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Stricter rules for marking answers, appointing answerers and moderation

    General discussion

  • First of all, when appointing answerers, a very thorough look must be taken at the quality of posts. Appointing answerers just by looking at recognition points and achievements is 100% wrong and it shows: (Please note I am not doing any personal attack, it's just an example) see this thread. Here the person posting the reply was made an answerer recently and if someone reads the thread, it's obvious that the issue was NOT solved. Not only that but the OP responded stating that the solution posted by that answerer didn't help him. Yet, the answerer WRONGLY exercised his power to mark his own post as the answer (why do answerers even get the power of marking their own post as answer?)

    That's one thread. Here's another. In this case, he posted something which was wrong. Then I posted a correct solution. But still that answerer had to mark his post as the answer as well, along with mine. It's not me saying my solution was correct, anyone having a fair enough knowledge about getting a deleted system file back would know why my post is correct and his incorrect.

    And there's another. It was a programming question posted at TechNet. It needed to be moved to MSDN in an ideal case by a moderator. Someone replied asking the OP to post it in a programming forum. But still the answerer posted asking for more details, and marked both his as well as the other person's post as answer. And there are many other examples.

    So, first of all, some moderator must send a warning to that person (ArnavSharma) for repeatedly violating guidelines 2 (seen here) and 5 (pick any of the above mentioned threads for an example of where this was violated).

    Next, here is what I want from the Forum Management:

    • I have seen LOTS of cases where moderators don't move threads, instead posting and asking the OP to re-post the question. According to this, this is only to be done when it involved Microsoft Answers. But moderators don't move threads from TechNet to MSDN (or vice-versa) when required. Not even from, say suppose Windows XP IT Pro Forums to Windows 7 IT Pro forums when someone posts in the wrong forum. Moderators must be asked to do so.
    • An answer is an attempt to solve the problem. Only posts doing so should be marked as answers by moderators. Other things such as posting in correct forum, etc. must not be marked as answers.
    • When appointing an answerer, the moderators and/or Forum Owner should pay attention to quality of posts.
    • Moderators to read the entire thread before marking an answer. What sometimes currently happens is, people post many solutions for a thread. If someone proposes their post as the answer (which is discouraged, which is why the other posters don't do it) the moderator just marks that self-proposed post as answer. 

    I really hope these issues are addressed as soon as possible. While the idea of moderators marking answers is a good one in theory, the implementation is highly flawed.

    Sunday, June 16, 2013 4:58 PM

All replies

  • I checked two threads you referred to and I think I agree with you. I also agree with the comment in general. If you want something to be done about particular case, you may want to send email to fissues at microsoft dot com or alternatively to edprice at microsoft dot com.

    There is no absolutely best system and in every system can be cases like that or problems.


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    Monday, June 17, 2013 5:28 PM
    Moderator
  • I attempted to add a comment to that article you linked. I also think we need more clarifications for MSDN/TechNet moving procedure. 

    Say, I always try to find appropriate forum to move threads from one forum to another but sometimes it is a very hard task. Also, when moving the original thread info is not visible (unless you opened it first in another window), so it becomes a complex process by its own.

    If I am unable to figure out a good forum, I may move to "Where is the forum for" forum. I noticed that many other moderators use this forum as their first choice rather than attempting to find good forum and move there instead.


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    Monday, June 17, 2013 5:40 PM
    Moderator
  • I try to move to the correct forum as well, but when it's for a technology that I have little experience in, and for which there are multiple forums, I will pick the "Where is the forum for..." forum, as that's almost sure to get a good response.

    Karl


    When you see answers and helpful posts, please click Vote As Helpful, Propose As Answer, and/or Mark As Answer



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    Monday, June 17, 2013 10:07 PM
  • Thanks for replying Naomi N. I will send the problem to the email address you provided.

    There is no absolutely best system and in every system can be cases like that or problems.

    I agree with you on this. But current system proposed is very good, just need one change: supreme importance to quality of posts when appointing Answerers and Moderators and just ask moderators to follow the guidelines.

    Regarding which forum to move to, I agree it's sometimes difficult to determine the correct forum. But, still as mentioned by you and Karl, moderators should use the "Where is the forum for" forum.

    Tuesday, June 18, 2013 4:44 AM
  • Just sent a mail to fissues at Microsoft.
    Tuesday, June 18, 2013 4:54 PM
  • It might help if the person whose reply has been over-enthusiastically marked as an answer could un-mark it as an answer. It's almost embarrasing to have some of my replies marked so; a simple +1 for being helpful would be more appropriate sometimes.

