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I'm losing network connection during backup-HP says I should replace my router? RRS feed

  • Question

  • Just bought the HP MSS EX470 last weekend. Only one of my 3 systems is getting backed up successfully (2 Vista Home Premium, 1 XP) and it is one of the Vista boxes.  Since one of them is working as it should and I've seen no other indications of problems with the network or router. Replacing it (Linksys BEFSR81- 8 port wired) doesn't seem prudent.

    Since they are WIRED connections, I see no reason for drop-outs or flaky behavior.  I installed the latest router firmware and rebooted both the router and WHS unit and it is still not successfully backing up the pc's. I've tried to monitor manual backup sessions (like I have nothing better to do with my time!) and I get anywhere from 0-50% of a complete backup and then connection is lost. Error message is
    "The network connection between the computer and server was lost. Connection marked dead by transport"  
    or
    "The network connection between the computer and server was lost. No connection within time out period"

    Help???
    Friday, February 1, 2008 4:53 PM

All replies

  • Are the two Vista Machines identical? If not, it could be that the NIC in that particular card is loosing it's network connection for some reason. Maybe trying new drivers or changing it's settings to fixed frequency full duplex etc might be worth trying.

     

    Colin  

     

    Friday, February 1, 2008 5:44 PM
  • Colin,

    Thanks!  I'll give that a try.  I'm not a networking expert, so don't know what steps to take to isolate the problem. 

    I keep all of the machines updated with the latest patches, so I wouldn't think that would be an issue.

    The one machine that does back up is a Vista Media Center machine that is only used to record & serve media (backup isn't critical).  The other two, one Vista - one XP are the critical home/office machines that NEED to be backed up and they are the ones that aren't working.  They are both using wired connections to the router and they are 3-4 feet from the server. I have experienced no other problems with the network and use the systems daily (including VPN connections to my office.)
    Tuesday, February 5, 2008 4:08 PM
  • Do these two machines get anywhere when you try a manual backup.  Are they identical machines (apart from O/S). If not, it could be worthwhile checking to see if there any manufacturers drivers available. Also, Microsoft have a toolkit available for WHS. The download is here, while there is a ReadMe in this post, from the Home Server Team.

    This includes tools for checking the network etc., so will be a good start.

     

    Colin

     

    Tuesday, February 5, 2008 5:50 PM
  • Just as a test you might try connecting one of the computers that is failing backup to the port occupied by the one that is successful and try that.  You might also run disk diagnostics on the machines that fail backup.  Colin is right about the toolkit, it has some diagnostic tools in it for testing connectivity.

    Friday, February 15, 2008 3:53 PM
  • I have a very similar problem. Using the HP Mediasmart Home server with two PC's configured, one running XP the other Vista. The XP backs up ok every time, but the Vista machine fails with the 'lost network connection' error. It's taken me a while to track down what I think is happening, but I think the problem is caused by having part of my C drive partioned as another virtual disk. On this partioned drive I keep my video files - large files - some more than 20GBytes. If I reconfigure the backups to ignore the partioned drive, the backup works ok. So I'm asuming the problem is something to do with backing up very large files.

    Not sure if this helps you are not, but maybe first thing to check is to see if you have very large files on your Vista PC.

    I assume there must be a parameter somewhere to increase the network timeout value. Anyone know where this is and how to change it?

    Steve
    Monday, March 10, 2008 9:31 PM
  • Do a FULL error check and a defrag on the PCs that are no getting backed up. Should be ok after doing them.

    Monday, March 31, 2008 10:00 AM
  • My WHS also seems to choke during backups and when moving files across the network that are larger than one GB. Whenever that happens it becomes completely unresponsive.

     

    It might be that the drivers for the Realtek-networkcard I use are buggy/unsupported, so I'm thinking of buying or installing another one. Which card/chipset should I go for?

     

    And...is it really true that the Realtek-chipsets/drivers are the most probable cause of these problems?

     

    Configuration:

    My WHS-configuration is based on an Asus motherboard with an AMD64-processor with 1,5GB of DDR RAM. The motherboard is using an NVidia nForce chipset with on-board Gigabit LAN. This is connected to the LAN.

