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KB943393 and ADS RRS feed

  • Question

  • So if I'm reading the KB right, any file with an ADS is liable to get corrupted when copied onto WHS?  If this is true, then this is a major issue until MS fixes it with an update.  Basically ADS (alternate data stream) is a "hidden" data that gets attached to a file residing on an NTFS partition that is not normally accessible by the user.  The most frequent use of ADS for home users would be when IE6/7 downloads a file, it will attach an certain ADS that "tags" it as a downloaded content so when you try to open the file, it shows you a security warning.

     

    If this is true, then any data downloaded from the Internet that subsequently gets stored on WHS cannot be trusted...  Is MS going to allow RC users to get the fix when it is available, or will it only be for release?

     

    -- Starfox

    Sunday, October 7, 2007 3:07 PM

Answers

  • We share everyone’s concern, and fixing and testing this issue as one of our top priorities. In the mean while, we would recommend not to store data files with ADS on the shared folders. One way to remove ADS is using the streams utility mentioned in the KB with –d on files before moving them to the shares.

    Thanks,

    Mark

    Wednesday, October 10, 2007 12:32 AM
    Moderator

All replies

  • I think you're reading the KB article correctly. That's certainly my interpretation...

    I would expect that this fix will only be made available for release software. Why would Microsoft patch beta software that's going to expire shortly?
    Sunday, October 7, 2007 3:39 PM
    Moderator
  • I was reading the same thing and was wondering if this could have any bearing on the file corruption issues that some people appear to have had?

     

    Colin

     

    Sunday, October 7, 2007 5:30 PM
  • Colin, this is undoubtedly one source of the file corruption issues. I don't know if it's the only source...
    Sunday, October 7, 2007 6:04 PM
    Moderator
  • Monday, October 8, 2007 1:17 AM
  • Colin,

     

    It was what was causing my .AVI corruption.  Very easy to reproduce with my setup.  I know it is not supported, but I seem to have fixed all my file corruption problems by taking my three harddrives and setting them up in a RAID 5 array.  I then re-installed WHS and of course it only thinks one drive exists.  I have not had any corruption since doing this.  I am under the impression that multiple drives (more than one) have to be present for this problem to rear its head.  I am going to wait for MS to fix this problem before I go back to letting DE control my drives.

     

    BTW.  The Microsoft engineer who contacted me was great.  I was very impressed with the whole experience and I am confident it will all be fixed.

     

    Chad

     

    Monday, October 8, 2007 5:09 AM
  • I agree this is a MAJOR issue.

     

    I scanned my hard drive with some ADS finder tools and I have a bunch of files that have ADS streams that I will need to be located on my WHS.

     

    Since I can't do that withoout corrupting them, I have to assume this is TOP priority at MS or we're all in for a world of hurt.  

     

    There is no practical way to check for ADS files before moving them to the WHS. 

     

    I have to say this is kind of a biggie for this kind of critical problem to be in an RTM release.

     

    I'll be waiting with bated breath for a fix. 

     

    Tuesday, October 9, 2007 7:01 AM
  • I will be receiving my OEM copy from newegg tomorrow and am debating waiting for this fix before installing.

     

    Can someone from the WHS team provide guidance on this given that the integrity of our data is of the utmost importance?

    Tuesday, October 9, 2007 3:11 PM
  • We share everyone’s concern, and fixing and testing this issue as one of our top priorities. In the mean while, we would recommend not to store data files with ADS on the shared folders. One way to remove ADS is using the streams utility mentioned in the KB with –d on files before moving them to the shares.

    Thanks,

    Mark

    Wednesday, October 10, 2007 12:32 AM
    Moderator
  •  Ken Warren wrote:
    I think you're reading the KB article correctly. That's certainly my interpretation...

    I would expect that this fix will only be made available for release software. Why would Microsoft patch beta software that's going to expire shortly?

     

    Maybe the "Doing the Right Thing" part of being a good company would come into play here, or maybe they will let the thousands of beta testers out the get their data trashed.  Not everybody can afford $200+ right away for the OEM version and will be using RC1 for some time.  I personally have over 1 TB of audio and video that are endangered and not that easy to get off the server, if that will even do any good at this point.

     

    I hope the are making this their top priority and will make the fix available to all.

