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Windows 7 Release Candidate 2 RRS feed

  • Question


  • The testers will be reporting these already fixed bugs as still being present. It is very frustrating when a tester spends their valuable time finding, documenting and reporting a bug only to get a reply that this is a duplicate and has already been fixed in a later version. It is equally frustrating for a beta team member to spend their valuable time tracking down a bug report that they eventually find has already been reported and fixed.

    Ronnie Vernon MVP


    This paragraph seems to add justification to releasing updates and/or RCs more frequently.  Was that intended?



    - also -

    I still am wondering why the Vista team hasn't been reassigned to Windows 7 development.  Anybody got a comment?

    Friday, April 17, 2009 12:01 PM

All replies

  • egads -

    Just a silly thought - but the Vista team haven't been entirely reassigned to Win 7 maybe because it's still a supported OS?

    Friday, April 17, 2009 6:17 PM

  • Keep going.  You are getting close to my point...

    Friday, April 17, 2009 6:23 PM


  • Keep going.  You are getting close to my point...


    Let me try it this way:

    (1)  The interval between Vista-SP1 and Vista-SP2(RC) has been a full year, with no end in sight. 

    (2)  Concurrently, Windows 7 RC is said to be in progress, but no formal release target specified.

    (3)  From two posts above, there are concerns about diluting project resources.

    (4)  A solution is sought to service so-called emerging markets:  Windows 7 Editions Announced

    Saturday, April 18, 2009 12:21 AM
  • egads -

    Not entirely sure where exactly it is you're trying to go... If you want to make a point, then please... make it.

    1.) So...? They're testing and fixing and finalizing SP2. Big deal. Exactly where is it written that code must be released on a set schedule? Better to be fixed and working properly than released prematurely with a bunch of bugs.

    2.) The problem with fixing a target date for a release is you run the risk of missing it - and that tends to make you look bad. Previously, Microsoft was criticized for doing just that. Now they're not telling us when the RC is due and they're catching flack for that. No winning for Microsoft...

    3.) Where would you get the idea that there would be any dilution of project resources? There's more than one team of programmers. I'm sure they DO communicate between each other - if for no other reason than to keep other teams on the same page when it comes to compatability and interoperability between versions. But where's the dilution factor come in?

    4.) No idea what the problem here is. What to emerging markets have to do with anything previously mentioned?

    Saturday, April 18, 2009 12:58 AM

  • (4)  Once Windows 7 is released, what value and/or market will remain for Vista?  "Emerging Markets" seems practical to me.

    (3)  Ronnie enumerated "valuable time finding, documenting and reporting" three posts above.  Sounds like engineering resources to me.

    (2)  If you respond to everything I say as adversarial, of course you will interpret my post as criticism.

    (1)  If you respond to everything I say as adversarial, of course you will interpret my post as criticism.



    But you want to hear some criticism?  Here it is.  I happen to like Vista.  Alot.  But realistically, it is dead.  It was never supported correctly by the so-called ecosystem, and now that Windows 7 is on the horizon, nobody will invest any further effort into Vista.  Not unless it just happens to be coincidental with Windows 7 support.  Yet we see Microsoft investing a full team-year in updating Vista to SP2.  What sense is there in that?  It would make plenty of sense, and demonstrate good-will, if Microsoft would provide that very excellent O/S to so-called Emerging Markets.  Instead of a crippled Windows 7.  It would also make plenty of sense, and demonstrate good-will, if Microsoft would provide a reduced-cost upgrade path to current Vista licensees.  It would also make plenty of sense if Microsoft would focus more purely at polishing the UI of the up-and-coming Windows 7.  Instead of leaving uncorrected "features" as has been their historic pattern.

    You will take the above paragraph as a personal assault?  Tough.  That's your problem.  It is just sincere interest on my part to see things go the right way.

    Saturday, April 18, 2009 1:18 AM

  • (4)  Once Windows 7 is released, what value and/or market will remain for Vista?  "Emerging Markets" seems practical to me.

    (3)  Ronnie enumerated "valuable time finding, documenting and reporting" three posts above.  Sounds like engineering resources to me.

    (2)  If you respond to everything I say as adversarial, of course you will interpret my post as criticism.

    (1)  If you respond to everything I say as adversarial, of course you will interpret my post as criticism.



    But you want to hear some criticism?  Here it is.  I happen to like Vista.  Alot.  But realistically, it is dead.  It was never supported correctly by the so-called ecosystem, and now that Windows 7 is on the horizon, nobody will invest any further effort into Vista.  Not unless it just happens to be coincidental with Windows 7 support.  Yet we see Microsoft investing a full team-year in updating Vista to SP2.  What sense is there in that?  It would make plenty of sense, and demonstrate good-will, if Microsoft would provide that very excellent O/S to so-called Emerging Markets.  Instead of a crippled Windows 7.  It would also make plenty of sense, and demonstrate good-will, if Microsoft would provide a reduced-cost upgrade path to current Vista licensees.  It would also make plenty of sense if Microsoft would focus more purely at polishing the UI of the up-and-coming Windows 7.  Instead of leaving uncorrected "features" as has been their historic pattern.