    --
    Andrew

    Wednesday, June 19, 2013 7:05 PM
  • No reply and no action to the e-mail I sent. Now what should I do?
    Friday, June 21, 2013 4:26 PM
  • Try also sending email to edprice at microsoft dot com If this would not work either, then just wait or let it go.

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    Friday, June 21, 2013 4:40 PM
    Moderator
  • then just wait or let it go.
    Are you serious? I forwarded the message, but how I let it go if there is no response and no action taken?
    Saturday, June 22, 2013 5:02 AM
  • Well, apparently right now the fissues may be struggling with lots of e-mails in regards to bugs in the new design of the forums. So, this problem may not receive high priority. Did you also email Ed?

    I don't have more contacts for you to try. However, you can also write WiKi article about it.


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    Sunday, June 23, 2013 4:30 AM
    Moderator
  • Yes I have forwarded the message to Ed. I will be waiting for some action to be taken till next week. But in case nothing is done or I don't receive a single reply, can you open a thread on moderator forums to unmark his wrongly marked answers, through the acceptance of other moderators?
    Sunday, June 23, 2013 4:54 AM
  • I checked two threads you referred to and I think I agree with you. I also agree with the comment in general. If you want something to be done about particular case, you may want to send email to fissues at microsoft dot com or alternatively to edprice at microsoft dot com.

    There is no absolutely best system and in every system can be cases like that or problems.


    For every expert, there is an equal and opposite expert. - Becker's Law


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    The absolute best system is not to have merit points, or any kind of reward, for any posts. This would keep down post count seekers and improve the help value in this, or any other, forum. It is, in most cases, only an ego factor.

    David Clarke

    Sunday, June 23, 2013 5:01 AM
  • That person (ArnavSharma) is now an MCC. No wonder he would become an MVP by the end of the year if no action is taken.
    Thursday, July 4, 2013 10:44 AM
  • One more solution is to try to find the Owner of that forum and report that user.

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    Thursday, July 4, 2013 5:39 PM
    Moderator
  • One more solution is to try to find the Owner of that forum and report that user.

    For every expert, there is an equal and opposite expert. - Becker's Law


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    I found the owner of the Windows Client forums, but how do I contact him? There is no contact like Twitter or Facebook on his profile?
    Friday, July 5, 2013 10:20 AM
  • Have you tried searching for him (say, Linkedin)? I know it may be frustrating. Hopefully you'll be able to find his contact info.

    Or you may try posting a thread in that forum saying you need to contact that owner and give him way to contact you.


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    Friday, July 5, 2013 4:12 PM
    Moderator
  • Hello!

    Ed Price, SQL Server Customer Program Manager (Blog, Small Basic, Wiki Ninjas, Wiki)

    Answer an interesting question? Create a wiki article about it!

    Thursday, August 8, 2013 12:48 AM
  • http://social.technet.microsoft.com/Forums/windows/en-US/c6c367e8-563d-4642-8f37-7dc3e90a3abc/workgroup-no-longer-accessible#6151ca01-a3f6-434c-9108-850f5801c9c7

    They didn't like that one! Okay, good example. I'll talk to him. Thanks!


    Ed Price, SQL Server Customer Program Manager (Blog, Small Basic, Wiki Ninjas, Wiki)

    Answer an interesting question? Create a wiki article about it!

    Thursday, August 8, 2013 1:08 AM
    • I have seen LOTS of cases where moderators don't move threads, instead posting and asking the OP to re-post the question. According to this, this is only to be done when it involved Microsoft Answers. But moderators don't move threads from TechNet to MSDN (or vice-versa) when required. Not even from, say suppose Windows XP IT Pro Forums to Windows 7 IT Pro forums when someone posts in the wrong forum. Moderators must be asked to do so.

    Right. The main reason why moderators don't move threads is because we don't have enough Moderators to get this done. So we need to add more Moderators. Any suggestions of good community contributors to ask? Ideally we could get more support people hired, but all I can do at this point is find community contributors to help out.

     

    • An answer is an attempt to solve the problem. Only posts doing so should be marked as answers by moderators. Other things such as posting in correct forum, etc. must not be marked as answers.

