Mediasmart server and trust their lives to it.  When the data corruption bug bites them, they won't blame themselves for not being prepared, they'll blame Microsoft and the reputation of Windows Home Server will suffer.

     

    To be honest with you, I have not noticed or been affected by this much advertised bug.  My opinion, and experience, is that it has been totally blown out of proportion.  However, the impression is everything these days and people expect a product like this to be perfect.  Any hint of problems, even potential ones, will cause people to think twice before investing in the product.  I was in and invested before the bug came to light.  Whether or not it would have affected my decision to forge ahead with my Home Server build I can't say.  I probably would have gone ahead anyway, but again, I'm the exception.

     

    The data corruption bug tarnishes the reputation of the product, plain and simple.  Until you get it fixed, don't focus any amount of effort anywhere else.

     

    I've been involved with Windows Home Server since the early days of Beta 2.  When the RTM version finally came out and was available I excitedly bought it and installed it on my server hardware.  It sits in the closet and it just works, day after day.  It is quite simply fantastic.  However, in some people's eyes it is tarnished because of the slim possibility of data corruption.

     

    So, squash the darn bug and then move on to bigger things.  As much as I'm looking forward to the new features Power Pack 1 will bring, I'm happy to wait if that means this operating system will have a sure future.  I'd hate to see it wither away and die because of word of mouth.  The expectations of the masses are sky high these days.  Do your best to meet them.

     

    Cheers,

     

    Jeff

     

    Tuesday, March 11, 2008 4:35 AM
  •  theog wrote:

     

    I am a bit surprised it is going to take until June to get this out... I've said april/may  all along though... Oh, well, is what it is....

     

    Even if PP is not released, I think the x64 connector should be put on the web for people to download... Heck, I doubt if it is tied into the PP anyway considering how the x32 connector works.  Makes no sense to attempt to say "all or nothing."  guess that would mess up the marketing department, but what the heck.

     

    Sorry to surprise you, but coding a fix at the kernel layer and running manual tests and stress tests to make sure you got it right takes time.

     

    Things are intricately tied together.  The x64 Connector allows you to configure backups for computers running Windows Vista x64.  The Windows Home Server Console has to be updated to deal with x64 machines.  The virtual disk driver that is used when a user clicks the Open Backup button in the Console had to be rewritten so it works with x64 machines. 

     

    p.s. Snide remark about the Windows Home Server marketing team ignored. 

    Tuesday, March 11, 2008 4:35 AM
  • Please release it as soon as possible. The current lack of 64bit client is a major gap in the product.

     

    Cheers

    Dave

     

     

     

    Tuesday, March 11, 2008 5:22 AM
  •  Dave Moyle wrote:

    Please release it as soon as possible. The current lack of 64bit client is a major gap in the product.



    Yip agree. Although I think the data corruption bug is a major and want it fixed if the PP can be released with no to extremely little impact on the fix then Please release. I currently cannot backup my main PC (Vista 64). To me that is a biggie.
    Tuesday, March 11, 2008 5:31 AM
  •  

    Release it, features like those noted are what keep people interested in the product. We will not look at the PP as a sign Microsoft is not working on the corruption issue

     

    As I am sure the business managers can hear the class action attorneys banging on the doors of the WHS lab, I am confident the corruption issue will be resolved and long gone in the near future.

     

    Keep up the good fight, WHS is great.

    Tuesday, March 11, 2008 5:35 AM
  •  

    Please ship the Power Pack... release a hotfix when complete.   How hard is that?
    Tuesday, March 11, 2008 5:42 AM
  • Count me in on the "release it now" camp. My main games machine is running Vista x64 and it's been very annoying not being able to have it backed up with the rest of my home network. I'm also looking forward to the thumbnails when accessing the home server remotely, but that's more a "nice to have". Please, please, please release PP1 now and I can stop checking the homeserver blog and wegotserved every couple of hours looking for it. Smile

     

    Barny

    Tuesday, March 11, 2008 6:01 AM
  • I vote for releasing PP1 right away.

    Many WHS users have only a single drive and thus MS should not hold artificially PP1 because of the corruption issue.

    It may be difficult to explain how come PP1 gets out without the corruption fix, but if everything else is pretty much finished then why delay it artificially 3 more months?

     

    Yves

    Tuesday, March 11, 2008 6:05 AM
  •  

    My vote is to put all new products on hold until the current corruption problem has been fully solved and patched.  I don't like that we must "hope" we are not bitten by this bug on our systems that backup and store all our data for at least my house, 5 computers worth.  I've put a lot of time and money into building a large WHS and now am told I can't trust it.  And worst yet, I must wait another 3 months for the solution and fix.  This is NOT acceptable.

    Put all your techs on the job to fix the corruption bug and when that is done then let them get back to working on the new features with PP1.  That's my vote.

    Tuesday, March 11, 2008 6:35 AM
  • Release PP1, hopefully it will allow me to take a clean snapshot before I get hit by a corruption given the "server" backup is backing up the data that is at risk. It is part of the process moving towards the eventual fix. Thats reason enough. The rest will be a bonus (I dont have any x64).

    Tuesday, March 11, 2008 6:59 AM
  • Please release the PP1 code base ASAP!  We WHS users need a quick 'boost'.

    I imagine this release wouldn't even be entertained if it could cause problems.

    Backing up of WHS servers (not data) looks like a GREAT idea to roll out right now!

     

    A small note to some of the haters out there - apart from a couple of minor teething issues with a .net service pack, my WHS so far has been fabulous.  Stable, running night and day for nearly 6 months now.  Yeah I havn't hacked it to bits but it's got 8 hard drives (all mirrored) and over 3 terabytes of storage and has done everything it's meant to.

    Big thumbs up to the WHS team, I know how hard it must be when you launched such a great new product...all was looking rosey and then something you never expected in the bowels of Windows 2k3 rears it's head.

     

    PP1 will sure make me (and no doubt a bunch of others) a much happier camper...

     

    ...err just get the patch out sooner rather then later.

     

    Cheers,

    Cat

     

    Cue the playing of a Syberian spice miners song...the team no doubt are going to be teathered to their desks for this one!

    Tuesday, March 11, 2008 7:15 AM
  •  visualechodesigns wrote:
     Tinue wrote:

    Actually, the feature of Power Pack 1 that I need urgently is the 64 bit WHS connector.

     

    Agreed.

     

    I want to concur with this sentiment. I don't consider WHS a final product until both the data corruption bug is fixed and I get a 64 bit connector.

     

    Other new features aren't needed and I don't care about any of them right now.

    Tuesday, March 11, 2008 7:22 AM
  • If it's stable and therefore won't introduce new issues and you can support it then release PP1 now

     

    We sure need some positive news out there

     

    Tuesday, March 11, 2008 7:47 AM
  • Its very simple really.  If PP1 is ready and does not effect the data corruption bug issue any further then release it.  MS can only be asking this question if PP1 may still have planned changes between now and June, that may end up moving to PP2.  Its seems from reading responses that the x64 connector and the backup is what people are wanting and should really been available from the initial release.

     

    Tuesday, March 11, 2008 8:28 AM
  •  Ken Warren wrote:
     DevRag wrote:
    I have suffered data corruption and lost 300+ photos. Since then I changed my WHS to single HDD, but I am still not sure how many other files have been already corrupted.


    I know that Microsoft is still actively soliciting reproducible instances of file corruption, so I have to ask: Have you contacted them at whsforum@microsoft.com and posted a bug on Connect?

     

    No Ken, I have not. but I will report this to WHS team ASAP. I am not 100% sure what caused the corruption but it think it was due to rotating photos directly on WHS.

     

    Thanks Ken.

     

    My Best,

    Tuesday, March 11, 2008 8:52 AM
  • My vote is to release PP1 now.

    Tuesday, March 11, 2008 9:32 AM
  • My vote is to release it now.

     

    Tuesday, March 11, 2008 9:54 AM
  • I vote to release PP1 now as well so that it can be debugged before June and any fixes appliied. With the upcoming release of XP sp3 there may be a bunch of new trouble just waiting to be found. And how far away can server 2003 sp3 be- a year or so?

     

    Tuesday, March 11, 2008 9:59 AM
  •  T. Headrick wrote:

    I moved this from being a response in the KB update thread to being a separate thread.

     

    We have always planned on holding the release of Power Pack 1 until we had the data corruption issue resolved.   The Power Pack 1 code was "put on the shelf" in early January, as the team switched focus to working on the data corruption issue.  There is some new functionality in Power Pack 1 like the ability to backup your Shared Folders to an external hard drive attached to your home server that some home server users have asked us to ship.  There also is some new remote access functionality (photo thumbnails, multi-file uploads), and a collection of fixes.

     

    Knowing that the home server team has a current estimate of June, 2008 for the fix for the data corruption issue, do people believe that the team should "dust off" the Power Pack 1 code and release prior to a fix for the data corruption issue? 

     

     

    My vote would be to release PP1, possibly as an optional download, rather than on Windows Update.

     

    That way those that want to take advantage of the server backup facility can reduce the HDDs in the server to one, and still protect the data.

     

    I, like most, would think that it is stupid to run a server on a single drive. In this scenario it would be the only safe way to operate! And then to back up to an external at least is some protection.

     

    Am I correct in believing that a hardware RAID solution would be unaffected, as long as the array appears to WHS as a single drive? I know this goes against the flexiblity of Drive Extender, but a basic controller and mirrored pair would solve  a lot of peoples issues.

     

    The x64 connector would also be appreciated, I was very surprised this wasn't in at launch.

     

    Thanks,

     

    John

     

     

    Tuesday, March 11, 2008 10:09 AM
  • Release the PP1 "ASAP" -please!
    Tuesday, March 11, 2008 10:28 AM
  • I think that this should be released at this point as a step in the right direction. I only use WHS to backup files and folders for others. In other words the only thing that happens for me at this point in time is make documents and so forth available for others. There is no editing or changing of documents for me in my environment at this point. I will move forward in the future with this but until the bug is fixed I haven't even introduced editing or modifying to others.

     

    The benefits that are in PP1 need to be out so others will start to use them, there is a lot of good things people can use in these.

     

    By looking at the work arounds in the KB if I needed to I could go that direction if needed, my input is to release as soon as possible for PP1.

     

     

     

    Tuesday, March 11, 2008 11:10 AM
  • Fix the fundamentals - FIRST.  This data corruption bug could kill the product.  I know I have had to shift my desired usage and cross my fingers almost daily that my 600Gb of info doesn't get corrupted...   
    Tuesday, March 11, 2008 11:18 AM
  • As has been mentioned by others:

    If it will not impact the release of the data corruption fix (and I understand that it will not), release PP1 asap.  The backup to external hard drive feature could save data before it gets corrupted.  One person mentioned that they would like to see something that would detect corruption.  That is a great idea.  If the corruption is detectable, this could help people out a great deal.  I would love to know now if I have corrupted data now.  As opposed to waiting until I happen to be going through some pictures a year from now and wham!
    Tuesday, March 11, 2008 11:35 AM
  • please release PP1 asap. many people want to have the x64-connector and the whs-backup to an external hdd.

    the corruption bug does not affect all whs users, because not all use these progs.
    Tuesday, March 11, 2008 11:37 AM
  • Power Pack 1 represents two key capabilities for my self. 64-bit compatibility and the abilty to backup the WHS itself. I can easly make all my WHS accounts read only which means I've more risk in the delay of PP1 then the data corruption issue.