    You will take the above paragraph as a personal assault?  Tough.  That's your problem.  It is just sincere interest on my part to see things go the right way.

    Saturday, April 18, 2009 1:56 AM

  • The testers will be reporting these already fixed bugs as still being present. It is very frustrating when a tester spends their valuable time finding, documenting and reporting a bug only to get a reply that this is a duplicate and has already been fixed in a later version. It is equally frustrating for a beta team member to spend their valuable time tracking down a bug report that they eventually find has already been reported and fixed.

    Ronnie Vernon MVP


    This paragraph seems to add justification to releasing updates and/or RCs more frequently.  Was that intended?



    - also -

    I still am wondering why the Vista team hasn't been reassigned to Windows 7 development.  Anybody got a comment?


    Egads

    Nope, just the opposite.




    Ronnie Vernon MVP
    Saturday, April 18, 2009 2:17 AM

  • (4)  Once Windows 7 is released, what value and/or market will remain for Vista?  "Emerging Markets" seems practical to me.

    (3)  Ronnie enumerated "valuable time finding, documenting and reporting" three posts above.  Sounds like engineering resources to me.

    (2)  If you respond to everything I say as adversarial, of course you will interpret my post as criticism.

    (1)  If you respond to everything I say as adversarial, of course you will interpret my post as criticism.



    But you want to hear some criticism?  Here it is.  I happen to like Vista.  Alot.  But realistically, it is dead.  It was never supported correctly by the so-called ecosystem, and now that Windows 7 is on the horizon, nobody will invest any further effort into Vista.  Not unless it just happens to be coincidental with Windows 7 support.  Yet we see Microsoft investing a full team-year in updating Vista to SP2.  What sense is there in that?  It would make plenty of sense, and demonstrate good-will, if Microsoft would provide that very excellent O/S to so-called Emerging Markets.  Instead of a crippled Windows 7.  It would also make plenty of sense, and demonstrate good-will, if Microsoft would provide a reduced-cost upgrade path to current Vista licensees.  It would also make plenty of sense if Microsoft would focus more purely at polishing the UI of the up-and-coming Windows 7.  Instead of leaving uncorrected "features" as has been their historic pattern.

    You will take the above paragraph as a personal assault?  Tough.  That's your problem.  It is just sincere interest on my part to see things go the right way.


    1 & 2.) I wasn't trying to be adversarial. I am, however, trying to understand exactly where you're coming from.

    3.) So... Ronnie posted some links to some engineering blogs and information. I'm still not seeing any reason why there would be a shortage of hired programming help that would require moving Vista people over to the Windows 7 team.

    4.) Ok... So you think they should scuttle the Starter and Home Basic versions in favor of giving these emerging markets Vista. Eh... That might be an idea... Tho given the reputation Vista has in many circles... I'm not so sure how favorably most of those emerging markets would feel about that. At least, with Windows 7, they'd be on the same page as the rest of the world and might not figure they were being given what they may see as a second rate OS. Nor would they feel like they were getting someone else's hand-me-downs.

    You see, it doesn't matter what you or I think of Vista. Our opinion doesn't really matter a bit. What DOES matter is that Vistas reputation has been tarnished by a ton of FUD and nonsense bouncing around the Internet's echo chamber. As much as we'd like it to be different, there's still plenty of FUD bouncing around out there. In many people's opinion, Vista is ____. They don't know WHY it is considered as such, but that's what they've heard. Their best friend told them so. They read it was so on some blog somewhere. Their favorite computer geek (who happens to be a Linux head) thinks it's garbage and told them as much.

    A couple of months ago, I was at a computer show and some guy made a comment about how bad Vista was. I asked him exactly why that was so. He couldn't give me a definitive answer. Just that he read this and heard that. I asked him if he ever sat down and even tried it for himself. Nope. He never looked at it. I told him NOT to rush to judgement and to actually take a look at it BEFORE he so easily makes his mind up. By the time I got done with him, he was actually kinda interested in looking into it.

    The Mojave Experiment bears this out. Not only did the vast majority of the people who sat down never see Vista in action prior to their sitting down and getting the demo, they were amazed to find that it didn't suck that dozen rotten eggs like they were repeatedly told it did.

    As far as Vista support goes. You're probably right there won't be too much effort going toward developing for it unless it's going to run on Win 7 as well. Is that such a terrible thing? Probably not. Windows 7's popularity will pretty much guarantee Vista will have a longer life than if Microsoft dropped the entire code base and went onto something else. Of course, had they done that at this point, they would have really lost ALL credibility and would have really given the competition a major boost.

    As far as I'm concerned, Vista does have ONE feature that Windows 7 never will. Classic mode. That will be something to give those who can't handle the new task bar and such something with better security than XP.

    Fear not, Vista won't be going away for a long while yet.
    Saturday, April 18, 2009 7:50 AM