    Very true; there is one exception, but I don't think it relates to this topic. The one exception is that there's a forum where people ask what forum to ask questions in. All that's done in that forum is answer the question by telling people where to go ask questions. As I mentioned, it doesn't apply to this context. You're talking about the Windows forums.

     

    • When appointing an answerer, the moderators and/or Forum Owner should pay attention to quality of posts.

    Sure. We do. Arnav's a good guy and very knowledgeable. He's just learning some of the etiquette around marking answers. So this is good feedback for him. Thanks!

     

    • Moderators to read the entire thread before marking an answer. What sometimes currently happens is, people post many solutions for a thread. If someone proposes their post as the answer (which is discouraged, which is why the other posters don't do it) the moderator just marks that self-proposed post as answer. 

    Agreed. Mods need to read the whole thing and do their best. Self-proposing is enabled as a feature on purpose. But it needs to be done at the right time.

     

    This is good feedback. Thanks!


    Ed Price, SQL Server Customer Program Manager (Blog, Small Basic, Wiki Ninjas, Wiki)

    Answer an interesting question? Create a wiki article about it!

    Thursday, August 8, 2013 1:51 AM
  • 1. (About thread moving) Well, I agree with the more moderators suggestion, but how do you explain a moderator himself asking the OP to repost instead of moving the thread? Is the thread moving procedure so time-taking that it's significantly time-saving for a moderator to ask the OP to repost instead (I believe not) ?

    2. (About separating answers from other posts) Well, if that one forum is the only exception (and I agree with the reason behind that), why do I see many instances of this in Windows forums?

    3. (About Moderators marking answers) Well, as I understand moderators are appointed in a way that they have good enough knowledge to mark correct posts as answers. However, the number of threads in this forum complaining about moderators marking their own posts as answers, marking wrong posts as answers seems to suggest that there is a need for extensive evaluation before appointing moderators and answerers.

    4. After the Forums redesign, normal users (like me) can no longer view by whom and when was a post proposed as answer, marked as answer etc. This is very bad as it prevents us from reporting incorrect marking of answers as we do not know who marked it. This is also bad as if we make a post and someone from the community proposes it as answer, we do not know who did it. It is nice to know this and it also reflects the quality of the post for example if someone having high knowledge proposes your post as answer.

    To sum up the condition of TechNet forums: good guidelines but poorly executed.

    Thursday, August 8, 2013 11:06 AM
  • If we're talking about moving posts already. The "Where's the forum for...?" forum in my opinion also needs someone who either moves the posts or deletes them, if the asker has posted in another thread already.
    Otherwise, there will be questions like (taking something very simple) "How do I restart my computer?" and the answer to that question just is "Post your question here: www.blabla.bla". Get what I mean? Then if other people have the same problem, they propably find that post first, look at the answers and just anderstand, that they have to go to another forum, where they now do have to search for that same question again.


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    Thursday, August 8, 2013 12:47 PM
  • Livio;

    From the "PURPOSE OF THIS FORUM - This forum tells you where to go ask questions - Please Read Before Posting" thread in the "Where is the forum for..." forum:

    Moving Threads:

    We typically do not move any threads to the best forum, since the purpose and scope is to merely suggest where you should (or could) ask your question (and we might not know for sure).

    However, we can move a thread to a specific forum if the Asker/OP requests it AND provides the URL of the specific forum. (We do not move threads if someone other than the Asker/OP requests it.)

    I'd say the moderators are mostly following the rules there. I have seen some threads moved to a different forum without the OP asking however.

    To directly answer your scenario - I think if someone IS searching for "how do I restart my computer?" and sees that in TechNet we suggest they post on answers.microsoft.com, then the forum is working exactly as intended.

    Karl


    When you see answers and helpful posts, please click Vote As Helpful, Propose As Answer, and/or Mark As Answer



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    Thursday, August 8, 2013 2:13 PM
  • Karl

    Well so that means the Wiki article I mentioned above and what you mentioned here almost contradict each other. However one major problem with the "we move threads only when OP wants" approach is that right now the moderators post something like "... Please post your question in the appropriate forums...". Not everybody posting on this site knows that threads are movable on request. Also if you rely on the OP to give you the link to the forum, why did the OP not post in that forum itself. In other words, the OP has posted the question in the wrong forum because the correct forum is not known, so why do you ask for a link to something the OP doesn't know.

    Well, if OP's decision is to be respected, then the moderator should post something like "This is the wrong forum. May I move it to [XYZ forum]. If you feel forum XYZ is wrong, kindly provide us with a link to the forum you need the thread moved to. [Link to list of forums]."