     

    Tuesday, March 11, 2008 11:44 AM
  • If it just needs "dusting off" and isn't detrimental to the progress of the corruption issue then please just release it.  If PP1 contains anything which could be effected by this bug then I'd rather wait.

     

    Besides wanting the 64-bit connector, the ability to backup data directly from the server would help alleviate my concerns about data integrity.

    Tuesday, March 11, 2008 12:01 PM
  •  T. Headrick wrote:

    I moved this from being a response in the KB update thread to being a separate thread.

     

    We have always planned on holding the release of Power Pack 1 until we had the data corruption issue resolved.   The Power Pack 1 code was "put on the shelf" in early January, as the team switched focus to working on the data corruption issue.  There is some new functionality in Power Pack 1 like the ability to backup your Shared Folders to an external hard drive attached to your home server that some home server users have asked us to ship.  There also is some new remote access functionality (photo thumbnails, multi-file uploads), and a collection of fixes.

     

    Knowing that the home server team has a current estimate of June, 2008 for the fix for the data corruption issue, do people believe that the team should "dust off" the Power Pack 1 code and release prior to a fix for the data corruption issue? 

      

     



    T.Headrick,


    I have not been bitten by the data corruption issue, but that will not affect my decission on what the WHS Team should work on first.

     

    I consider this a business decision rather than a convenience decision. Long term reliability is more important than short term convenience. The data corruption issue is a big one. It affects the foundation of what WHS is! I don't know the actual data behind how many users that are affected by the corruption issue, but that should play a big part on this decision.

     

    Basically, the data corruption issue should be first, period.  If the WHS team has some extra man hours or OT is budgeted, then ok work on Power Pack 1 at the same time.  But don't put off fixing a core function and reliability issue. That's just smart business and product management. Whatever the decision-Don't delay the corruption fix by a single day!

     

    I'd much rather have a product that I can rely on 100% than get thumbnails and 64 bit functionality. Basically, I'd rather have a steak and potato for dinner than get a candy bar instead. 

    Tuesday, March 11, 2008 12:14 PM
  • I'd release PP1 if it's ready as it solves 2 things I've been after since the beta releases:

    1. x64 Support.

    2. External backup of the WHS device.

     

    Not had the data corruption problem although I have 4 drives and use replication on all folders. I've even updated documents direct from the WHS share and "so far" no problems although now I have copied files locally to edit/update them just in case.

     

    Regards

     

    Tuesday, March 11, 2008 12:28 PM
  •  

    Do bear in mind that it isn't always practical to point the whole of a development team at one issue.  As long as the right guys are looking at the corruption problem and have all the resource they think the need, there's no issue to block development on other planned changes.
    Tuesday, March 11, 2008 12:41 PM
  •  

    As I've said in the past, features like 64-bit connectors, and backing up the server itself, should have really been a part of the product from day one.

    If they are ready, tested, and verified for not causing any new problems, I say release them now. As far as I'm concered, they can be released as hotfixes or optional updates, and include them later in an official release of PP1.

     

    Tuesday, March 11, 2008 12:47 PM
  • The way I use my two HP WHS boxes I have no data corruption problems.  I would very much like to see PP 1 released as soon as possible.  Also, I really would to be able  to back up my "main" data WHS box to the secondary one.  I run them on two separate networks in my home.  One is on wireless and one is on the ethernet.  They will not "see" each other and this is very frustrating.

    Tuesday, March 11, 2008 12:55 PM
  • I would say based on these features, server backup options and WHS 64 bit connector, PP1 should be released now. With the assumption that releasing PP1 will not take resources away from the data corruption bug.

    My problem is that the current date for the bug fix is June, but this is only an ESTIMATE it could be much later than June, do we really need to continue waiting for the PP1.
    Tuesday, March 11, 2008 12:58 PM
  • Is there any update from MS on the possiblility of releasing PP1 yet?

     

    TLE.

     

    Tuesday, March 11, 2008 1:20 PM
  • Yes, please release the power pack 1 now.

     

    Maybe instead of making it part of automatic update, you could make it a download that people could choose to download if they want it.

     

    Thank you.

     

    Tuesday, March 11, 2008 2:04 PM
  •  

    Please release PP1 ASAP...

     

    If for nothing else having the ability to backup all my current shares to an attached USB for safe keeping incase what I have now gets corrupt.  At least then I will have a backup since I am not adding anything new to my Home Server.

    Tuesday, March 11, 2008 2:27 PM
  • It would be good to release PP1 before the data corruption fix, for two reasons:

    1)  PP1 provides some good features, and

    2)  It would separate any issues that might arise from the corruption fix.

     

    I think the fix for the data corruption problem should be released on its own.

    Tuesday, March 11, 2008 2:36 PM
  • Right now my main desktop and laptop are both running Vista 64.  Unfortunately my Windows Home Server utilization is substantially limited for backups until PP1 comes out (I purchased the HP WHS box once I learned that PP1 was coming).  Since I understand the data corruption issue, I can adapt my behaviours so I don't get hit by it.  PP1 enables a major piece of functionality for the WHS product for me.

    This is why PP1 is much more important to me than the the data corruption bug fix.  Plus, based what the WHS team has said here, getting PP1 early won't substantially delay the data corruption bug fix!  So, I think its a no-brainer.
    Tuesday, March 11, 2008 2:56 PM
  • I think that it would be irresonsible for Microsoft not to release PP1. At this point it appears the PP1 is finished and contains a way to safely backup the data contained on the WHS thus minimizing the risk of the data corruption bug. If PP1 is release it would be a good way for MS to extend the Olive branch an help the community gain some trust in thier WHS systems again. Being able to back up your files from the WHS is a feature that has been requested since day 1 and I can't help but wonder that if it was available then how many people would have been able to recover thier data that was lost when it became corrupt.

     

    Tuesday, March 11, 2008 2:59 PM
  • I am always of the opinion that you should get the foundations right first, if there are any bugs in PP1 that causes a similar issue to the corruption problem it will be harder to identify and may lengthen the time taken to issue the fix.

     

    Currently my WHS is “untrusted”, I am purposely not using it the way I would like due to the possibility of corruption, I am therefore investing in additional storage in other PCs and just using WHS for backup, to avoid the issue.

     

    If the 64bit support is client only, I see no reason why it shouldn’t be split from PP1 and delivered now.

     

    I would however say that MS should consider making the next full version of WHS available FOC to those of us that are patiently waiting to use our WHS for the purpose it was intended.

     

    Tuesday, March 11, 2008 3:07 PM
  • I say release PP1 if it's not going to interfere with data corruption testing.  Also if Microsoft does decide to release PP1, they should let us know ASAP if it's a go, or no go before this thread gets larger than life, and goes on for months before we hear their decision just like the data corruption thread.

     

    Tuesday, March 11, 2008 3:22 PM
  • The 64-bit WHS connector is critical to me.  My vote is to release Power Pack 1 ASAP, or, alternatively, just release the 64-bit connector.

    Tuesday, March 11, 2008 3:29 PM
  •  visualechodesigns wrote:
     Tinue wrote:

    Actually, the feature of Power Pack 1 that I need urgently is the 64 bit WHS connector.

     

    Also Agreed!

    Tuesday, March 11, 2008 4:15 PM
  • I totally agree.
    Tuesday, March 11, 2008 4:30 PM
  • As I do need Vista 64Bit Support: as sooner as better for me; I also like the other features coverd by PP1 to be implemented in my environment.

     

    Tuesday, March 11, 2008 4:36 PM
  • After reading through the 9 pages of this thread it is obvious that the vast majority of users would like PP1 released now. 

     

    So when should everyone expect a decision to be made on the release date of PP1?

    Tuesday, March 11, 2008 4:38 PM
  • Please release PP1 Sooner than later.

    Thx for your hard work WHS teeam!
    Tuesday, March 11, 2008 5:05 PM
  • I'm also using Vista 64 on my main rig at home. So please release the PP1 soon.

     

    Tuesday, March 11, 2008 5:16 PM
  •  Tinue wrote:
    Actually, the feature of Power Pack 1 that I need urgently is the 64 bit WHS connector.


    Agreed! Smile I say release the powerpack, if it does not in any way impact the work or releease of the corruption issue.
    Tuesday, March 11, 2008 5:18 PM
  • Please give us the Power Pack 1 as soon as possible.  I desperately need the 64bit compatability.  Now that the data corruption problem is known and measures can be taken to avoid it I find that fix third in line behind the 64bit compatability and the ability to back up the server.

     

    Thanks for considering our opinions!

    Tuesday, March 11, 2008 5:35 PM
  • My vote is also for releasing PP1 as soon as possible.

     

    PP1 is able to mitigate the bug by providing the option to back-up the server. In addition, there are a lot of people (including me) running Vista x64. Currently, I am unable to make back-ups of my x64 machine, which means my data is even less protected than when I would be running WHS and be able to make back-ups. Even though  I might suffer from the data corruption, my data would still be more protected than without being able to use the x64 back-up functionality of PP1.

     

    At the moment I don't even have a WHS yet, as I've been waiting for both the x64 connector and the data corruption issue to be fixed. However, PP1 will enable me to start using it, as it will give me more back-up options than currently available. I've reasoned the data corruption bug doesn't really matter for new users - like me. We can simply opt to install WHS (with PP1) to a RAID-1 array and make back-ups to an external device. When the fix is out, I can switch from RAID-1 to WHS DE by simply removing one drive from the array (effectively disabling RAID) and moving it to the storage pool with DE.

     

    I really hope you will give us Power Pack 1 as soon as possible, especially if it will be lying on the shelf for another 3+ months otherwise. And indeed thanks for listening to the community on this one!

    Tuesday, March 11, 2008 6:17 PM
  • I'm another one for releasing PP1 now. I have had corrupted data, so removed one hard drive, and will not put back in until fix arrives. So give us the PP1 extras now.
    Tuesday, March 11, 2008 6:19 PM
  •  

    Another vote for releasing PP1 ASAP.

     

    This isn't an either/or issue. The corruption fix will take as long as it takes to fix and PP1 is nearly ready to go and offers clear benefits to users now.

     

    The majority of WHS users want PP1 now and understand that releasing it now will have minimal (if any) affect on the release date for the corruption fix.And anyone that doesn't understand that, there probably isn't anything that can be done to satisfy them until the corruption fix is ready.

     

    Tuesday, March 11, 2008 6:24 PM
  • Release PP1 asap.
    Tuesday, March 11, 2008 6:27 PM
  • Also using Vista 64bits here, would like to have the PP1 as soon as possible.

     

    Thanks

     

    Tuesday, March 11, 2008 6:36 PM
  • I don't know what other functions are included in PP1, but I'd like to see the backup and 64-bit connector parts released if they're ready.

     

    Tuesday, March 11, 2008 6:55 PM
  • Yes please. Whilst I do not have 64bit Vista, yet I will get it soon. The features I really want are the backup of the backup and the extended remote log-on time. Getting kicked off part way through an up/download is a pain in the ........

     

    Simon

    Tuesday, March 11, 2008 7:01 PM
  • Another vote to release when ready!
    Tuesday, March 11, 2008 7:01 PM


  • I agree...release it asap. I have bunch of IDE HDDs that would love to be extra backup of my WHS.

