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Does Sync Framework 2.0 work on Windows Mobile Devices? RRS feed

  • Question

  • Hi,

    When is the ETA of Sync Framework 2.0 for Windows Mobile? I am using V1 and would like to benefit from V2!!!

    Thanks,
    Gavin
    Thursday, March 4, 2010 9:49 AM

Answers

  • Gavin,

    We currently do not have any dates to announce regarding a SyncFx v2 devices release.  Please stay tuned to our blog for more info.  We are currently looking at the developer platform for Windows Phone 7 and trying to understand how we can light up on that platform.  In addition, we are exploring options that might allow us to add support for a wide range of devices.  For more info, you might find the following PDC session interesting:

    http://microsoftpdc.com/Sessions/SVC23

    Regards,


    Sean Kelley
    Senior Program Manager
    Microsoft
    Wednesday, March 10, 2010 1:28 AM

All replies

  • Gavin,

    We currently do not have any dates to announce regarding a SyncFx v2 devices release.  Please stay tuned to our blog for more info.  We are currently looking at the developer platform for Windows Phone 7 and trying to understand how we can light up on that platform.  In addition, we are exploring options that might allow us to add support for a wide range of devices.  For more info, you might find the following PDC session interesting:

    http://microsoftpdc.com/Sessions/SVC23

    Regards,


    Sean Kelley
    Senior Program Manager
    Microsoft
    Wednesday, March 10, 2010 1:28 AM
  • Hi Sean,

    Can you maybe ellaborate a bit on what the current progress is with SyncFx V2 for Devices? I mean specifically, is there an internal road map for the project, has it been started, has it been put on hold indefinitely?

    I'm a bit concerned about this as we have committed to SyncFX for Devices for a major product at our company and would be in a bit of a pickle if V2 is but a distant dream.

    Many thanks in advance,

    Paul.
    Tuesday, March 16, 2010 11:15 AM
  • Hi Sean,

    I am worried that Microsoft is missing a very serious problem here.

    Windows Phone 7 is a consumer-only release, so it will never be relevant for us because the devices that our customers run our software on are enterprise-oriented (Symbol CN50 and the like), and will never run Windows Phone 7. These devices will continue to run Windows Mobile 6.x until a more enterprise-oriented version of Windows 7 sees the light of day.

    So, while Sync Framework 2.0 for Windows Phone 7 is absolutely a good idea, I think support for Windows Mobile 6.x and Compact Framework is much more needed in the short term (heck, Windows Phone 7 is not even out yet). Yes, version 1.0 kinda sorta works but it has severe limitations compared to 2.0, and there is no SQL Azure provider for it...

    For planning purposes, it would be very helpful to know if Windows Mobile 6.x support in Sync Framework 2.0 is even happening at all. If not, we and a lot of other ISV are in major trouble, as Paul points out, and will have to seriously reassess the situation and think long and hard about how to proceed from here. If it is at least on the roadmap, just a ballpark estimate of when it might happen would be very helpful too.

    On a more general note, I think it's extremely unfortunate that everything surrounding Windows Mobile 6.x is being dropped in attempts to focus on Windows Phone 7, because the latter simply is not a viable replacement for the former... even though we would like nothing more than to move to the new platform, it is simply not possible because the new platform is for consumer devices - it's just not available to us.


    Daniel Stolt, Perceptible, http://www.perceptible.net
    Wednesday, March 31, 2010 10:36 AM
  • Hi Paul and Daniel

    We do plan to provide a solution for WM6.x, but our approach does not involve porting all of Sync Framework to WM6.x.

    With our forthcoming V3 release we will enable offline applications to be built for any client platform, including WM6.x.  Sean referenced the PDC session above, where we announced this forchoming capability.  We also provided updates at MIX10 - http://live.visitmix.com/MIX10/Sessions/SVC10.  We even had a demo prepared for MIX10 (that we didn't have time to show) that showed the session planner client running in the WM6.x emulator, in addition to the iPhone, WP7 and Silverlight clients we did demo.

    We will allow developers to expose data using a sync protocol which can be utilized by any client.  This is possible because no Sync Framework bits are required on the client, the server/service does all the sync processing using Sync Framework.  We will specifically provide client support for Silverlight and Windows Phone 7 Series.  We will also release samples for other client platforms; a WM6.x sample is a high priority.  By specifying a sync protocol and providing the server/service side components to expose data from SQL Server or SQL Azure with the protocol, we allow complete flexibility regarding the client platform.