    Thursday, August 8, 2013 2:39 PM
  • 1. In certain cases the moderator may not know where to move the thread. Also, yes, the moving process is a bit challenging because there are lots of forums to chose from and also you need to know the brand (MSDN, TechNet, Microsoft) to do a correct move. Sometimes that move takes about 5 minutes to do correctly.

    4. Is a bug and was brought out a couple of times. Hopefully that will be resolved soon.


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    Thursday, August 8, 2013 3:24 PM
    Moderator
  • I do not see that you reference the Moving Threads article. However, from that article:

    This guide does not cover all possible scenarios for moving threads because determining when to move threads is very much product or technology-specific.

    As mentioned, the "Where it the forum for..." forum is a different beast.

    Perhaps your suggestions should be part of the WIKI, or at least part of the "PURPOSE OF THIS FORUM - This forum tells you where to go ask questions - Please Read Before Posting" thread in the "Where is the forum for..." forum though....

    Karl


    When you see answers and helpful posts, please click Vote As Helpful, Propose As Answer, and/or Mark As Answer



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    Thursday, August 8, 2013 3:47 PM
  • A related practice of some newbies here that I find annoying is when the original poster replies to say either that:

    1. "there is apparentl no solution to this problem", or:
    2. "I have finally figured out the solution (but am not posting it here because I already know what it is)"

    and then marks that post as answer.

    In one case the OP applied used method 1 above after a few almost but not quite answers. A few days later I determined what I considered to be an almost exact answer and posted it. The OP never responded again (he had obviously given up expecting to find an answer and his thread was marked as answered), so I suspect he had not seen my suggested answer. I proposed it as answer, even though I rarely do that, in order to catch his attention.

    Point 2, while it satisfies the specific OP, will not do much for other people looking for an answer to the same question.

    Unfortunately, it is difficult to get any newbie to follow standards... ;-)


    Al Dunbar -- remember to 'mark or propose as answer' or 'vote as helpful' as appropriate.

    Thursday, August 8, 2013 3:49 PM
  • That person (ArnavSharma) is now an MCC. No wonder he would become an MVP by the end of the year if no action is taken.

    Earlier you had stated that your comments were not intended as a personal attack, however, subsequent replies such as the one above seem to have come close to crossing that line. I have no experience of Arnav, however Ed indicated that he was knowledgeable, but just learning the etiquette here.

    I think it is good practice to just assume that etiquette and other errors do not represent intentional malfeasance on the part of the poster. When you do find what you believe to be a flagrant abuse, I think it better to report it quietly instead of commenting negatively on an individual's actions in a thread such as this.

    As I say, it seems to me that you may have crossed a line here with respect to one of the rules of etiquette. That said, I assume that your motivation is tied in with your concerns about the prevalence of certain answer marking practices rather than it being a personal vendetta. As such, I thought it more appropriate to share these comments with you than to mark your post as abusive.


    Al Dunbar -- remember to 'mark or propose as answer' or 'vote as helpful' as appropriate.

    Thursday, August 8, 2013 4:03 PM
  • Al Dunbar

    I am not on a war with anyone. It highly irritates me that I write good quality posts following all rules, guidelines while a person gets answerer status just because of these answer marking flaws. I am not saying that person hasn't written anything of good quality, but these instances are very few - not enough to reward him with MCC or Answerer status. I have been watching his posts for over 4 months, so I know the real thing.

    Thursday, August 8, 2013 4:48 PM
  • Swapnil99pro has a good point.

    @Karl,

    I already know that, that's why I'm suggesting something here.


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    Friday, August 9, 2013 6:30 AM
  • Al Dunbar

    I am not on a war with anyone. It highly irritates me that I write good quality posts following all rules, guidelines while a person gets answerer status just because of these answer marking flaws. I am not saying that person hasn't written anything of good quality, but these instances are very few - not enough to reward him with MCC or Answerer status. I have been watching his posts for over 4 months, so I know the real thing.

    I am all for clarifying or updating the processes regarding marking answers in such a way that that credit for solving problems is more accurately attributed.

    Like you, I have also seen situations where someone else's response was marked as the answer even though I had given what I felt was a more applicable one. Unlike you I do not let this "highly irritate" me for a couple of reasons:

    1. it has no financial or other significant impact on me;
    2. being in an irritated state is not good for one's health; and:
    3. there is very little that I can do about it.