    Wednesday, October 10, 2007 1:16 AM
  • As Mark from the WHS team has said, its one of Microsoft's top priorities, so now I think its just a case of wait for the fix and follow the advice in the KB article.

     

    Dont forget though there have been plenty of warnings about not trusting your important data to BETA software. If people who are using the beta put there data on WHS while it is in beta and it gets "trashed" then they have been warned!

     

    Andrew

     

    Wednesday, October 10, 2007 1:26 AM
    Moderator
  •  dslabby wrote:
    I personally have over 1 TB of audio and video that are endangered and not that easy to get off the server, if that will even do any good at this point.
    I have a similar stack of data. And we're pikers compared to some folks here who have 4, 5, or more TB of data on their servers.

    While I feel for you, beta testers were warned repeatedly not to store their only copy of important, irreplaceable data on WHS. I take it you decided not to heed that warning? I'll give you any advice you seek in the process of solving problems or recovering your files, but the situation is of your own making. Beta software isn't fully tested, and is known to have bugs, potentially severe ones. You ignore those facts of life at your own peril.

    And you would be in an even worse position if Microsoft had decided between RC1 and RTM that they couldn't support a non-destructive upgrade for some reason (perhaps another change to the backup database format, perhaps something else). Today, you only have to recover files if you decide not to move forward. If you couldn't upgrade, you would have to recover files.
    Wednesday, October 10, 2007 3:25 AM
    Moderator
  • Guys, this product is shipping, the beta is over, we are not under the beta tester "aura" anymore...

     

    If you've run this streams detector on every file on your hard drive, it does in fact, report streams present in any thumbs.db file, which is present in all my childrens picture directories...

     

    Backing up these pictures was the whole reason I put WHS in place...

     

    Not good, Not good

     

    Wednesday, October 10, 2007 6:56 AM
  • Dan, the poster to whom I was responding was asking for the fix to be made available to users of RC1, a beta version of the software. Microsoft has said that they are committed to fixing this issue; it would be great to be proven wrong about this, but I don't see them patching a version of the software that will cease to function shortly anyway.
    Wednesday, October 10, 2007 12:16 PM
    Moderator
  • I found a useful freeware tool for scanning a directory (including subdirectories) for files with Alternate Data Strems.  It then gives you the option of viewing the contents of the ADS or removing it.

     

    It can be found here: http://www.spywareinfo.com/~merijn/programs.php#adsspy

    Monday, October 15, 2007 1:42 PM
  • Is this only a issue with people who did a update install from the Beta, or from a full clean install of OEM ?

    Monday, October 15, 2007 4:05 PM
  • Konflict,

    The problem applies to all versions of WHS. However, it's likely that the fix will only be available for the OEM version.

     

    HTH,

     

    Colin

    Monday, October 15, 2007 6:16 PM
  •  

    Thanks ColinWH

     

    I have the OEM and did the reinstall over the Beta, sorry can't remember what that was called. I had the same problems I had with the Beta and more. One was my main machine would give erros everytime it did a backup, second machine worked fine. After the reinstall both machine will now not backup and .exe's will not run anymore after coping them back off of the WHS, including the Connector Software.

     

    I plan on doing a full reformat and install just to make sure everything is clean but not sure if that will fix my problems.

    Monday, October 15, 2007 6:34 PM
  • The article reads "...Then, you try to access the data file by using a home computer that is running antivirus software. In this  case, applications that are running on the home computer do not recognize the file format."

    This makes it sound like it only happens under certain circumstances.  To test this out I tried the following:

    1. Used the ADS Spy program to locate an exe that had an alternate data stream on my local PC.
    2. Generated a MD5 for the file and copied it to one of my home server shares and left it for a few minutes
    3. Copied it back to my local PC and verified the MD5 was the same and that the file ran without error.

    Can anyone confirm that it doesn't always occur?

    Thanks,
    James

    Tuesday, October 16, 2007 6:55 PM
  • I think the corruption can occur when a file with an alternate data stream is opened/manipulated with an application that can use AD Streams. This can be wide and varied.

    Examples:

    Microsoft Internet Explorer can use AD Streams when downloading files for time zone info.

    Windows Photo Gallery can use them to append metadata to AVI files.

     

    So if in doubt Set access to read only and backup if data is already on WHS shares. Use a tool like Beyond Compare to compare CRC's between backups and versions on WHS shares.

    Friday, October 26, 2007 10:59 AM