    There will be some limitations for a client using the protocol compared to a Windows client having the Sync Framework installed.  For example, peer-to-peer sync will not be possible.  We believe that the protocol solution will be sufficient for a large set of scenarios, with Windows clients being required if the full capabilities of Windows and Sync Framework are required.

    We plan to make available a preview release in the next couple of months, so please keep an eye out on our blog for the announcement.  It would be great for you to try out and see the preview if it will satisfy your requirements.  We will specificially be looking for feedback on the protocol as well as the Silverlight/WP7 components.  Our goal is for Sync Framework V3 to be a great release for device-based offline clients, including WM6.x.

     

    • Proposed as answer by Daniel Stolt Thursday, April 1, 2010 5:07 AM
    Wednesday, March 31, 2010 5:09 PM
  • Hi Mark,

    Your reply is among the most relevant, informative and helpful response I've ever received from Microsoft. Thank you!!

    So, if I'm understanding this, what is being exposed for clients (other than Silverlight/WP7) is essentially just a specification, of which we ourselves can write an implementation for any client we want, including WM6.x.

    Two questions come to mind:

    1. Will there be an out-of-box mechanism for change tracking on the client device for SQL Compact or is this something we will have to implement ourselves?
    2. Will the protocol have support for schema initialization?

    Great to hear that a preview release is coming in the next couple of months - rest assured we will be among the first to examine it and give you feedback!


    Daniel Stolt, Perceptible, http://www.perceptible.net
    Thursday, April 1, 2010 5:21 AM
  • Wow, thanks, Mark.

    After months of trying to get information about Sync on devices and getting nothing but silence, you have far and away been the one to answer most clearly and specifically.

    WM6.x and Android are the only platform for field-rugged portable devices, so please don't abandon this core. We've invested a lot of effort into SyncFX and then basically were left hanging with a CTP for 18 months. I was just now looking to see if there was any word on WM6.x before I started to explore the other side, which has a decent Sync solution already released.

    I have the same needs as Daniel, apparently: client-side change tracking and metadata initialization. Where can we get in early on the CTP?

    Monday, April 5, 2010 11:23 AM
  • Hi,

    We are also working with Enterprise-level devices (Motorola MC75/etc.) and have an app that 'works', but really have had to do a ton of things to get there given the severe limitations of v1 in 'real-life' scenarios.. 

    CodeKaizen - please define/elaborate on 'the other side', as it might be something that we need to investigate in the (very) near future..

    Mark - ditto on the Beta request ;-)

    Regards, 

    Charles R. Tomlinson | Senior Consultant/Developer | Alocet Inc.

    Wednesday, April 7, 2010 1:35 PM
  • @Sean and Mark,
    again thank you for sharing with us. even if most of us will not be pleased that nothing will happen with sync on devices in the next months it is good to get _any_ information.
    even though v3 and the protocol idea sounds promising I am a bit disappointed by the priority decisions. as was already said, WP7 is no option in the short and even mid term for line of business applications on industry devices. I feel MS forgets that Windows Mobile / Windows CE is the major platform for professional lob apps. I do see that you fully focus on not being totally left behind by the competitors in the device market, but WP7 and shiny community "apps" that rely heavily on cloud services (thus needing sql azure sync capabilities) is not what is needed in the professional market right now. developers could get frustrated and turn to other solutions (e.g. android) for future projects...

    @Chuck Tomlinson & others:
    we seem to all have struggled with v1 and all came up with solutions that "work". perhaps we could collect and share our findings to allow to further improve as it is clear now that there will be now improvements made available on the short hand.
    what were your approaches? throughout this forums some ideas are mentioned but never really a solution or working code was shown. 

    Regards,
    Andreas

    Wednesday, April 7, 2010 7:54 PM
  • We have offline Windows Mobile devices, currently WM5, but WM6 would be fine and is on the horizon. We were using Merge Replication but for our next release we're moving to the Sync Framework 2.0 to overcome some of the limitations. One gain is that we can move to SQL Compact and away from SQL Server on the PC. 

    The lack of the WM support means we can't do device to device sync which would have been a major help and remains a goal for us. We also need some custom metadata to support change unit tracking for database columns.

