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Question about Shadow Copies RRS feed

  • Question

  • Hi, I have a HP MediaSmart with WHS. Have some errors on my box usually ending up with me having to run a repair on the SYS disk once a week.

    Investigating this issue I ran into some VolSnap error of not beeing able to add shadow copy storage volumes.

    Looking in the shadow copies tab under properties for C and D disk I see the following error:
    Error 0x8004230f: The shadow copy provider had an unexpexted error while trying to process the specified operation.

    Have anybody else out there the same error, and what does it entail?

    Thanks
    Saturday, September 27, 2008 12:13 PM

Answers

  • So I think I found the problem to why VSS was giving me the strange error. Mounting Truecrypt disks seem to kick the VSS service in the nuts.

    Dismounting all mye truecrypt volumes gives me access to VSS again, strange indeed.
    • Marked as answer by mleru Sunday, September 28, 2008 4:56 PM
    Sunday, September 28, 2008 4:56 PM

All replies

  • On WHS shadow copies do not also work as they should. Also AFAIK shadow copies are disabled on HP mediasmart. 

    If you're interested in the technical details please read How to regain access to previous version of files in WHS shares.
    • Marked as answer by mleru Saturday, September 27, 2008 2:27 PM
    • Unmarked as answer by mleru Sunday, September 28, 2008 2:27 PM
    Saturday, September 27, 2008 1:38 PM
    Moderator
  • Thank you, I have not enabled shadowcopies myself... so it seems it got turned on in the uppgrade from HP?
    Even so it's god to know what the issue is about.

    Question:

    Should I disable the shadow copy service? What is the impact on file duplication (if it is the same technology in use) if it is turned of?

    • Edited by mleru Saturday, September 27, 2008 2:37 PM
    Saturday, September 27, 2008 2:27 PM
  • Hi,
    No, shadow copies have no connection to the WHS duplication. They are part of the underlying server 2003 operating system, and are designed to provide earlier versions of any particular file. However, they were never designed to operate on disks which are attached as mount points - as in WHS - but were to operate on 'normal' disks, ie, C - D - E etc.
    Having them turned off would have the side effect of increasing the unused space on your disks, but not much else.

    Colin
    If anyone answers your query successfully, please mark it as 'Helpful', to guide other users.
    Saturday, September 27, 2008 6:19 PM
    Moderator
  • Thanks for clearing that up for me
    Saturday, September 27, 2008 7:23 PM
  • One more thing

    Looking in the registry under ..\Storage Manager\Volumes\...
    All the drives have the SnapPeriod key set to 0, but I'm still seeing VVS trying to run shadow copy at midnight and failing.
    With the VolSnap error of not being able to add shadow copies.

    Any insights?
    Saturday, September 27, 2008 8:32 PM
  • mleru said:

    One more thing

    Looking in the registry under ..\Storage Manager\Volumes\...
    All the drives have the SnapPeriod key set to 0, but I'm still seeing VVS trying to run shadow copy at midnight and failing.
    With the VolSnap error of not being able to add shadow copies.

    Any insights?


    That's not normal.  If the D volume SnapPeriod key is set to 0, it shouldn't be running at all.  I suppose you could try changing that value to 43200000 (which is 12 hours, the default setting on an OEM license of WHS), letting it run a time or 2, then change it back to 0 to see if it gets rid of those errors.  Although, if it's not affecting anything else, I would just leave it alone.
    Sunday, September 28, 2008 12:06 AM
    Moderator
  • kariya21 said:

    That's not normal.  If the D volume SnapPeriod key is set to 0, it shouldn't be running at all.  I suppose you could try changing that value to 43200000 (which is 12 hours, the default setting on an OEM license of WHS), letting it run a time or 2, then change it back to 0 to see if it gets rid of those errors.  Although, if it's not affecting anything else, I would just leave it alone.


    Actually it's normal and I also wouldn't leave it alone, daily chkdsk will also run on volume snapshot. Failing chkdsk could also be the cause of the SYS errors.

    @mleru, have you ever tried to a server recovery? If not please try. Server recovery should preserve all data in the WHS shares and Client PC backups. After server recovery you will need to reconfigure the box (add users, connect clients, install Add-in's and so on)


    If this doesn't fix your problem you definitely need to contact HP support or your supplier.

    Sunday, September 28, 2008 5:04 AM
    Moderator
  • Hi,

    As just said, the default on a HP Server, (here at least), is that it's set to 0. The system itself then takes care of when it is run.
    Also, as suggested, running Chkdsk on your volume sounds like a good bet, just ensure that you use ' chkdsk /r', so that it actually checks the disk itself, and not just the files on it.

    Colin

    If anyone answers your query successfully, please mark it as 'Helpful', to guide other users.
    Sunday, September 28, 2008 9:54 AM
    Moderator
  • First of thanks for the answers.

    So what I have done was to remove all the disks from the box and hook em up to my Vista computer.
    Running chkdsk /f on all disk did not revile any errors, also used a disk tool to do a surface scan of the SYS disk but no errors where detected.