    Tuesday, March 11, 2008 7:05 PM
  • Please release PP1 asap so that least we can properly back up our WHS shares.
    Tuesday, March 11, 2008 7:23 PM
  •  

    I bought my WHS to backup the machines on my network, mainly my Vista Ultimate x64 machine - which I was ultra mad about after reading the specs, seeing it was compatible with Vista Ultimate thus buying WHS, then finding out not Ultimate x64!  I didn't even realize there was a x32 Ultimate.  Stupid x64 causing me more grief!  I need x64 support immediately!!!!
    Tuesday, March 11, 2008 8:02 PM
  • Ditto on the need for a 64 bit WHS Connector!

     

    Tuesday, March 11, 2008 8:04 PM
  • I vote for releasing it NOW...the 64 bit support is what I'm most interested in...

     

    THANKS!  This is a truly WONDERFUL product!

     

    Tuesday, March 11, 2008 9:01 PM
  • Just to pile on to the masses: yes, since the biggest missing feature for me has been the x64 connector.  Making that available would be great (and would mitigate some of my risk of having my media collection on the server...)

    Tuesday, March 11, 2008 9:07 PM
  • Yup. Agreed. I have nothing but Windows x64 Pro clients and a nice big WHS boat anchor. Waiting patiently for PP1

    Tuesday, March 11, 2008 9:15 PM
  • Another qualified vote to "pile on": If, has has been suggested, releasing or not releasing PP1 will make no difference on the date fo the bug fix, then release it.

     

    Claim releasing it was "being responsive to customer inputs". Claim it "helps customers obtain some measure of mitigation from the corruption issue--by enabling back up of the shares--while a fully tested, solid, fix is developed." Claim that it "adds great features to the WHS product while we continue to work on giving it the great data integrity it needs". In short, try to get some positive press for it in the face of all the negative press it's getting for this long delayed delivery of fundamental data integrity it should have had from day 1.

     

    Tuesday, March 11, 2008 9:22 PM
  •  

    T. Headrick-

     

    All my PC's are running x64 Vista (2 desktops, 1 laptop). 

     

    The data corruption but is definately an issue and I think it is important to move forward with this.  However, I know many many people that are really waiting for the x64 connector software to come out before they will purchase Home Server.  I for one was waiting but the price point that I was looking for with the HP EX470 came back around and I got in on a deal this week. 

     

    So my vote, and it seems really obvious to me, is to release the PP1 software ASAP.  It is really in desperate need to the community and it would definately get people that are on the fence to purchase a home server.

     

    Just my opinion,

    Steve B.

    Tuesday, March 11, 2008 10:01 PM
  •  

    Please release Power Pack 1. We need the 64 bit connector.
    Tuesday, March 11, 2008 10:02 PM
  •  jbenfield wrote:

    Yup. Agreed. I have nothing but Windows x64 Pro clients and a nice big WHS boat anchor. Waiting patiently for PP1

     

    Umm, not 100% positive that this has changed, but I heard that ONLY x64 Vista would be supported.  This would mean that XP Pro x64 would NOT be supported.

     

    Again things might have changed recently but this was the news the last time I heard.

     

    -Steve

    Tuesday, March 11, 2008 10:09 PM
  • RELEASE SP1, June release fix for data corruption:
    In my environment I have both an HP w/WHS full time and a separate WHS for testing.  My vote is with the many asking for the release of SP1.  Neither of my systems have experienced a Bug of any sort and/or kind.  The functionality of SP1 is a wonderful Plus for all WHS owners.  My family and friends are really looking forward to Icon photos, as opposed to file names.  Myself; I am looking forward to all the SP1 enhancements, especially the remote back-up capability.  To the Tune "Please Release Me..." 

    Tuesday, March 11, 2008 11:48 PM
  • I could really use the x64 connector ASAP.  Really sucks not being able to back up the most important machine in my house.

    Wednesday, March 12, 2008 1:17 AM
  • I need the PP1 and think if it is ready there is no need to wait.  I think you should release anything that is completed as soon as possible.

    Wednesday, March 12, 2008 2:15 AM
  • Please release at lesat the x64 connector!
    Wednesday, March 12, 2008 2:34 AM
  • I got the WHS mainly to backup all the computers at home and the one which contains all of my critical data is the Vista x64 system. I bought WHS because I thought the PP1 would be released any time soon. (Spring?) I'd say the x64 connector release is needed ASAP. My friends and colleagues won't even believe me when I said that Microsoft released a server OS which is not even compatible with its own flagship product.

    Please release ASAP.
    Wednesday, March 12, 2008 2:55 AM
  • I guess I don't understand why this would even be a question.  If Power Pack 1 is ready to go, feature complete, yada, yada, yada, then you should definitely release it! 

     

    Obviously the absolute first priority is getting the corruption bug taken care of.  I would say that if it was a year ago and you had this information, and you were wondering if WHS should be released in it's current state, then obviously you wouldn't release it.  However, it's already out there, and having the update doesn't affect the corruption issue one way or the other (unless the tweaks you are going to need to do to fix the corruption issue is going to cause problems with the power pack itself).

     

    However, the power pack does take care of the 64bit support, etc so at least we can use the WHS as a full backup solution, even if we're leery about media sharing, etc.

     

    If you guys come up with a way to scan for the type of corrupted files you are likely to see, that would sure be icing on the cake.  But only after we can get this bug fixed so it doesn't continue to happen.

     

    Wednesday, March 12, 2008 5:44 AM
  • Yes..

     

    Wednesday, March 12, 2008 7:15 AM
  • Now would be good.

     

    Wednesday, March 12, 2008 7:40 AM
  • I'd be interested in at least testing the power pack, and can use several of the features immediately. I vote to release it. Jim
    Wednesday, March 12, 2008 8:08 AM
  • Another vote for releasing PP1 ASAP
    We would love to see that 64 bit connector

    Thanx Smile
    Wednesday, March 12, 2008 8:30 AM
  • I back up by share folders to an on-line site now but the Recorded TV that I deem "High Value”, mostly my movie collection, is just too big to upload.  Therefore I back that up to an external drive using Sync Toy, version 1.4.0.0. It would be nice to have the “server backup feature” to further automate my existing server backup procedures.  I would like to move to the Sync Toy 2.0 beta and have not done so because of the data corruption bug, but that is the only reason I can think of to delay the PP1 release and I am happy to be restricted to version 1.4.0.0 to get the many benefits of PP1. In my opinion it is important to be “testing” PP1 in a wider environment now instead of later when the bug is fixed.  I understand others will not agree with my opinion. Of course, that is their right and I respect that right.

     

    I have actually experienced the data corruption bug. My specific circumstances have been reported and documented by the WHS team, but the bug appears in only one specific incident and the team has given me a work around which has worked successfully for the several month period since the work around was offered.  The team also has a copy of the executable file in its corrupt state and in its uncorrupt state.  The file is a large executable (about 40MB) that is corrupted only when the file is copied directly to the server from the internet. The corruption never did happen immediately, and only occasionally happed to some of the files copied directly to the server.   I do not know if the bug still exists because the work around offered has me coping the file to a workstation instead of the server.  I “unblock” the file before moving it to the server. If I use this work around, I have never seen the bug again. As a test for further testing for the bug after the work around, I even execute the file from the server and still have never seen the bug after employing the work around.  I get a new file from the internet (weekly stock data) each week. I recognize the bug is a concern for many and I understand why.  However, the bug seems to be controlled/contained in the environment in which I operate so it is much more important to me to get the benefits of PP1 at this point in time.  I do not take any chances with editing share folder files and the restrictions the WHS team has specified to avoid the bug do not bother me.

     

    I think WHS is a great product, and frankly, I do not agree with the fuss that has been raised over the bug.  Yes, I do get it.  Having the potential for data corruption is a severe problem.  I would prefer that the bug did not exist, but I cannot help but express my opinion of not understanding the fuss because of the work around the team has provided me and the, in my opinion, “mild restrictions” one can employ to avoid the bug. I suppose I might feel different if I had lost a lot of important data, but that has just not happened to me.  I have used WHS since May, 2007 and find it to be one of the best things that have happened to me in my 25 years of using PCs.  BTW, I am not a MS fan boy except when it comes to using WHS.  That MS team and the product they have produced is exceptional in my opinion.

     

    Ok I am off my soap box now.  Todd, please add my vote to the many I have seen here to go ahead and release the great benefits the team apparently has ready for testing.  The testing of the PP1 release is more important to me than fixing the bug. Yes, fix the bug but not first.

     

    Wednesday, March 12, 2008 9:09 AM
  • One more vote for releasing PowerPack 1 prior to a fix for the data corruption issue.
    The features im need the most is the backup-to-external-harddrive feature and the 64-bit connector...

    Wednesday, March 12, 2008 9:23 AM
  • One more vote for PP1 and 64-bit connector. Today would be fine...

     

    Ned Buckmaster

     

    Wednesday, March 12, 2008 9:43 AM
  • I would like the data corruption bug fixed as a priority over anything else.  I have just invested in a WHS system and added 3 disks to the single disk set up that I purchased.  I hear that the bug only affects multiple disk systems so I have been trying to remove the other disks but each time I try the removal process hangs.  So I'm stuck being unable to trust the WHS system as a safe store for my data.

    This is all a bit of a mess.
    Wednesday, March 12, 2008 10:01 AM
  • This is my first post on this forum and as a constant site reader this is the first time I felt that I must add my voice. I'm also one of the many who use Vista x64 and the inability to backup has been a really headache. I remember seeing the first news of the power pack and thought fantastic; finally I will be able to use WHS across my complete network, no more external drive for backups. We need this as a solution as soon as possible not just for the connector but also peace of mind with the ability to backup the server.

     

    Wednesday, March 12, 2008 11:43 AM
  • Yes, Please release PP1!

    Thanks!

    Wednesday, March 12, 2008 12:12 PM
  •  Torpex wrote:

    If you guys come up with a way to scan for the type of corrupted files you are likely to see, that would sure be icing on the cake.

     

    Just an aside: all of this talk of a corruption detector tool assumes that the OS could somehow tell a valid file from a corrupt one. This, in turn, presumes that the OS would have to know the logical layout of files for every application/file type it could check for and/or that every application and/or file type builds integrity check values or similar into their files. The only other hope would be for the OS to compute/correctly update some kind of message digest hash(es) for the ENTIRE file (or its parts) when any part of the file was updated. Doing that correctly on the fly is probably an order of magnitude harder to do than getting the data written right in the first place and that, apparently, was too hard to get right the first time.

     

    As it has been described, this problem is not like, say, a disk error at the physical level that was protected against or at least detectable because the drive hardware writes CRC/ECC data computed at the same time each sector of real data was written. This is more a case where the app wants to store ABCDEF and, for whatever reason, the server tells the disk to store ABC!@#. Once it's written to the disk that way, it's too late to tell it's not what the application really intended.

    Wednesday, March 12, 2008 12:15 PM
  •  Dick Watson wrote:

    As it has been described, this problem is not like, say, a disk error at the physical level that was protected against or at least detectable because the drive hardware writes CRC/ECC data computed at the same time each sector of real data was written. This is more a case where the app wants to store ABCDEF and, for whatever reason, the server tells the disk to store ABC!@#. Once it's written to the disk that way, it's too late to tell it's not what the application really intended.