     

    I'm using a Realtek-network-card based on the 8139-chipset for my Internet-connection.

     

    The nForce network-connection is set as the preferred network-connection. 

     

    The drivers for the nForce chipset are from 2006 and the drivers I'm using for the Realtek-chipset are WHQL from february 2008.

    Monday, March 31, 2008 1:39 PM
  •  Lemming wrote:

    And...is it really true that the Realtek-chipsets/drivers are the most probable cause of these problems?

    MS has sent out VERY BAD realtek drivers as part of autoupdates in the past, rolling back on my Vista machine fixed it.  Chipset is fine as were drivers until MS hosed the drivers.

    Monday, March 31, 2008 8:18 PM
  • Thank you for the reply. I know that Microsoft had a big argument with 3Com in the past and purposefully sabotaged their network-cards for a couple of years as well. The attitude of M$ towards Realtek doesn't seem out of place at all.

     

    Unfortunately, after having spent many hours yesterday trying different drivers and options, I think the fault is actually with WHS's handling of the nVidia nForce 430-chipset-drivers. Seeing the problems MANY people are having with network-timeouts I believe WHS has another MAJOR PROBLEM on its hands: The network-support is WAY below par.

     

    The default time-outs are just too short crashing parts of the Win2003-server environment and making WHS as good as useless in the real-world. The 'real-world' in this case being 'non-technical home-users'.

     

    Can anyone tell me where I can find the key to changing/increasing this time-out value?

    Tuesday, April 1, 2008 9:57 PM
  •  Lemming wrote:
    The 'real-world' in this case being 'non-technical home-users'.
    Those are the users that are buying HP MediaSmart Servers by the thousands; the MediaSmart Server doesn't have this issue. And if they're buying from a system builder that does a custom build for them, well it's part of the system builder's job to make sure all the components used are of sufficient quality. No, the people having this particular problem are the enthusiasts who have bought/repurposed inexpensive hardware.

    And the network support is on a part with the rest of Windows Server 2003. There's a reason you don't see certain chipsets, NICs, etc. being used in servers...
    Wednesday, April 2, 2008 11:33 AM
    Moderator
  •  Ken Warren wrote:
    Those are the users that are buying HP MediaSmart Servers by the thousands; the MediaSmart Server doesn't have this issue. And if they're buying from a system builder that does a custom build for them, well it's part of the system builder's job to make sure all the components used are of sufficient quality. No, the people having this particular problem are the enthusiasts who have bought/re purposed inexpensive hardware.

    And the network support is on a part with the rest of Windows Server 2003. There's a reason you don't see certain chip sets, NICs, etc. being used in servers...

    Ken,

    You can't have it both ways.  You can't tell us:

    System Requirements

    The minimum system requirements for Windows Home Server are moderate compared to typical modern desktop computer hardware. It is possible to re purpose an old desktop computer to run Windows Home Server.

     

    and then turn around and tell us we need hardcore server systems for it to work.  Initially the 3c509 family of NICs was not supported and my company has standardized on that family of NIC.

    Thursday, April 3, 2008 1:12 AM
  • I'm having serious network issues too and I bought new equipment as a system builder for my clients. I've standardized on the MSI P6NGM-FD for my motherboard because of it's processor support, integrated video/audio and NIC - the Realtek RTL8211BL. The chipset drivers are nForce 630i and are as current as nVidia or MSI have published, ver 64.6.7 Sept 2007 for the NIC driver. I have more network dissruptions with only the WHS box than with my first ArcNet network in the mid 80's. I've isolated it to either the WHS OS or the Realtek NIC. I'm guessing it is a combination of those two not playing well together.

     

    I have Realtek NIC's running all over the place and none of them have caused me any ill until now. All of my other Realtek NICs are 81nn based so this is actually my first 82nn. In any case I order this NIC, Intel EXPI9300PT  to see if I can remedy the problem. This is certainly not an entry level NIC, nor is it the high end of it's family, but should be able to deal with the traffic I'm producing from the WHS, that's for sure. I'm also going to assemble an identical machine to the original WHS OEM build and throw XP SP2 on it, with the same driver package and see if XP has any of the problems associated with the onboard Realtek NIC or not. At least then I can isolate wether it is WHS or that NIC...