    Re point 3: If I were to raise my concern in the same thread or in another thread such as this one, I do not think a correction would be made. I am not even sure that the OP would become aware of the change in the marked answer. The only thing I think would result would be that I would be seen as a complainer.

    We may also have differing opinions about the value of the contributions of others. Having just received my first MCC, I am not even sure what it takes to qualify. I'd be the last one to suggest that any particular MCC (or MVP for that matter) was not deserving. This is, after all, up to Microsoft to determine according to how they evaluate on the criteria.

    My advice to you, and that is all that it is - advice, is to try to take these things a bit less seriously, and also take a bit more care to avoid making comments about others that could be construed as personal or overly critical. In addition to reducing your level of stress, I believe that would have a positive impact on how others view you as a member of this community.


    Al Dunbar -- remember to 'mark or propose as answer' or 'vote as helpful' as appropriate.

    Friday, August 9, 2013 1:48 PM
  • Al Dunbar

    Although I can argue and defend my point but respecting that you are just trying to keep the discussion focused around my first post, I agree to not post anything that could be called a personal attack. However, I also insist you consider my point of view. Validly complaining isn't bad (in general) and no you need not be seen as a complainer for expressing your opinions about wrong answers being marked. Also, if you get sometime please do take a look at Arnav's posts, specifically the ones which I linked to earlier. I sent a mail to Ed for becoming moderator. My mail received no reply while Arnav is a answerer. So, please do compare the quality and quantity of quality posts of mine with his and I am sure you would realize my posts aren't incorrect.

    Friday, August 9, 2013 4:35 PM
  • This thread has gotten long, but I'll make a few comments:

    1. Moderating is a lot of work. Over time as a moderator I find I spend much less time answering questions now.
    2. If the proper forum is a Microsoft Answers forum, we cannot move the thread there. We can only provide a link. I generally move such threads to the "Where is the forum for...?" forum.
    3. We are advised to first propose answers, then if the op has not marked an answer after 7 days, to mark an answer (the preferred outcome is always to have the op mark). This makes it difficult to track things, as you have to go back and keep re-reading the same threads.
    4. Sometimes I have to depend on the reputation of the person that replied. I don't mean points or achievements, but from past experience in the forums I learn who is expert in which fields (I cannot possibly be expert in all the areas covered in many of the forums). If I can check the answer, I do, but often I depend on people I feel I know and trust.
    5. I personally try to never mark my own replies as answer, but I do mark my own as proposed answer, just to trigger the op or someone else. I also am influenced if someone I know marks a proposed answer.


    Richard Mueller - MVP Directory Services

    Friday, August 9, 2013 4:51 PM
  • Richard Mueller

    1. Agreed.

    2. Agreed and what I said in my first post. I am complaining about TechNet to MSDN and vice versa thread moving.

    3. I would prefer leaving the thread if I have no hint about the correctness of the replies rather than marking an answer just because the thread needs to be solved.

    4. Completely agree. What's important is we should trust a person to be knowledgeable based on if he solved the OP's problem and OP marked his solution as the answer.

    5. Agreed.

    Friday, August 9, 2013 5:07 PM
  • Al Dunbar

    Although I can argue and defend my point but respecting that you are just trying to keep the discussion focused around my first post, I agree to not post anything that could be called a personal attack. However, I also insist you consider my point of view. Validly complaining isn't bad (in general) and no you need not be seen as a complainer for expressing your opinions about wrong answers being marked. Also, if you get sometime please do take a look at Arnav's posts, specifically the ones which I linked to earlier. I sent a mail to Ed for becoming moderator. My mail received no reply while Arnav is a answerer. So, please do compare the quality and quantity of quality posts of mine with his and I am sure you would realize my posts aren't incorrect.

    OK, back on topic now...

    I have considered your point of view about wrong answers being marked and generally agree with you. And I have no problem with complaining about wrong answers being marked.

    I have no interest in comparing the quality of your posts with Arnav's, as I have never implied his were better. If you say yours are better than his, I'll take your word for it.

    My apologies if you felt my two replies here amounted to chastizing you. I was intending just to express my opinion, and tried to do so in as respectful a manner possible. I guess the "Ann Landers" post is a good reminder to me that personal comments are usually best avoided here regardless of their nature. ;-)


    Al Dunbar -- remember to 'mark or propose as answer' or 'vote as helpful' as appropriate.