    If you know exactly how the bug gets triggered, you could come up with a tool that scans logfiles, physical file locations etc. and point out files that might have been corrupted. Or alternatively, point out the files which cannot have been corrupted because they have never been touched by the faulty component. This would at least reduce the amount of time one has to spend to assess the files manually.

    However, I doubt very much that the necessary information (log files) has been written and kept all the time for such an analysis being possible.

     

    Regards, Martin

    Wednesday, March 12, 2008 12:36 PM
  • I must qualify my yes reply. If it is a certainty that the early release of WHS Sp1 will work after the release of the data corruption patch then I agree with the early release.

     

    Rufus Roper

    Wednesday, March 12, 2008 1:23 PM
  • Another vote to "yes" - ship the power pack

    Wednesday, March 12, 2008 1:36 PM
  •  Dick Watson wrote:

     

    As it has been described, this problem is not like, say, a disk error at the physical level that was protected against or at least detectable because the drive hardware writes CRC/ECC data computed at the same time each sector of real data was written. This is more a case where the app wants to store ABCDEF and, for whatever reason, the server tells the disk to store ABC!@#. Once it's written to the disk that way, it's too late to tell it's not what the application really intended.

     

    A partial solution might be to run a scan that checks files for integrity. For example, MP3, JPG, and DOC files all have a specific format that they must be in. A scanner could check to see that the files are in that correct format. It would not catch all kinds of corruption but it would catch many. It might be better than nothing.

    Wednesday, March 12, 2008 1:42 PM
  • I would greatly benefit from the release of Power Pack 1 asap.

    Wednesday, March 12, 2008 1:54 PM
  •  

    Please release Power Pack 1, for the simple reason that: Knowing there is a corruption issue, and in fact I am currently at risk, I would like a way to back up my data easily, and Power Pack 1 provides this capability.

     

    Thanks.

    Odi

     

    Wednesday, March 12, 2008 2:07 PM
  • I would like to see the 64 connector software as well so I can back up the system I use the most.  Backing up shared folders would also be nice.

     

    Wednesday, March 12, 2008 2:53 PM
  • One more for yes.  The connector for x64 is eagerly awaited.

    Wednesday, March 12, 2008 3:00 PM
  • Its a YES from me

     

    Wednesday, March 12, 2008 3:18 PM
  •  ive_been_expecting_u wrote:

    Given that MS is currently recommending a single drive setup for WHS and the fact that Power Pack 1 includes a built in backup solution I would say release the Power Pack ASAP. At least then anyone who takes the MS advice of using a single drive can backup their data using WHS software.

     

    I would however agree with Leod and ask that it is released as an optional download rather than sent down via Windows Update. At least then Home Server users have the option of installing it if they want it straight away and there's less chance of upsetting any users who may already be suffering with the corruption issue who want to wait to install the Power Pack until the issue is resolved.



    I totally agree. The fact that PP1 provides data-redundancy for single drive servers is in my opinion a strong argument in favour of releasing the powerpack.

    IP


    Wednesday, March 12, 2008 3:57 PM
  •  T. Headrick wrote:

    I moved this from being a response in the KB update thread to being a separate thread.

     

    We have always planned on holding the release of Power Pack 1 until we had the data corruption issue resolved.   The Power Pack 1 code was "put on the shelf" in early January, as the team switched focus to working on the data corruption issue.  There is some new functionality in Power Pack 1 like the ability to backup your Shared Folders to an external hard drive attached to your home server that some home server users have asked us to ship.  There also is some new remote access functionality (photo thumbnails, multi-file uploads), and a collection of fixes.

     

    Knowing that the home server team has a current estimate of June, 2008 for the fix for the data corruption issue, do people believe that the team should "dust off" the Power Pack 1 code and release prior to a fix for the data corruption issue? 

     

    I personally vote for PP1 as soon as possible! I use multiple Vista x64 machines and want the connector!

     

    On a side note my WHS is in a bit of trouble (and not only because I was hit with the data corruption bug multiple times with WinRAR). I started the upgrade a few days ago from the last RC to RTM. Things went fine initially, but then the install failed while it was doing the WHS portion of the install. Now on the reboot the WHS install routine runs everytime, but immediately says there was an error. When I close out of it and return to the desktop I am able to open the WHS Console and everything seems to work there fine. It lists all of my drives and all of my shared folders from before the upgarde. It also lists the proper size of the shared folders. But I can't open any of the shared folders! It says I may not have permission, and I'm thinking the install process locked the folders and then crashed before it could unlock them. I have over 2TB of files in those folders! Anyone have any suggestions? I know this isn't the proper forum for this, but I figured someone may know what to do...thanks!

    Wednesday, March 12, 2008 4:18 PM
  •  ChrisCicc wrote:

    On a side note my WHS is in a bit of trouble (and not only because I was hit with the data corruption bug multiple times with WinRAR). I started the upgrade a few days ago from the last RC to RTM. Things went fine initially, but then the install failed while it was doing the WHS portion of the install. Now on the reboot the WHS install routine runs everytime, but immediately says there was an error. When I close out of it and return to the desktop I am able to open the WHS Console and everything seems to work there fine. It lists all of my drives and all of my shared folders from before the upgarde. It also lists the proper size of the shared folders. But I can't open any of the shared folders! It says I may not have permission, and I'm thinking the install process locked the folders and then crashed before it could unlock them. I have over 2TB of files in those folders! Anyone have any suggestions? I know this isn't the proper forum for this, but I figured someone may know what to do...thanks!



    Your right this is not the right place for this. You need to boot from the install CD and run the recovery install. You cannot install the full version from within Home server.
    Wednesday, March 12, 2008 5:31 PM
  • Not to continue off topic sorry (no private msgs in this system!) but if I do that will it still recover my exisiting shared folders? I was planning on running the recovery install, but I wanted to get confirmation I won't reset the shares first...

     

    Wednesday, March 12, 2008 5:40 PM
  • I'd like to weigh in on the Power Pack 1 release.  I've been running Windows Vista x64 for almost a year and a half and what I do need is the 64 bit connector for WHS.  The rest of it could wait.  Ed Bott over at ZDNET says he's been running the 64 bit connector for months and it works great.  I'm not a Microsoft engineer, but I'd like to get the connector for backups NOW.  Backups, we're told, are not affected by the "corruption issue."

     

    Thank you,

    Michael R Wilson, MCDST

    Virginia Beach, VA

     

    Wednesday, March 12, 2008 6:46 PM
  • There are numerous freeware, shareware and commercial file integrity checkers out there. Just google for MD5 and pick a tool. Then just schedule a job to check all of your files as frequently as you feel is needed. It's not a bad practice to get into anyways (outside of the WHS problems). The MD5 files are small and there's a certain peace-of-mind to knowing that nothing's corrupted

     

    Unfortunately, I haven't found anything that will generate parity files for actual recovery. So you'll know that the files are damaged, but you'll be out of luck if you don't have them backed up.

     

    *UPDATE* - It's been a long time since I looked into this, so I thought that I'd google around. Sure enough, there's a tool to generate ECC files for file recovery. http://www.ice-graphics.com/ICEECC/IndexE.html  I've never used it, can't vouch for it and don't even know if it works. But if it does, it should prove useful until we get a WHS fix.

     

     

    Wednesday, March 12, 2008 7:11 PM
  •  Tinue wrote:

    Actually, the feature of Power Pack 1 that I need urgently is the 64 bit WHS connector. Not that the other features are not welcome, they are just not as important in comparison. And yes: If you could provide this without affecting the corruption bux fix schedule, I would appreciate it.


    I'll happily second this.  I no longer have any 32-bit copies of windows running, so I can't administer my WHS (the box itself is headless) without borrowing a 32-bit machine and installing connector on it.  This is a huge favor to ask when I need to do it.

    Wednesday, March 12, 2008 7:31 PM
  •  Colin A wrote:
    I'll happily second this.  I no longer have any 32-bit copies of windows running, so I can't administer my WHS (the box itself is headless) without borrowing a 32-bit machine and installing connector on it.  This is a huge favor to ask when I need to do it.

     

    You can still do Admin functions without a 32-bit client OS.  You can RD into the server and open the Console there.

    Wednesday, March 12, 2008 7:44 PM
    Moderator
  • Charlie,

    Yes please release it before the fix.  I am looking forward to using the Vista 64 connector.
    Wednesday, March 12, 2008 7:44 PM
  •  StephenFS wrote:

    One more for yes.  The connector for x64 is eagerly awaited.

     

    Yes, yes it is.

     

    I would also benefit from the x64 connector and the built-in backup. Please release PP1 soon!

    Wednesday, March 12, 2008 8:13 PM
  •  kariya21 wrote:

     Colin A wrote:
    I'll happily second this.  I no longer have any 32-bit copies of windows running, so I can't administer my WHS (the box itself is headless) without borrowing a 32-bit machine and installing connector on it.  This is a huge favor to ask when I need to do it.

     

    You can still do Admin functions without a 32-bit client OS.  You can RD into the server and open the Console there.

     

    Actually, some things won't work.  The Windows Home Server Console is meant to be run from a home computer.  If you use a Remote Desktop connection to your home server, and open the console on the home server's administrative desktop.  If you try to Open a Backup for a computer - you will get the error - "You must open a backup from the Windows Home Server Console running on a home computer."

     

     

    Wednesday, March 12, 2008 8:46 PM
  •  freitasm wrote:

    PP1 - server backup options and WHS 64 bit connector... Yes, bring it on!

     

    My thoughts exactly.  I am holding off on moving to 64-bit Vista until this connector is available, and having a server backup/restore option is really needed.

     

    If the code is done, let it go, and release the data corruption fix as soon as it is available.

    Wednesday, March 12, 2008 8:46 PM
  •  Darkone3 wrote:

    I must say, my hat is off to the spin control people at Microsoft. Tell us in the morning that the corruption bug will not be fix for another 4 months at a minimum and in the afternoon throw a choice between Power Pack One and the corruption bug fix to us. As a comunity we are so very predictable. We will self destruct, as we fight over which comes first.

     

    People Power Pack One was out to the MVPs back in January remember att those great screen shots we saw of it? Give us the same power pack one you gave to the MVPs, it was good enough for them.

     

    Microsoft is such a poor small company it's not like it has a lot of employees or a lot of programmers, who know how to write code. This is bull, WHS was not written by one man, or even a handful of people. Its four months between now and June, and if Microsoft can't release Power Pack One now and the corruption fix in June the hire some more bodies!

     

     

    I merely asked a question that someone in the community asked me that I thought I would like to know how the community felt about it.  There was no spin intended, sorry it appeared that way.  This is a question that we have toiled with and it is great to hear both sides of the argument from real people using the software.  The thing that has interested me is the number of people in this thread, where this is their very first post in this forum ... 

     

    As for fixing the data corruption issue, it is a lot of work and requires some pretty specialized skills.  People that have deep knowledge of NTFS and file system mini filters are a pretty rare breed.   Also, testing the new file system mini filter will take a considerable amount of time. 