    So to clear things up:

    1. On HP servers the SnapPeriod is set to 0
    2. This is normal because (@ Colin )  the system decides when to run itself?

    I thought shadow copies was not compatible with WHS file handling?
    Sorry, but this confuses me a bit. What is supposed to be the correct behavior?

    Shadow copies turned off and not in use?
    or
    shadow copies controlled by the system for backing up a specific drive (SYS?)

    I'm just trying to figure out what/ if there is something wrong with my system, and what to do about fixing it.

    @brubber: No I haven't tried server recovery, as I was hoping it more as a last resort. Have installed and done some configuring I was hoping not to have to do again. But knowing that chkdsk also runs on the schedule must defenitly is the source of the SYS volume repair prompting. Next I just have to figure out what is causing the failing chkdsk.
    Hope it is not bad memory as I have struggeled enough with that of lately :(

    Do not know what HP can do with the problem, in the end the only solution would be to exchange the whole system for a new one.


    Thanks

    • Edited by mleru Sunday, September 28, 2008 1:38 PM
    Sunday, September 28, 2008 1:25 PM
  • Colin Hodgson said:

    Hi,

    As just said, the default on a HP Server, (here at least), is that it's set to 0. The system itself then takes care of when it is run.
    Also, as suggested, running Chkdsk on your volume sounds like a good bet, just ensure that you use ' chkdsk /r', so that it actually checks the disk itself, and not just the files on it.

    Colin


    If anyone answers your query successfully, please mark it as 'Helpful', to guide other users.



    Did I miss something something somewhere?  Last I heard, HP MSS never ran Shadow Copies.  That's why that key is set to 0.  Did HP update something recently that they now enabled Shadow Copies?
    Sunday, September 28, 2008 1:52 PM
    Moderator
  • So I think I found the problem to why VSS was giving me the strange error. Mounting Truecrypt disks seem to kick the VSS service in the nuts.

    Dismounting all mye truecrypt volumes gives me access to VSS again, strange indeed.
    • Marked as answer by mleru Sunday, September 28, 2008 4:56 PM
    Sunday, September 28, 2008 4:56 PM
  • Hi,
    Glad you figured it out.

    TrueCrypt is known to have negative consequences with WHS, it's been noted a few times previously.

    Regarding VSS and HP, they have it disabled as normal; I guess becuse of the possible problems.

    Good luck,

    Colin
    If anyone answers your query successfully, please mark it as 'Helpful', to guide other users.
    Sunday, September 28, 2008 5:11 PM
    Moderator
  • I mounted the disks as removable media in TrueCrypt..hopefully this will do the trick.
    See if this helps me find the roote cause...

    Are the ppl out there that use VSS with the HP box without problems?
    Sunday, September 28, 2008 5:55 PM
  • mleru said:

    I mounted the disks as removable media in TrueCrypt..hopefully this will do the trick.
    See if this helps me find the roote cause...

    Are the ppl out there that use VSS with the HP box without problems?


    I can't speak specifically for the HP MSS, but my OEM copy continues to use Shadow Copies and they work fine after applying a semi-automated variation of brubber's workaround after a reboot (which he linked to in his reply above).  I would have to assume they would work on the HP MSS as well, once you alter the registry key.  Of course, it's unsupported so attempt it at your own risk.
    Sunday, September 28, 2008 6:11 PM
    Moderator
  • kariya21 said:

    Did I miss something something somewhere?  Last I heard, HP MSS never ran Shadow Copies.  That's why that key is set to 0.  Did HP update something recently that they now enabled Shadow Copies?



    If you did, I did too :-)

    My HP-EX470 (running the latest updates) has Shadow Copies disabled by default. And as Shadow Copies are 'not supported' for WHS I see no reason to change this.
    No home server like Home Server
    Sunday, September 28, 2008 6:30 PM
    Moderator
  • Theo van Elsberg said:

    kariya21 said:

    Did I miss something something somewhere?  Last I heard, HP MSS never ran Shadow Copies.  That's why that key is set to 0.  Did HP update something recently that they now enabled Shadow Copies?



    If you did, I did too :-)

    My HP-EX470 (running the latest updates) has Shadow Copies disabled by default. And as Shadow Copies are 'not supported' for WHS I see no reason to change this.
    No home server like Home Server



     It is also disabled on my HP box, but the sheduled job for VSS ran anyway at midnight every day. I'll see if the same behavior persists after I got the VSS service to respond normaly again with TrueCrypt enabled.

    Sunday, September 28, 2008 7:05 PM
  • I have an HP with this set to 0, and two OEM's also with this set to 0.
    All three of them have Previous Versions available, so this key is being overridden by the settings availabe in the drive Properties tab.
    (The HP server is a system which has just had a system restore done in the last couple of days, so is 'virgin')

    Colin
    If anyone answers your query successfully, please mark it as 'Helpful', to guide other users.
    Sunday, September 28, 2008 7:16 PM
    Moderator
  • Colin Hodgson said:

    I have an HP with this set to 0, and two OEM's also with this set to 0.
    All three of them have Previous Versions available, so this key is being overridden by the settings availabe in the drive Properties tab.
    (The HP server is a system which has just had a system restore done in the last couple of days, so is 'virgin')

    Colin


    If anyone answers your query successfully, please mark it as 'Helpful', to guide other users.