    Friday, August 9, 2013 6:15 PM
  • Dear Ann Landers,

    Please reply to "flotsem" that he doesn't need your advice regarding how to speak tactfully to someone about their netiquette faux pas. He seems to have done an effective job simply by posting his letter to you on a forum. I will certainly try to avoid making comments of a personal nature in future, regardless of their nature.

    I, on the other hand, am apparently in need of some help from you to avoid seeming opportunistic, condescending, self-righteous, and judgmental when I post in forums.

    Perhaps you can also help me reword my automated signature so that it achieves what I originally intended it to, here is the current one:

    Al Dunbar -- remember to 'mark or propose as answer' or
    'vote as helpful' as appropriate.

    There must be an implicit "please" before the word "remember, and an implicit "my response" before the word "as" in both quoted phrases. Also, the "as appropriate" part seems often ignored.

    Now, I know this last request may seem truly off-topic, Ann, but could you possibly encourage Microsoft to give forum users the option to email others directly? We used to have that capability in the good old usenet days, and I found that it helped keep personal and off-topic chatter out of the public domain.


    Al Dunbar -- remember to 'mark or propose as answer' or 'vote as helpful' as appropriate.

    Friday, August 9, 2013 6:45 PM
  • Oh gosh…!! I just joined TechNet, and just to verify and see how things work I came to this section. This is my second post on TechNet BTW J. I’m not as expert like other senior members here, but have a bit of experience in MS technologies, so nothing so new here.  I just started reading the post by Swapnil99Pro, he’s also shared few links in his posts for other users (specifically one user only). I got bit disappointed how people work here, irrespective of hard work people are not awarded, recognized etc.

    But, gradually moved to “That person (ArnavSharma) is now an MCC. No wonder he would become an MVP by the end of the year if no action is taken.” It seems, Swapnil99Pro is just attacking the other person, just personal attacks or something like that. No intention of making forums healthy. Why does it hurt him so much that other people has become MCC, MVP etc.?

    Swapnil99Pro: I don’t think you have any intention of making forums healthy or helping people. Or something creative.

    I checked both the profiles, found that the other profile ie. ArnavSharma is more active and more helpful. I could see more contribution on forums, galleries etc. compared to Swapnil99Pro.

    As per my understanding, and these comments “however Ed indicated that he was knowledgeable, but just learning the etiquette here.” I don’t see any issues if the moderator has missed your question/answer. Only thing that matter is helping people and knowledge.

    I don’t intend to hurt anyone here, but this kind of post are really not appreciated.

    -Carl S.

    Tuesday, August 13, 2013 5:20 AM
  • Al Dunbar

    No, no need to apologize to me for anything. I also like that you discussed this with me before just marking my post as abusive.

    Carl S.

    ArnavSharma is more active and more helpful

    Citation needed for the more helpful part. Ever cared to check out how many of his answers are marked by the OP.

    Wednesday, August 14, 2013 12:22 PM
  • Al Dunbar

    No, no need to apologize to me for anything. I also like that you discussed this with me before just marking my post as abusive.

    Carl S.

    ArnavSharma is more active and more helpful

    Citation needed for the more helpful part. Ever cared to check out how many of his answers are marked by the OP.


    I appreciate how you seem to have understood the intent behind my comments, but I didn't mark your post as abusive.

    Al Dunbar -- remember to 'mark or propose as answer' or 'vote as helpful' as appropriate.

    Wednesday, August 14, 2013 4:58 PM
  • I appreciate how you seem to have understood the intent behind my comments, but I didn't mark your post as abusive.

    Al Dunbar -- remember to 'mark or propose as answer' or 'vote as helpful' as appropriate.

    As far as I can tell, none of the posts in this thread have actually been marked as abusive (unless they've already been deleted). I miss the red border though, that made it much easier to tell at a glance rather than having to looking at the link on each post.

    Don't retire TechNet!

    Wednesday, August 14, 2013 5:04 PM
  • 1. (About thread moving) Well, I agree with the more moderators suggestion, but how do you explain a moderator himself asking the OP to repost instead of moving the thread? Is the thread moving procedure so time-taking that it's significantly time-saving for a moderator to ask the OP to repost instead (I believe not) ?

    2. (About separating answers from other posts) Well, if that one forum is the only exception (and I agree with the reason behind that), why do I see many instances of this in Windows forums?