    Wednesday, March 12, 2008 8:58 PM
  •  T. Headrick wrote:
    Actually, some things won't work.  The Windows Home Server Console is meant to be run from a home computer.  If you use a Remote Desktop connection to your home server, and open the console on the home server's administrative desktop.  If you try to Open a Backup for a computer - you will get the error - "You must open a backup from the Windows Home Server Console running on a home computer."

     

    True enough, except, in his case, since he has no 32-bit OSes, he has no backups to open.  Wink

    Wednesday, March 12, 2008 9:12 PM
    Moderator
  •  T. Headrick wrote:
    I merely asked a question that someone in the community asked me that I thought I would like to know how the community felt about it.  There was no spin intended, sorry it appeared that way.  This is a question that we have toiled with and it is great to hear both sides of the argument from real people using the software.  The thing that has interested me is the number of people in this thread, where this is their very first post in this forum ... 

     

    Since the overwhelming majority is in favor of releasing it now (and, IMO, I think the majority of people who voted against it probably didn't understand that releasing PP1 now would have virtually no affect on the timetable of the data corruption fix since the code for PP1 is done), is this something that will be seriously considered by the WHS team (and, if so, in your opinion, how long do you think it would take from the time the decision is made until the time it is publicly available)?

    Wednesday, March 12, 2008 9:25 PM
    Moderator
  •  

    I just got a corrupted SYS Volume Sad

     

    PLEASE Release this soon to help some of us overcome some of the issues at hand...

     

    Thankyou

    Wednesday, March 12, 2008 10:21 PM
  • Ship it now.   I'd like to back up the Shared Folders.
    Wednesday, March 12, 2008 10:26 PM
  • At the VERY least give people the 64 bit connector.  There are people that NEED it.  It doesn't affect me personally, I can wait for the rest, but people NEED the 64 bit connector.

     

    BTW about the volume failing issue...

     

    Wednesday, March 12, 2008 10:40 PM
  •  kariya21 wrote:

     T. Headrick wrote:
    Actually, some things won't work.  The Windows Home Server Console is meant to be run from a home computer.  If you use a Remote Desktop connection to your home server, and open the console on the home server's administrative desktop.  If you try to Open a Backup for a computer - you will get the error - "You must open a backup from the Windows Home Server Console running on a home computer."

     

    True enough, except, in his case, since he has no 32-bit OSes, he has no backups to open. 

     

    I stand corrected on that point.  Just as an FYI - The Windows Home Server Console is designed to work from a home computer and the testing that is done is by using the Windows Home Server Console from a home computer.

     

     

    Wednesday, March 12, 2008 10:44 PM
  •  T. Headrick wrote:
     Darkone3 wrote:

    I merely asked a question that someone in the community asked me that I thought I would like to know how the community felt about it.  There was no spin intended, sorry it appeared that way.  This is a question that we have toiled with and it is great to hear both sides of the argument from real people using the software.  The thing that has interested me is the number of people in this thread, where this is their very first post in this forum ... 

     

    As for fixing the data corruption issue, it is a lot of work and requires some pretty specialized skills.  People that have deep knowledge of NTFS and file system mini filters are a pretty rare breed.   Also, testing the new file system mini filter will take a considerable amount of time. 


    I can't speak for everyone, but I think most of the WHS users are very passionate about this product. I have been reading this forum for a while now, but now I feel like my voice needs to be heard. While I agree that this is a big bug to have on a server, I just don't understand how some people call their servers a "paper weight"...the remote desktop alone for me has been a dream come true. and daily backups? its been simply great. I can live with this work around till the fix comes out, but PP1 would be a nice treat for all of us hardcore fans who trusted our valuable information to a new product that was somewhat unproven.

    I simply love my MediaSmart server...and actually added a 320GB plus two 750GB HDDs as soon as I got it. Plus the upgrade to 2GB memory. I have yet to experience this bug. I don't usually edit stuff from the server anyways, but now I just set everything to "read-only"..just in case...so again...please release this update as soon as you can. It could help mend our pain for a month or four.

    Wednesday, March 12, 2008 10:46 PM
  • Yes, another vote for releasing PP1 - V64 connector and greater resilience options are main attractions, but other features welcomed.

     

    Wednesday, March 12, 2008 11:31 PM
  • Thanks for all of the great feedback.  Not sure if anyone wants to tally the votes and post a reply to this thread, as it would be helpful if someone could put together a summary with the number of Yes votes - with a breakdown of feature interest summarized, and the number of No votes or Other options suggested.  Any volunteers?

     

    First to answer a few questions:

     

    (1)  The various features and components of the Power Pack 1 release cannot be separated. A few things require other things to be updated so they work.  For example, the Windows Home Server Connector for Windows Vista x64 requires updates to the Windows Home Server Console.  And the package is tested as a whole, breaking out components would require a restart of a complete test pass.

     

    (2)  As we have communicated about Power Pack 1 in the past, the Windows Home Server Connector software will not work on home computers running Windows XP x64 edition.  It is not tested and will not be supported.

     

    When Power Pack 1 goes out - it will go out via Windows Update during the end of the month.  The earliest this could happen would be April as the check-in for March has long since passed.   There are a tremendous number of steps / sign-offs that you have to go through as part of the release management process.

     

    The next step is for me to take this feedback to the team and see what can happen and by when.  There are many people that need to be consulted about the idea of releasing Power Pack 1 prior to the data corruption fix.  Everybody will be looking at me with a skewed face when I present this idea at the next team meeting, since I am re-opening up a decision that has already been made.  But thanks to the feedback from this community - I have data to support a potential new proposal.

    Wednesday, March 12, 2008 11:45 PM
  • Here is what I think...

    If you delay PP1, but can put the data corruption bug fix out there sooner by putting more people on it, then I say do that and get that critical bug fix out there ASAP. As WHS being a file server, a deadly file corruption bug is the worst kind.

    However, if you are able to put PP1 out there sooner, while ensuring that there is no delay in the bug fix, and adding more people to it wouldn't help it come out faster, then I say put out PP1 so the people who don't encounter the bug fix can get some goodies in the meantine instead of waiting for a fix to a bug that they do not encounter.
    Wednesday, March 12, 2008 11:47 PM
  •  T. Headrick wrote:

    I merely asked a question that someone in the community asked me that I thought I would like to know how the community felt about it.  There was no spin intended, sorry it appeared that way.  This is a question that we have toiled with and it is great to hear both sides of the argument from real people using the software.  The thing that has interested me is the number of people in this thread, where this is their very first post in this forum ... 

     

    As for fixing the data corruption issue, it is a lot of work and requires some pretty specialized skills.  People that have deep knowledge of NTFS and file system mini filters are a pretty rare breed.   Also, testing the new file system mini filter will take a considerable amount of time. 

     

    Please, toil no more.

     

    Based on a not-so-quick reading of this thread, I'd say that the vast majority of WHS users would like to see PP1 released ASAP. And for anyone that doesn't agree seems to disagree because they think that releasing PP1 ASAP will somehow delay the release of the data corruption fix.

     

    While I can understand (and even agree with ) the reasons for putting the PP1 release on the shelf when the severity data corruption issue started to become clear, I think it is now also clear that a quick release of PP1 will not only provide much-desired features to WHS customers, but it will also help reduce their risk of losing data due to a 64-bit system not being backed up and/or a WHS box not being backed up to external drives. These are both very valid issues that PP1 already addresses, so I see no reason to make customers wait for features that can be released now.

     

    Hopefully the WHS team can make a formal announcement this week that PP1 will be released ASAP while they continue working on the data corruptoin issue so we can stop posting "I agree, release PP1 now" responses in this thread

    Wednesday, March 12, 2008 11:57 PM
  • So here are the numbers I came up with:

    152 votes to ship PP1 as soon as reasonably possible. 11 votes to hold it for now. Everyone who weighed in on the side of "Hold" expressed a preference to devote all available resources to KB946676.

    Of the "Ship" votes, not everyone expressed a reason (and some expressed more than one), but the reasons that were expressed are as follows:
    • Wants the x64 connector: 71
    • Server backup to alleviate KB946676: 25
    • Server backup, other reasons: 12
    • Remote access improvements: 2
    • "Wake from sleep": 1
    • Pending HP updates: 1
    I've released the lock on the thread, but I'm not planning to update my totals, as it's pretty clear that the community is overwhelmingly in favor of getting PP1 out the door before KB946676 if it's basically ready to go now.
    Thursday, March 13, 2008 12:13 AM
    Moderator
  • Ken - you are a ROCK STAR

     

    thx

     

    Thursday, March 13, 2008 2:04 AM
  •  

    I think the general feeling is release it now, release the data corruption bugfix when its ready.

     

    My first thoughts about the corruption problem was, if its in use, make DE not move it or touch it until its no longer in use. BUt if it was that easy, there would be a fix by now. Smile

    Thursday, March 13, 2008 2:15 AM
  • I would like to add some perspective to the discussions in this thead from my experience as an operating system developer (not for Microsoft).  Adding more resources might help resolve the data corruption problem faster, but it might slow it down.  Having more testing resources for testing of the data corruption problem may help the schedule, but adding resources to the actual resoluiton of the problem could delay the release. 

     

    As much as I would like to see a fix for the data corruption problem quicker than the current target, I have to give credit to people within the organization who are saying we have to hold this until we can get it right.  From personal experience I can state that it can be very difficult for an operating system developer to stand up and say we can't ship this until we fix these bugs.  Marketing and in some cases customers are not willing to accept schedule delays.   Delaying a feaure release or critical bug fixes can be a very difficult position when it may affect revenue targets, orders, or the vice president's bonus several levels above you.

     

    The question that I think should be asked of Microsoft which if it has been asked I have not seen is the following:

     

    What have you learned from this problem and how will you change your processes to minimize the chances of a problem like this occurring again?  My choice of the word "minimize" is intentional as I do not believe it is possible to "eliminate" this kind of problem from happening in the future.

     

    While  I don't expect an open answer to this question from Microsoft, what I would hope is that this question would be looked at from the development side and the testing side.  While you want testing to find these problems before they get released there will always be bugs that only get found in the real world.  When this happens it is critical to the devlopers to have sufficient information to be able to quickly identify the problem, reproduce the problem, and then work towards fixing it.

     

    For whats it worth I vote with the majority for releasing Power Pack I.  I have not as far as I know had the documented data corruption problem, but I have had my backup database corrupted, and it was not recoverable.  My problem with the backup database may have related to a software bug, but it may have been caused by two power losses to the server that occured ten days prior to the backup service failing to run.  The server was connected by a UPS unit which was reporting that it was healthy, but when it switched to battery the actual run time was less than a minute.

     

    Thursday, March 13, 2008 2:44 AM
  • Please, Please, Please just release PP1 I need the 64bit connector and some of the other features now rather than later.

     

    Thanks in advance

     

    Thursday, March 13, 2008 3:08 AM
  • The 64 bit WHS connector is a must.  Please ship this code ASAP.  We can wait on the data corruption issue until June.

     

    Terrence

    Thursday, March 13, 2008 3:55 AM
  • Assuming that PP1 isn't tied to the corruption issue, I'd prefer PP1 to come out since I'm one of the 64-bit Vista people. I'm only using the server for backup right now and light sharing so it doesn't affect me currently.


    Thursday, March 13, 2008 7:10 AM
  •  

    I purchased WHS for it's storage abilities and have been afraid to use it. All my media I planned on giving read only permissions for, will this be affected if the storage bug bites if only new files are copied to the server for streaming?  Will a corruption of a file edited in a user folder affect other files in the pool?