    I can't speak for HP MSS, but the default Next Run Time for Shadow Copies (the normal Windows Server 2003 interface) on WHS OEM should say Disabled for each drive.  If they do not say Disabled, they have definitely been changed by someone.  MS has not made any changes to that.  If each drive says Disabled and yet the it still runs every 12 hours, then it is coming from the registry key HKLM\Software\Microsoft\Windows Home Server\Storage Manager\Volumes\[random number representing volume D]\SnapPeriod.  The setting for that key by default is 0x02932e00 (43200000), which is 12 hours in milliseconds, which is also the default setting for Shadow Copies on WHS OEM.
    Sunday, September 28, 2008 7:40 PM
    Moderator
  • kariya21 said:

    I can't speak for HP MSS, but the default Next Run Time for Shadow Copies (the normal Windows Server 2003 interface) on WHS OEM should say Disabled for each drive.  If they do not say Disabled, they have definitely been changed by someone.  MS has not made any changes to that.  If each drive says Disabled and yet the it still runs every 12 hours, then it is coming from the registry key HKLM\Software\Microsoft\Windows Home Server\Storage Manager\Volumes\[random number representing volume D]\SnapPeriod.  The setting for that key by default is 0x02932e00 (43200000), which is 12 hours in milliseconds, which is also the default setting for Shadow Copies on WHS OEM.



    I can confirm. This is consistent with what I see on both my HP MSS and Home Build OEM system.

    BTW:
    The HP is as "Out of the Box" (never had a sever restore) but is pretty 'clean'
    On the OEM I disabled Shadow Copies by setting the 'SnapPeriod' registry value to '0' on all Volumes.
    No home server like Home Server
    Sunday, September 28, 2008 7:58 PM
    Moderator
  • So it kinda looks like VSS runs at midnight even if it is disabled in registry and on the shadow copies tab.
    I say this because at midnight i get chkdsk events in the eventviewer and can briefly see 300Mb under the "Used" tab under shadow copies for the c drive.
    This is realy strange.... must be some other service calling VSS for it to run like that?

    From just one disk going unhealty, now all my disks are showing the same status.

    • Edited by mleru Monday, September 29, 2008 10:21 PM
    Monday, September 29, 2008 10:04 PM
  • mleru said:

    So VSS does not run, BUT I see chkdsk running on the time VSS is supposed to run. Anybody else see this... and still get the repair problem :(

    Before running chkdsk manually I did see 300mb under the "Used" tab under shadow copies for the c drive. So it kinda looks like it's kinda running even if it is disabled. Strange....


    Like I already said before:
     
    brubber said:

    "...daily chkdsk will also run on volume snapshot. Failing chkdsk could also be the cause of the SYS errors.



    Setting the WHS volsnap key to 0 only stops WHS from performing daily automatic volume snaphots that can be used to restore previous versions of any file / folder on each of the partitions. It does NOT disable vss functionality. You can still set volume snaphots manually from the volume properties tab in windows explorer, programmatically (the daily WHS chkddsk run) or by issuing the appropriate commands.

    Monday, September 29, 2008 10:40 PM
    Moderator
  •  Ah, so if I'm understanding you correctly WHS runs daily chkdsk and VSS programmatically?
    This is where I was confused, I thought VSS was not in use at all, hence it being disabled.

    I get it that chkdsk is trapping the disk error, but after testing all the disks there where no errors with them. I'm getting the "Correcting errors in the uppercase file." in the chkdsk logs. While before only the SYS disk was showing problems.

    From MS:

    SYMPTOMS

    You run the Chkdsk.exe tool on a Windows XP-based or on a Windows Server 2003-based computer. You use the Chkdsk.exe tool to check a volume that is formatted to use the NTFS file system. However, you receive the following error message:
    Correcting errors in the uppercase file. 

    MORE INFORMATION

    When you use the /f switch together with the Chkdsk.exe tool, the Chkdsk.exe tool updates the file system to reflect the uppercase file that the current operating system uses. You can safely ignore the error message that is mentioned in the "Symptoms" section. The error message does not indicate a problem with the file system.
    • Edited by mleru Monday, September 29, 2008 11:15 PM
    Monday, September 29, 2008 11:06 PM
  • mleru said:

     Ah, so if I'm understanding you correctly WHS runs daily chkdsk and VSS programmatically?
    This is where I was confused, I thought VSS was not in use at all, hence it being disabled.
    I


    WHS chkdsk is actually using the vss snapshot made of the volume. If the vss snapshot can not be made for chkdsk will fail.
    Tuesday, September 30, 2008 1:09 AM
    Moderator