     

    Fortunately or unfortunately, I have three of these machines for clients so I can paly with the configurations to see what is what. Well enough chatting, on to building that XP box to see what is what.

     

    MicroSSG

     

    Thursday, April 3, 2008 3:03 AM
  • I was having trouble with the MS drivers for my reatek onboard NIC and started using the ones from Realtek themselves.  Mine are dated 02/04/2008.

     

    Thursday, April 3, 2008 1:04 PM
  • I can build a server that's a functional equivalent of the HP EX 470 (minus the drive trays and the tiny case) for a bit less than what the HP costs. That's with the OS and decent Windows Server 2003 drivers for the motherboard. You can go way under the HP price if you're willing to do without an integrated gigabit NIC, and accept a desktop motherboard with good Windows Server 2003 drivers (see this newegg.com wish list for an example). I would never advise someone to use a repurposed old desktop computer. Is it possible? Yes; I even did it for my first server. It's not advisable, though. Lack of good drivers and flaky hardware are at the root of a lot of the instability issues you see here in the forums, and they are frankly almost impossible to sort out without a hands-on session.

    Basically, blame Microsoft's marketing team for that statement. Smile Remember, I don't work for Microsoft, I just like one (well, many, really) of their products.
    Thursday, April 3, 2008 3:07 PM
    Moderator
  • I have suffered from the same issue.  I honestly think we have come across something... as I have a DELL 6400 that all of a sudden stopped getting backed-up.  Everything was working well and has been for months and a few weeks ago it stopped being able to be backed-up.

    I have tried to do manual backups and some of them work, I do it again and they don't.

    I was away this week and last night after leaving the laptop on, it tried to back up... it did not succeed.  I tried a manual this morning and it failed.  I have it configured the way Dell delivered it , Vista C drive;  D-restore drive.  I took D-drive off the back up config this morning hoping that it may do something, nothing, then I took C off to only backup D drive.  That worked...  D-drive is about 10GB.  I just reconfigured the C drive to be backed-up, and tried again to do a manual back up....

    This time it worked.... both C dirve and D drive were backup.

     Did it again...it failed...  go figure that one??????

    All I can point ot right now, is that I did not touch the PC while it was backing up...  when it failed the last time, I was reading more Microsoft Forum stuff, while it was backing up.

    Could it be that a time out (very short) would be the issue and if the computer is busy with some other job, BANG the backup fails?  I am on a gig-e wired LAN.

    Comments?
    Saturday, April 4, 2009 10:39 AM
  • I have suffered from the same issue.  I honestly think we have come across something... as I have a DELL 6400 that all of a sudden stopped getting backed-up.  Everything was working well and has been for months and a few weeks ago it stopped being able to be backed-up.

    I have tried to do manual backups and some of them work, I do it again and they don't.

    I was away this week and last night after leaving the laptop on, it tried to back up... it did not succeed.  I tried a manual this morning and it failed.  I have it configured the way Dell delivered it , Vista C drive;  D-restore drive.  I took D-drive off the back up config this morning hoping that it may do something, nothing, then I took C off to only backup D drive.  That worked...  D-drive is about 10GB.  I just reconfigured the C drive to be backed-up, and tried again to do a manual back up....

    This time it worked.... both C dirve and D drive were backup.

     Did it again...it failed...  go figure that one??????

    All I can point ot right now, is that I did not touch the PC while it was backing up...  when it failed the last time, I was reading more Microsoft Forum stuff, while it was backing up.

    Could it be that a time out (very short) would be the issue and if the computer is busy with some other job, BANG the backup fails?  I am on a gig-e wired LAN.

    Comments?

    First, you should start your own thread (instead of bumping one that is a year old and 2 Power Packs ago). Having said that, my guess is that your NIC/network cabling on that one computer is having issues.
    Saturday, April 4, 2009 2:52 PM
    Moderator