     

    If it will then I really could care less as the main reason I purchased this product was for it's storage abilities to store my recorded tv, music etc and stream it and as such would make this product useless to me power pack or not. If I have to worry so much to purchase another backup for my backup then I do not need this software at all, WHS is supposed to be your back up system, now we need a backup for the backup?

     

    As for me by the time I use it the next version might be out and I will be so ticked off that I would not consider it at all.

     

    Anyway there are enough people wanting x64 support, and no doubt the linux guys are already looking at ways to rip this off and create their own version,  so the more features the better.... so why not release it...
    Thursday, March 13, 2008 8:57 AM
  •  T. Headrick wrote:

     

     There is some new functionality in Power Pack 1 like the ability to backup your Shared Folders to an external hard drive attached to your home server

     

     

    Is the new backup functionality of the Home Server restricted to the Shared Folders?

     

    Whant I was hoping for was the ability to make a backup of my backups, that could be stored in fireproof safe on a different location than the server. Please tell me this will be possible with Power Pack 1....

    Thursday, March 13, 2008 9:24 AM
  • Are Microsoft actually seriously considering releasing PP1 for real? or has this simply been an exercise of some kind.

     

    Maybe now would be a good time for Microsoft to come back to the forum and let us know the state of play with regards to this.

     

    TLE.

     

    Thursday, March 13, 2008 10:19 AM
  • I agree.  Let's start working the bugs out of PP1.
    Thursday, March 13, 2008 12:21 PM
  • @Rasmus: The beta version of PP1 now with testers has the ability to back up the backup database. I know some bugs have been found in/around that specific feature (I submitted several of them). I can't say how severe they really are from a software engineering standpoint, but if Microsoft is considering shipping PP1 before June, they are either considered to be "livable" or they have decided to pull the feature. It's way too late to get a fix for any bug coded and tested before the June timeframe. In the meantime, the Home Computer Backup technical brief tells you how to back up your backup database. Also, if MS decides to pull a feature from PP1, you should expect to see it in PP2 or 3. I could see pulling a feature that just is never going to work right, but backing up the backup database is really close to right, IMO.

    @TLE: I believe Microsoft is seriously considering releasing PP1 before the KB946676 patch. They don't usually tell me their marketing plans weeks/months in advance, however. Smile This poll was probably allowed to continue to get a sense of where the community stands on the question (as if there was a need to ask).
    Thursday, March 13, 2008 12:41 PM
    Moderator
  • (2)  As we have communicated about Power Pack 1 in the past, the Windows Home Server Connector software will not work on home computers running Windows XP x64 edition.  It is not tested and will not be supported.

     

    That's not entirely true. I've pointedly asked the question about Windows XP 64 on a number of partner calls and been told that "64-bit support" was coming. There was no caveat about it being Vista-only and, in retrospect, the answers have been almost deliberately misleading. I run a home office and I've had so many issues with Vista-64 and the performance has been so abysmal with no apparent business benefit, that I rolled back to XP 64. I have no plans to adopt Vista 64 and no plans to roll back to a 32-bit OS. So I guess that I'm out of luck. I'll just have to stick with Acronis and my Windows Server for backups.

     

    Will Microsoft be supporting vendors to provide refunds? I can repurpose the box, but the WHS software doesn't have a lot of use to me. Luckily I only have one client that jumped on the bandwagon and he's using 32-bit clients, so apart from data corruption, he doesn't have anything to worry about Sad

     

     

    Thursday, March 13, 2008 2:56 PM
  • Having had a large PST file containing about six months of archives messages totally wasted by the bug (I stored it to the server before information regarding the corruption bug was released), I'm strongly in favor of anything that will speed delivery of the fix to this awful problem. I, too, would really like to have my 64-bit connectivity client but not at the expense of anything that would delay the much more serious corruption issue.

    Thursday, March 13, 2008 3:12 PM
  • Yes! Please release Power Pack 1 asap. I am really looking forward to the backup function that it adds. I think that will help people who are worried about their data becoming corrupt. At least they will have peace of mind until the bug fix is released in June.

    Thursday, March 13, 2008 3:43 PM
  • The logical argument would be to deliver functionality incrementally instead of waiting for the data corruption bug.

    I've followed the product since beta and have been waiting for PP1 to ship before doing my first install.  I will only use a single internal drive until the bug is fixed-I can live with that.  However, I've been waiting for the native USB backup option.  I'm sure I can use other solutions but this seems to be core functionality.

    I only use 32-bit systems on my network at this time, but seeing how many use x64 tells me there is a serious issue at hand.  Any benefit gained by waiting for a comprehensive bug fix will be lost by holding back functionality to the core users.

    As a longtime MS beta tester I think the WHS project has generated bad PR for the company by shipping with a fatal low-level issue.  Holding back PP1, which is pointedly not a service pack, is further eroding the trust of users who know the difference between a bug and a feature. Now that the damage is done, the WHS team can help incrementally restore trust and good will by delivering whatever functionality is ready to ship out the door now.

    And for those who say Linux is 'stealing' the company assets, wake up.  Ubuntu Hardy Heron alpha 6 is out the door, should go gold in another couple months, with a version of Ubuntu Home Server to ship soon thereafter.  If MS thinks UHS won't be popular if it goes gold before the bug is fixed or PP1 is out...time waits for no one.
    Thursday, March 13, 2008 4:38 PM
  •  T. Headrick wrote:

    Knowing that the home server team has a current estimate of June, 2008 for the fix for the data corruption issue, do people believe that the team should "dust off" the Power Pack 1 code and release prior to a fix for the data corruption issue? 



    I believe that Microsoft should release PP1 as soon as it is ready for release.  Delaying due to another bug in a different area does not add value, at least that I can understand.  Having 9 computers in the house, 2 of which run Vista 64bit, PP1 is crucial missing component.  I can work around the corruption issue for the short term (single 1TB drive), but not having full backup / integration capabilities to 64 bit systems, a method to backup the server, and the other nice features available in PP1 has made the WHS a little less valuable in my situation.  If PP1 is ready, please get it out to those of us who have seen the value in WHS and let us continue to benefit from our investment.



    Thanks!

    Mark




    Thursday, March 13, 2008 4:54 PM
  •  

    Release the power pack now, if ready.   The data corruption seems to only happen for the apps listed, most of which I don't use, and can be averted with local editing.  I think many more people are affected with 64 bit machines and I myself want the ability to do external server backups.
    Thursday, March 13, 2008 5:30 PM
  • RELEASE THE POWER PACK!!!
     
    I am using one HD. Therefore, I am not affected. But I would love the ability to back up my one HD to an external HD for redundancy until such time as the bug is fixed.
    Thursday, March 13, 2008 5:37 PM
  •  jbenfield wrote:

    (2)  As we have communicated about Power Pack 1 in the past, the Windows Home Server Connector software will not work on home computers running Windows XP x64 edition.  It is not tested and will not be supported.

     

    That's not entirely true. I've pointedly asked the question about Windows XP 64 on a number of partner calls and been told that "64-bit support" was coming. There was no caveat about it being Vista-only and, in retrospect, the answers have been almost deliberately misleading.

     

     

    I don't know about the partner calls.  But I do know that on the Windows Home Server Blog that announced an early idea of what the features for Power Pack 1 might be on January 6th, this is what was stated:

     

    Windows Home Server Connector Software

    When Power Pack 1 ships, the Windows Home Server Connector will be able to be installed on home computers running Windows Vista x64 editions.

     

    http://blogs.technet.com/homeserver/archive/2008/01/06/windows-home-server-power-pack-1.aspx 

     

    And if you search on "x64 Connnector Windows XP" in these forums, you will find this post:

     

    http://forums.microsoft.com/WindowsHomeServer/ShowPost.aspx?PostID=2662889&SiteID=50

     

    Sorry, you feel you were misled.

    Thursday, March 13, 2008 6:41 PM
  • You should release the power pack asap. I and several of my friends all purchased the home server for its features, but none of us have any 32 bit systems in our houses anymore since we are all IT professionals and have moved past 32 bit. If not the whole power pack the 64bit connector software should be release at least.
    Thursday, March 13, 2008 8:09 PM
  • i say ship it!

     

     

    Thursday, March 13, 2008 8:13 PM
  • NOW!!

     

    Thursday, March 13, 2008 9:07 PM
  •  T. Headrick wrote:

    When Power Pack 1 goes out - it will go out via Windows Update during the end of the month.  The earliest this could happen would be April as the check-in for March has long since passed.   There are a tremendous number of steps / sign-offs that you have to go through as part of the release management process.

     

    The next step is for me to take this feedback to the team and see what can happen and by when.  There are many people that need to be consulted about the idea of releasing Power Pack 1 prior to the data corruption fix.  Everybody will be looking at me with a skewed face when I present this idea at the next team meeting, since I am re-opening up a decision that has already been made.  But thanks to the feedback from this community - I have data to support a potential new proposal.

     

    T. Headrick -

     

    As someone who works at a software company on the DEV side of things, I know exactly what you are talking about with the above comments. Even the best management team rarely likes to revisit a difficult decision that has already been made, so regardless of the final decision I just wanted to thank you for putting yourself in a potentially difficult position in order to do what is best for the cusotmer base.

     

    Sure, nearly everyone here agrees that the right thing to do is to release PP1 ASAP (and I'm guessing you agree or you wouldn't have asked the original question at the beginning of this thread) but from a MS management standpoint the answer isn't as straightforward. There are many costs associated with putting out a relaese, and if the earliest release date is the end of April, that's only 2 months away from the target for the corruption fix. So some people might think "what's the big deal with waiting another month or two?"

     

    However, if you consider that the corruption bug is a MAJOR problem that is resulting in lost data and/or greatly restricting WHS customers' ability to use key adversised WHS features, then ANYTHING MS can do to improve the situation is worth considering. And based on what people here are saying, it sounds like releasing PP1 ASAP can only improve the situation (assuming it is relatively bug-free...you definitely don't want to release PP1 if it has any problems that could result in lost/corrupted data).

     

    Hopefully your voice (and our voices) will be heard and they will agree to release PP1 as soon as possible (which sounds like could be April).

     

    Thanks again for trying to help.

    Thursday, March 13, 2008 10:25 PM
  • Thanks for running this up the flagpole.  A public announcement will go a long way to assuage those who have significant investment in seeing PP1 and the corruption bug fix. Please try to say something as soon as you know.

    n

    Thursday, March 13, 2008 10:32 PM
  • @DarkonJohn and @newspeak

     

    Thanks for the kind words.  I will keep the community posted - it may be a few weeks before I have any real update.