    3. (About Moderators marking answers) Well, as I understand moderators are appointed in a way that they have good enough knowledge to mark correct posts as answers. However, the number of threads in this forum complaining about moderators marking their own posts as answers, marking wrong posts as answers seems to suggest that there is a need for extensive evaluation before appointing moderators and answerers.

    4. After the Forums redesign, normal users (like me) can no longer view by whom and when was a post proposed as answer, marked as answer etc. This is very bad as it prevents us from reporting incorrect marking of answers as we do not know who marked it. This is also bad as if we make a post and someone from the community proposes it as answer, we do not know who did it. It is nice to know this and it also reflects the quality of the post for example if someone having high knowledge proposes your post as answer.

    To sum up the condition of TechNet forums: good guidelines but poorly executed.

    1. They should move it. But they can't move it to many forums (Microsoft Community/Answers, ASP.NET, IIS.NET, etc.). And if they're not sure, they should move it to the Where Is forum instead.

    2. You shouldn't. We should get more mods to help with this. I'm working on doing this with my forums, and I take requests for all forums.

    3. We'll take it case by case. Sometimes mods don't have Answerers marking any answers, so they feel like they need to mark their own or the forum won't get cleaned up. That's an okay Band-Aid, but the real solution is to build a team of Answerers and Mods so that they don't have to mark their own posts. Since mods can mark their own answers without reason, some do. Those are the cases we need to look at.

    4. This is a Known Issue. I believe the OP and Mods see this, so it can still get taken care of.

    Summary: We're working on the execution of the guidelines. It's individual actions of thousands of people. We're making progress.


    Ed Price, SQL Server Customer Program Manager (Blog, Small Basic, Wiki Ninjas, Wiki)

    Answer an interesting question? Create a wiki article about it!

    Friday, August 16, 2013 10:18 PM
  • That person (ArnavSharma) is now an MCC. No wonder he would become an MVP by the end of the year if no action is taken.

    Earlier you had stated that your comments were not intended as a personal attack, however, subsequent replies such as the one above seem to have come close to crossing that line. I have no experience of Arnav, however Ed indicated that he was knowledgeable, but just learning the etiquette here.

    I think it is good practice to just assume that etiquette and other errors do not represent intentional malfeasance on the part of the poster. When you do find what you believe to be a flagrant abuse, I think it better to report it quietly instead of commenting negatively on an individual's actions in a thread such as this.

    As I say, it seems to me that you may have crossed a line here with respect to one of the rules of etiquette. That said, I assume that your motivation is tied in with your concerns about the prevalence of certain answer marking practices rather than it being a personal vendetta. As such, I thought it more appropriate to share these comments with you than to mark your post as abusive.


    Al Dunbar -- remember to 'mark or propose as answer' or 'vote as helpful' as appropriate.


    Thanks Al. Yes, he apologized and is learning.

    Ed Price, SQL Server Customer Program Manager (Blog, Small Basic, Wiki Ninjas, Wiki)

    Answer an interesting question? Create a wiki article about it!

    Friday, August 16, 2013 10:23 PM
  • I checked two threads you referred to and I think I agree with you. I also agree with the comment in general. If you want something to be done about particular case, you may want to send email to fissues at microsoft dot com or alternatively to edprice at microsoft dot com.

    There is no absolutely best system and in every system can be cases like that or problems.


    For every expert, there is an equal and opposite expert. - Becker's Law


    My blog


    My TechNet articles


    The absolute best system is not to have merit points, or any kind of reward, for any posts. This would keep down post count seekers and improve the help value in this, or any other, forum. It is, in most cases, only an ego factor.

    David Clarke


    I'd almost agree. After all, the main concern with improperly marked answers should be that the quality of advice received is suspect. It is also a concern that the quality of one's own contributions is not accurately rated, but it seems to me that that is secondary to the main concern.

    Al Dunbar -- remember to 'mark or propose as answer' or 'vote as helpful' as appropriate.

    Monday, August 19, 2013 3:05 PM
  • To Ed Price,

    This is the last time I am complaining, and leave it to you to decide what needs to be done-

    See http://social.technet.microsoft.com/Forums/windows/en-US/6cd4eebe-d2ae-422f-b1cf-a4edc304aa86/net-use-problem?forum=itproxpsp#41e27c10-7031-4cba-8263-d24900c26ae1

    Read it and I think you should understand what I want to convey.

    Thank you and I expect appropriate action.

    Sunday, October 27, 2013 2:32 PM