    The plan we're looking at is creating our metadata on the device and using a partial provider on the PC to sync with the device.

    I've been wondering if the ADO.NET  on the devices provides any support for creating the metadata? Or if there's anything else that would help with that task.

    I am interested in in sharing ideas with this group as well.

    -- Windflower

    Thursday, April 8, 2010 2:20 PM
  • We have offline Windows Mobile devices, currently WM5, but WM6 would be fine and is on the horizon. We were using Merge Replication but for our next release we're moving to the Sync Framework 2.0 to overcome some of the limitations. One gain is that we can move to SQL Compact and away from SQL Server on the PC. 

    The lack of the WM support means we can't do device to device sync which would have been a major help and remains a goal for us. We also need some custom metadata to support change unit tracking for database columns.

    The plan we're looking at is creating our metadata on the device and using a partial provider on the PC to sync with the device.

    I've been wondering if the ADO.NET  on the devices provides any support for creating the metadata? Or if there's anything else that would help with that task.

    I am interested in in sharing ideas with this group as well.

    -- Windflower

    Thursday, April 8, 2010 2:20 PM
  • Wanted to respond to some of the questions ...

    Daniel:

    Will there be an out-of-box mechanism for change tracking on the client device for SQL Compact or is this something we will have to implement ourselves?

    Our sample for WM6.x will use SQL Compact and will show how best to configure change tracking for use with the protocol.

    Will the protocol have support for schema initialization?

    Not in the protocol.  You have to have your own mechanism to create the schema.  The protocol has no knowledge of what the client platform is or what store it is using.

    codekaizen:

    I'd like to have a sample for Android.  If we do not produce it in the near term, I hope it should be fairly straightforward for you or someone else to port one of our other samples.

    forstingera:

    I just want to clarify that our V3 release can be utilized on-premises as well as with the cloud.  I.e. you will be able to create a sync service and deploy it to IIS, Windows Server and use SQL Server as well as being able to deploy to Windows Azure and utilize SQL Azure.

    Note to everyone:

    Please do keep an eye out on our blog for the announcement regarding a preview of some of our V3 capabilities.  We believe it will provide support a lot of the WM5/6 scenarios, but would really appreciate your feedback on what it is missing once you've played with it.  Current plans are that device-to-device sync would not be supported, which I know will cause some pain.  ETA is 1-2 months for the preview release.

     

    Wednesday, April 21, 2010 6:59 PM
  • Mark,

    We've been watching your team blog very closely since your last reply, looking for any kind of announcement pertaining to V3. It's been 4 months now, and since you stated an ETA of 1-2 months for the preview release I thought I'd check in and see what's going on... is the preview somewhere I haven't been looking?

    Thanks!


    Daniel Stolt, Perceptible, http://www.perceptible.net
    Wednesday, August 25, 2010 6:44 PM
  • the preview has gone out by invite only sometime ago...

    check out this discussion on how to get invited: http://social.microsoft.com/Forums/en-US/syncdevdiscussions/thread/d2611400-e3c3-4ed8-a28a-25185ce3ffc3

    the preview release discussion is on this forum: http://social.microsoft.com/Forums/en-US/synclab/threads

    Thursday, August 26, 2010 1:11 AM
  • Hi Daniel

    We did produce a preview release a couple of months ago, but as JuneT states we decided to make it invitation-only so we could get some initial feedback.  We do have a public release planned in the near future.

    Feel free to email us and we should be able to give you access to the current preview release - msf30ctp at microsoft dot com

    Apologies for not being proactive and contacting you and others on the thread regarding the preview release.

    Regards, Mark

    Sunday, September 5, 2010 5:10 PM
  • Hi Sean,

    - Does Sync framework work on WM5.0 with .NET CF 2.0?

    - If yes, what version of the Sync framework supports this?

    I want to make a simple Proof-Of-Concept app, in which, I can send a file from one WM5 device to another (WM5 device), over Bluetooth. The devices that my client has, unfortunately, do not support the Microsoft BT stack.

    I'm using VS2005 and .NET CF 2.0. The project I'm working on dictates the use of .NET CF 2.0 and WM5.

    Thanks In Advance


    George Papadopoulos

    Thursday, November 4, 2010 9:58 AM