     

    Friday, March 14, 2008 12:55 AM
  • All 3 of my computers are running Vista 64 and everyday I cringed when I click yes to something knowing that I have no backup available on my WHS. I think the whole PP1 should come out as it is finished but come on we need the 64 connector. Don't make us second class citizens in the Microsoft Universe....Can't we all just have an equal opportunity to have a backup on our beloved somewhat data corrupting but very loved WHS? It really is a great product! I will be building a house in the future year or so and WHS will definitely play a big role is the design and layout. It sucks it will take so long but please please please keep us somewhat informed.....I would rather you just pop in with no news a few times than to leave us wondering pondering guessing.....I feel like Tom Hanks on Survivor talking to Wilson! Thanks again, 64 bit people I have a dream.......and had a few too many drinks tonight

     

    Friday, March 14, 2008 2:24 AM
  • First let me say that I love Home Server,  I think its one of the best OS's ever released by Microsoft, with the exeption of Media Center maybe,  I think yall should release PP1 now or atleast in April when the next windows update cycle hits,  it makes sense that if its already done it should be out,  why not release the data corruption fix as a beta, or a hotfix now?  that way yall can have alot of people test it and make sure nothing else gets messed up when its released officially?  If people do find problems you can fix them before you release it officially?  I must end with GO ROCKETS!

    Friday, March 14, 2008 1:17 PM
  • Yes, release it ASAP. Waiting for x64 support.
    Friday, March 14, 2008 10:55 PM
  • I need the 64bit connector like most everyone else..... please ship it soon.
    Saturday, March 15, 2008 8:55 PM
  • Yes, please release Power Pack 1 already!

     

    My wife and I have been waiting for Vista x64 backup ever since pre-purchasing our Home Server in the end of November. We were extremely disappointed when we found out about this limitation, as 2 out of our 3 machines run Vista x64, but we purchased the home server figuring "what the heck, they're working on it, they'll probably release one soon". We were hoping you'll have it by January. I January you said - by end of March (as far as I remember). We'd be extremely happy to see it as soon as possible!

     

    I have to admit that our server only has one hard drive so we're not affected by the corruption bug. I would understand you, though, if you have to delay PP1 in case it exacerbates the corruption bug. If it doesn't - why wait? Just put it on Windows Update and be done with it!

    Sunday, March 16, 2008 10:26 AM
  •  ironcode wrote:

    We were hoping you'll have it by January. I January you said - by end of March (as far as I remember).

     

    When PP1 was announced in January it was always planned to be released around the half year mark - never by the end of March. I think you might be confused with HP's announcement which was going to be around the last February timeframe, but didnt happen.

     

    Hopefully we will all see PP1 very soon as the 64 bit connector is a must!

     

    Andrew

    Sunday, March 16, 2008 10:56 AM
    Moderator
  •  

    My vote - ship the Power Pack pronto.  64 bit support not being available is very significant.  My primary use of WHS is for backup simplicity and it doesn't work with my most used (and expensive) computer.  I've seen the same with several of my friends.  Many of the early adopters of WHS were early adopters of Vista 64.

     

     

    Monday, March 17, 2008 7:41 PM
  • Seeing as Microsoft missed the mark by not releasing x64 support originally, and releasing PP1 does not impact the work on the corruption bug, by all means release it.  Having a x64 box just waiting for PP1, I can say without hesitation, release it NOW!

    Tuesday, March 18, 2008 1:04 PM
  •  TestingJohn wrote:

    Seeing as Microsoft missed the mark by not releasing x64 support originally...

    The Windows Home Server team has always been clear about support for Windows Vista x64 and that it would not be part of the initial release.  Decisions are made based on 'market share' and also team resources for development and testing.  As a team, we have been focused on adding this capability to the product in the first minor release.
    Tuesday, March 18, 2008 1:21 PM
  • I understand that the WHS team has always been clear about x64 support.  I was fully aware about the limitation, when I purchased my WHS system.  You can say what ever you want about how the WHS team arrived at the decision, but looking at the number of x64 posts, and the number of early adopters using x64, I firmly believe that the WHS team missed the mark (the decision however based was fundimentally flawed).  I was also under the impression from information supplied at CES 2008 and information from the WHS team earlier this year, that support for x64 was going to be in March/April.  Now it's June.  This only serves to try the patience of people like myself who are waiting for x64 support.

     

    I do appreciate the work the WHS team does, and believe in the product, but stand by my original statement that I believe the WHS team missed the mark.

    Tuesday, March 18, 2008 1:38 PM
  •  TestingJohn wrote:

    I was also under the impression from information supplied at CES 2008 and information from the WHS team earlier this year, that support for x64 was going to be in March/April.  Now it's June. 

     

    Just to clarify - the information supplied by Microsoft at CES 2008 was "1st half of 2008" - how people choose to interpret that guidance is something beyond Microsoft's control.

    Tuesday, March 18, 2008 3:48 PM
  • Actually to be technically correct the Microsoft Press release from 6:00AM PST on January 7, 2008 states the following:

     

    "Power Pack 1 also adds support for the Chinese and Japanese languages, and will be available to customers automatically in spring 2008 through Windows Update." 

     

    I understand that spring is from March 20 to June 20, so it is a matter of how you interpret it.  I believe there is pent up demand for x64 support, and many were hoping it would be sooner rather than later.  It becomes frustrating to know that it's done and on a shelf and could be available, but it's not, because the WHS team tied to a bug fix that has nothing to do with it.  This is why you are getting strong responses here. 


    While we can nit pick the details, my point is and has always been that the WHS team missed the mark by not releasing x64 support.  Rather than pick apart the details, get the point... and do something about it.


    I am in favor of releasing PP1 as it appears to be ready for deployment and it's release does not impact the work being done on the data corruption bug.

    Tuesday, March 18, 2008 5:23 PM
  •  TestingJohn wrote:

    While we can nit pick the details, my point is and has always been that the WHS team missed the mark by not releasing x64 support.  Rather than pick apart the details, get the point... and do something about it.

     

    I agree.  Plus, people were waiting on SP1 before switching over to x64.  This is my case. 

     

    Home Server Team:

     

    I think you can argue the position, but most people simply want the x64 connector released.  In WHS it is basically a standalone product running in under 40 mb (I believe) so the x64 could be a simple download.  If it is "ready," make it a download already... I don't see the need to wait for PP1, unless it is connected to PP1 in some way. 

     

    Personally, I think you should have released PP1 anyway, without waiting for the corruption bug fix if PP1 was finished.  No asking... you should have known that people would agree that it should be released unless it severely impacts the product time of the corruption bug.  I don't get it...  

     

    Now you put yourself in a situation where if you don't release PP1, people will say it is sitting on a shelf someplace or if you do release PP1 and miss the June mark to fix the bug, you put yourself in the position where people will say you should have have not released PP1. 

     

    Sometimes hard decisions are best left to one person instead of hashed out in groups.  Make a decision already and let the chips fall where they may. 

    Wednesday, March 19, 2008 10:53 AM
  •  theog wrote:
     

    I think you can argue the position, but most people simply want the x64 connector released.  In WHS it is basically a standalone product running in under 40 mb (I believe) so the x64 could be a simple download.  If it is "ready," make it a download already... I don't see the need to wait for PP1, unless it is connected to PP1 in some way. 

     

    Actually Todd has already stated the following earlier in this thread, so its not just the connector as a simple download:

     

    "Things are intricately tied together.  The x64 Connector allows you to configure backups for computers running Windows Vista x64.  The Windows Home Server Console has to be updated to deal with x64 machines.  The virtual disk driver that is used when a user clicks the Open Backup button in the Console had to be rewritten so it works with x64 machines. "

     

    Andrew

    Wednesday, March 19, 2008 11:02 AM
    Moderator
  • Plus, no downloads are as simple as just sticking them on a server somewhere. As has been stated, it takes weeks of planning to get to the position of us getting the download.

     

    Colin

     

    Wednesday, March 19, 2008 5:55 PM
  •  T. Headrick wrote:

    Just to clarify - the information supplied by Microsoft at CES 2008 was "1st half of 2008" - how people choose to interpret that guidance is something beyond Microsoft's control.

     

    The interpretation is entirely within Microsoft's control—they just choose not to take on the responsibility.

     

    By saying "1st half of 2008", they are saying any date between January 1 and June 30 is equally likely. Now most people realize that companies specifying such a wide range are really just "cheating" *cough*lieing*cough* to make it sound better than it is - obviously they mean the 2nd quarter. If the target was really the 1st quarter, they would have said so.

     

    Obviously this could be wrong, too. Microsoft's choice to be vague rather than precise is what leads to people's interpretations.

     

    --Doug

    Wednesday, March 19, 2008 8:17 PM
  •  

    RELEASE PP1 NOW!

     

    Per: http://support.microsoft.com/kb/946676

     

    SMALL PERCENTAGE:

    "Microsoft is aware of only a very small percentage of users who have confirmed instances of this issue and believes that most users are unlikely to be affected."

     

    SPECIFIC PROGRAMS:

    Windows Vista Photo Gallery
    Windows Live Photo Gallery
    Microsoft Office OneNote 2007
    Microsoft Office OneNote 2003
    Microsoft Office Outlook 2007
    Microsoft Money 2007
    SyncToy 2.0 Beta
    Intuit QuickBooks
    uTorrent

     

    SPECIFIC HARDWARE CONFIGURATION:

    "Windows Home Server-based computers that have a single hard drive are not affected by this issue"

     

    SPECIFIC FEATURE USAGE:

    "nor are Windows Home Server Computer Backup and Restore capabilities, Health Monitoring, and Remote Access functionality."

     

    So, apparently, we are waiting for PP1 because:

    If your server has greater than 1 hard drive, and you happen to be using one of the above "nine" programs to read from or write to windows home server FOLDER SHARES, then if by chance, you happen to be unlucky enough; you could have data corruption. 

     

    How about all the users for whom I guarantee 64 bit clients don't work (because no such connector has been released yet), or who have 1 hard drive, or who could care less about file shares, and instead rely on the Backup & Restore capabilities?!

     

    The decision to hold on PP1 doesn't make sense... A very small percentile of people "could be" affected by the data corruption issue, where as an arguably large number of people are "definitely" affected by missing 64bit code and other niceties that PP1 brings...  Ask yourself which would be more beneficial to the "greater good"?!?!?!?! 

     

    Additionally, if I'm using a 64 bit client OS and it crashes and I was unable to back anything up because the completed PP1 was delayed; arguably, I'm worse off than another user who might have some data corruption (under certain circumstances, if the planets line up correctly, etc...)!

     

    How about this:  Release PP1 as beta (with no stated MSFT support) for users such as myself who are desperately in need of its features, then if I install it and use it and it somehow fails; I have no right to be angry at Microsoft because it's labelled BETA...  Then, Microsoft can continue its development efforts fixing the data corruption without interruption.

     

    If I have to wait until June 2008 before Microsoft even thinks about dusting off PP1, I'll be forced to attempt to return my windows home server (arguably a difficult task) or downgrade my Vista 64 to Vista 32... completely contradicting Microsoft's 64bit migration strategic roadmap.

     

    I apologize for my tone... I really want PP1 as you can see, and the decision to hold seems, at least to me, to be awfully irrational.

     

    Thanks for listening (if you got this far down in my post),

    ~Bill Moller

     

    Update: after reading more from http://support.microsoft.com/kb/946676

     

    apparently there's already a workaround!

     

    Until a software fix for Windows Home Server is available, users may choose to act to help limit the possibility of being affected by this issue.  In the Knowledge Base article http://support.microsoft.com/kb/946676 we suggest some precautionary measures that users may choose to take.

    ·      Employ Windows Explorer or a command line tool to copy files to and from the Windows Home Server

    ·      Do not use applications to directly edit or change files that are stored on Windows Home Server.

    ·      Do not use media management programs, such as Windows Media Player, to import files to the Windows Home Server. 

    ·      Do not redirect applications to access files that are stored in the Shared Folders, as some applications may make changes to the metadata of a file without explicit user action. 

     

    THERE'S NO WORK AROUND TO BACKUP 64 bit CLIENTS!

    Wednesday, March 19, 2008 8:23 PM
  • I would like to see PP1 released sooner than later. Backing up the server to external hdd will make the risk of corruption less traumatic when it does occur.

     

    Wednesday, March 19, 2008 8:34 PM
  • By holding off Power Pack 1 I believe Microsoft has made a smart move. The WHS team already has 1 strike against themselves with the Corruption Issue everyone knows about. Being a programmer myself I understand the need of wanting to hold PP1 back.

     

    My understanding of the corruption issue is that they are delving pretty deep into the core windows code to fix the corruption problem. Because so many changes are being made to the core system components there is a risk that something changed could affect the integrity of the PP1 build. If MS released PP1 now and in June they realize the changes made for the corruption problem some how affected the PP1 build in an adverse way that would mark two strikes against the WHS team and leave a bad reputation in a lot of peoples minds. It's hard enough now to get publicity out about WHS while most of it is spread through word of mouth.

     

    Yes I understand you have an x64 computer and you want to back it up. I also understand you want to backup you WHS OS section to. I too have an x64 computer but after a few months I decided to load XP Pro (32 bit) on my laptop till PP1 was released. Yes my computer is really slow now but you've got to weigh the pros and cons to what is more important for you, your time, and your network.

     

    The corruption issue is a big scare but you have been given the instructions for the work around till the issue is fully resolved. Also it seems that most of the problems happen with you WHS server is at max load or near max load. If your server is pushing max load most of the time while it's running, it may be time to upgrade and the corruption issue is just an awaking to people running sub-standard home servers.

    Thursday, March 20, 2008 3:45 AM
  •  Novox wrote:

    How about this:  Release PP1 as beta (with no stated MSFT support) for users such as myself who are desperately in need of its features, then if I install it and use it and it somehow fails; I have no right to be angry at Microsoft because it's labelled BETA...  Then, Microsoft can continue its development efforts fixing the data corruption without interruption.

     

    The problem is that in reality that just isnt the case. You may accept it, I may accept it, but other people likely wont. I remember during the beta of WHS the number of people complaining that they lost their "precious" data even though the beta release notes clearly warned not to trust your data as its beta, yet they still complained.

     

    Im strongely in the camp of release it if its ready and doesnt affect the work on the corruption box.


    Andrew

    Thursday, March 20, 2008 2:50 PM
    Moderator
  • I bought WHS without knowing there was no 64bit connector. My fault, for not reading enough. I am currently using Vista backup and task scheduler (for complete backups) to backup to a share on my WHS.

    I can't wait either to get my hands on the x64 connector. So this is another vote for a release ASAP.


    Thursday, March 20, 2008 3:40 PM
  • Perhaps labelling it "beta" and not expecting fallout upon failure is a stretch, but I feel the overriding issue is that while some 32 bit users data "might" become corrupt (under specific situations, none of which involve the backup/restore feature); no 64 bit users can back anything up for it to have the chance of becoming corrupt.

     

    The point is, absent PP1, 64bit data is less secure, than 32 bit data, GUARANTEED.

     

    Thursday, March 20, 2008 3:47 PM
  • I completly agree with you. I found myself manually copying data from my 64 bit machines to a folder on the WHS so at least it was stored in multiple locations.

     

    I will try and get an update from Todd and the guys as to whats happening.

     

    Andrew

    Thursday, March 20, 2008 3:53 PM
    Moderator
  • Not to beat a dead horse (though the horse is apparently not "dead" since the issue hasn't been decided) I purchased an HP EX470 from buy.com, and I DIDN'T know that 64bit wasn't supported...

     

    Buy.com states the following about the product at:

    http://www.buy.com/prod/hp-ex470-mediasmart-server-500gb-windows-home-server/q/loc/101/205466508.html

     

    "Backup Microsoft Windows Vista, Windows XP Remote access to computers Microsoft Windows XP Professional, Media Center Center Edition 2004 or higher, or Windows Vista Ultimate or higher

     

    File sharing Microsoft Windows Vista, Windows XP Home or Windows XP Professional, Windows 2000 Professional SP4, Mac, OS X, Linux. "

     

    I can't vouch for where buy.com got that information, so I went to HP... The official product specs from the PDF located at:

     

    http://www.shopping.hp.com/webapp/shopping/store_access.do?template_type=product_detail&product_code=GG795AA%23ABA&jumpid=oc_R1002_USENC-001_HP%20EX470%20MediaSmart%20Server&lang=en&cc=us

    Click "Specs"

    Click "PDF version of all specs"

     

    States the following:

     

    "PC operating system support

    support

    Backup – Microsoft Windows® Vista, Windows XP

    Remote access to computers – Microsoft Windows® XP Professional, Media Center

    Center Edition 2004 or higher, or Windows® Vista Ultimate or higher

    File sharing – Microsoft Windows® Vista, Windows XP Home or Windows XP Professional,

    Professional, Windows 2000 Professional SP4, Mac, OS X, Linux."

     

    Additionally!  none of Microsoft's own WHS pages, located here:

    http://www.microsoft.com/windows/products/winfamily/windowshomeserver/default.mspx

    mention that 64 bit Vista is not supported.  I checked all 17 pages:

    4 under "What is Windows Home Server"

    5 under "Learn more about it"

    4 under "Buy one for your family"

    4 under "Discover ways to do more"

     

    In fact, "Learn more about it," "Connect" specifically mentions that the Remote Access feature DOES work with Windows Vista Ultimate.

     

    Well, I have Microsoft Windows Vista (Ultimate, 64-bit) and Backup and Remote Access are not supported, contrary to the advertising from Microsoft, the OEM HP, and the retail outlet buy.com...

     

    Don't get me wrong, I love WHS... It's already saved me an absolute S-storm of grief when my wife's 32 bit computer died.  My great love of WHS is WHY I feel so strongly about PP1's immediate release.  If I didn't care about WHS, I wouldn't rant as much as I have been.

     

    That said, I apologize for my ranting Smile

     

    Thanks WHS team!

     

    ~Bill Moller

    Thursday, March 20, 2008 4:19 PM
  • Well, if you spend some time searching and you will find that people have 64bit connection working. This is both on Vista and XP, so there are work-arounds if it is really so important to you - unsupported as you request, but available.

     

    Colin

    Thursday, March 20, 2008 6:19 PM
  •  ColinWH wrote:

    Well, if you spend some time searching and you will find that people have 64bit connection working. This is both on Vista and XP, so there are work-arounds if it is really so important to you - unsupported as you request, but available.

     

    Colin

     

    The site states that "Backups won’t work, but everything else will on that machine"

     

    Backups is the functionality I'm "ranting" about.

     

    The site does have some comments from users who have gotten backups working (XP x64) but not restores... I guess it's worth a shot anyway, thanks ColinWH.

     

    Either way, I shouldn't have to tool around in the dark with a flashlight and some duct-tape to get something working that could be released by MS at any time...

    Thursday, March 20, 2008 6:30 PM
  • That's how I am running the connector. However, backups don't work... so no, it's not available.

     

     ColinWH wrote:

    Well, if you spend some time searching and you will find that people have 64bit connection working. This is both on Vista and XP, so there are work-arounds if it is really so important to you - unsupported as you request, but available.

     

    Colin

    Thursday, March 20, 2008 6:34 PM
  • +1 vote for releasing PP1 as soon as possible!!!!

    I am definetly looking forward to the x64 backup support and the external drive backup support!

    please release PP1 soon!
    Thursday, March 20, 2008 6:57 PM
  • Pls ship it asap !  

    Friday, March 21, 2008 5:49 PM
  • yes, please the faster the better. SP proud of my Vista64 environment, but without my home server.

     

    Friday, March 21, 2008 6:06 PM
  • I must say that I am astounded that so many wish to layer additional software applications on top of an already flawed base system.  I just don't get it......

     

    Friday, March 21, 2008 6:07 PM
  • Not all parts are broken.  Most people in this thread are asking for items are needed for the 'working' part of WHS.  If PP1 is completed then why not release it. 

     

    From what I see people are looking for the 64-bit client which if released, would allow people to backup their 64bit clients.  The backup/restore peice of WHS is working, and it works better then anything out there in this market space.

     

    Maybe you don't understand.. I just don't get it.....

    Friday, March 21, 2008 6:19 PM
  •  EastDog wrote:
    I must say that I am astounded that so many wish to layer additional software applications on top of an already flawed base system.  I just don't get it......

     

    That sounds like an argument for never installing any application on any operating system.

    Friday, March 21, 2008 6:21 PM
  • What flawed base system would that be then? Sever 2003 has been out an running in the market since when without any problems. Unless of course you mean a fault in a driver, which is being worked on.

    People who have read the purpose of the Power Pack, want to use some of it's functions; as said, 64-bit drivers plus backing up the backups.

    If you don't feel they are important to you, then you don't have to install it, but the rest of us can certainly find a use for it.

     

    Colin

    Friday, March 21, 2008 6:24 PM
  •  Novox wrote:
     ColinWH wrote:

    Well, if you spend some time searching and you will find that people have 64bit connection working. This is both on Vista and XP, so there are work-arounds if it is really so important to you - unsupported as you request, but available.

     

    Colin

     

    The site states that "Backups won’t work, but everything else will on that machine"

     

    Backups is the functionality I'm "ranting" about.

     

    The site does have some comments from users who have gotten backups working (XP x64) but not restores... I guess it's worth a shot anyway, thanks ColinWH.

     

    Either way, I shouldn't have to tool around in the dark with a flashlight and some duct-tape to get something working that could be released by MS at any time...



    I normally don't post in technical forums since I'm really not very technical but, this may be of help to some of you.

    I am running 2 machines with 64 bit XP and, of course, backups didn't work.  I recently had to reinstall the operating system on my main machine and reinstalled the connector using the workaround.  When I did, I was greatly surprised that backups started working (must have been something from one of the updates).

    A couple weeks later, I had my email files get corrupted in a crash and when I tried to do a restore from the backup, it wouldn't work.

    Then I tried restoring the file to a 32 bit machine and copying it to the 64 bit machine.  That was totally successful.

    So, even though it's a PIA, there is currently a usable workaround for backups of data from 64 bit systems.

    Hope this is helpful to some of you. Smile
    Friday, March 21, 2008 8:48 PM
  • Personally, I would appreciate releasing the 64-bit connector ASAP.  I built a WHS backup machine about a month before I moved my primary machine from XP 32-bit to Vista Ultimate 64-bit and was amazed to find that just about the only piece of software that couldn't make the move was the WHS connector.  Frankly,  when I planned my migration I didn't even consider the WHS connector as WHS was the most impressive piece of software I've seen come from MS in some time - I just assumed it would handle 64-bit OSs.

    Really, I'm incredibly annoyed by the lack of 64-bit support but I don't want to sound like I'm slamming on the WHS team:  WHS is a great backup solution:  lightweight on the clients, fast and well executed.  For its niche, it's the best backup solution out there.

    Keep up the great work.
    Sunday, March 23, 2008 1:40 AM