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Where did all of the space go???

Question
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I've installed (clean install) the RTM bits. I'm impressed!
However... I have a question or two.
I'm a bit confused about how WHS manages disk space. Basically, I've got 323 GB of storage.
WHS Reports:
Total Size: 323.87 GB
Free Space: 117.71 GB
Shared Folders: 126 GB
PC Backups: 60 GB
System: 20 GB
Free Space: 118 GB
I was copying up some movies from a desktop to the shared videos folder. None of the shares are configured for duplication.
I recieved notification that I was down to 5gb of space left available by way of the tray icon on the client.
So, I went and poked around on the server....
I notice that there is a
d:\shares folder which contains all of my shares (expected).
There is also a d:\de\shares with all of the subfolders, files, etc.
Is the content duplicated? Where is the "171" GB of Free space?
Thanks,
John
Saturday, September 1, 2007 6:29 AM
Answers
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OK, the way WHS manages disks is the following:
The primary drive that the OS is installed on is partitioned so that the OS sits in a 20Gb partition and the remainder of the space is called DATA on drive D. The size of this D drive will not change by adding more drives and is the reason why it is recommended to have the largest hard drive your primary (to make this D drive as big as possible, more on this below).
If you have just the single hard drive in WHS, then all backups and files that you put on WHS shares are on this DATA partition and you have no possibility of folder duplication (as there is only one drive).
If you have two hard drives, the disk extender software (DE) will move off as much data as it can onto the second hard drive to balance out space and so forth. Now, you should note that the second hard drive (and any subsequent drives- 3rd, 4th, etc) will not appear in my computer- this is by design
The other hard drives are there (see the console) and you can look at their free space (if you desire) under Disk Management in Computer Management (on the server go to Start>Control Panel>Administrative Tools>Computer Management and then click on Disk Management - about halfway down the left hand list). In Disk Management you can see that the 2nd (& 3rd, 4th, etc) hard drives are also called DATA but have no drive letter/label (i.e. are not E, F & G drive under My Computer)
What happens is that as you copy data to the shares, they get stored on the DATA partition that you see in My Computer. DE will then move off files off of the D drive onto the second hard drive (or making duplicates if duplication is switched on for that folder). If you copy files to the WHS shares at a faster rate than what DE will move them off then you will reach the point where the DATA D drive will get down to less than 5Gb which is when you get your warnings.
What you need to do is wait for DE to move files off onto the second hard drive, freeing up space on the primary DATA partition (the one you see in My Computer). Then you can copy more files over which will get temporarily stored on the DATA partition until they are moved off.
It is a similar situation with 3 or more drives but DE will basically try to make the DATA D drive as empty as possible, duplicating among the extra 2 drives where necessary and only containing the reparse pointers (don't worry if you don't know what this means; they point, kind of like shortcuts, to where DE has moved/stored the file on other hard drives).
You should note that the total free space that WHS reports in the console includes the primary data partition. It works it out by totalling all available hard drive capacity, subtracts the 20gb system partition and then any used space (for backups, files and duplicated files).
So, if you understood all of that, that is why WHS reports you have only 5gb remaining when WHS console reports 100+ gb free space; you have overloaded the DE migration and need to wait for the files to be moved off the primary drive.
If it hasn't done so already, the warning will disappear and you'll see the free space of the D drive in My Computer get larger as files are moved off.
So, simple answer, just wait for WHS to do its thing. Think of it that yo can only copy so many Gb's to the server at any one time.
Hope you're still with me after all that,
Davo
Saturday, September 1, 2007 8:00 AM
All replies
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OK, the way WHS manages disks is the following:
The primary drive that the OS is installed on is partitioned so that the OS sits in a 20Gb partition and the remainder of the space is called DATA on drive D. The size of this D drive will not change by adding more drives and is the reason why it is recommended to have the largest hard drive your primary (to make this D drive as big as possible, more on this below).
If you have just the single hard drive in WHS, then all backups and files that you put on WHS shares are on this DATA partition and you have no possibility of folder duplication (as there is only one drive).
If you have two hard drives, the disk extender software (DE) will move off as much data as it can onto the second hard drive to balance out space and so forth. Now, you should note that the second hard drive (and any subsequent drives- 3rd, 4th, etc) will not appear in my computer- this is by design
The other hard drives are there (see the console) and you can look at their free space (if you desire) under Disk Management in Computer Management (on the server go to Start>Control Panel>Administrative Tools>Computer Management and then click on Disk Management - about halfway down the left hand list). In Disk Management you can see that the 2nd (& 3rd, 4th, etc) hard drives are also called DATA but have no drive letter/label (i.e. are not E, F & G drive under My Computer)
What happens is that as you copy data to the shares, they get stored on the DATA partition that you see in My Computer. DE will then move off files off of the D drive onto the second hard drive (or making duplicates if duplication is switched on for that folder). If you copy files to the WHS shares at a faster rate than what DE will move them off then you will reach the point where the DATA D drive will get down to less than 5Gb which is when you get your warnings.
What you need to do is wait for DE to move files off onto the second hard drive, freeing up space on the primary DATA partition (the one you see in My Computer). Then you can copy more files over which will get temporarily stored on the DATA partition until they are moved off.
It is a similar situation with 3 or more drives but DE will basically try to make the DATA D drive as empty as possible, duplicating among the extra 2 drives where necessary and only containing the reparse pointers (don't worry if you don't know what this means; they point, kind of like shortcuts, to where DE has moved/stored the file on other hard drives).
You should note that the total free space that WHS reports in the console includes the primary data partition. It works it out by totalling all available hard drive capacity, subtracts the 20gb system partition and then any used space (for backups, files and duplicated files).
So, if you understood all of that, that is why WHS reports you have only 5gb remaining when WHS console reports 100+ gb free space; you have overloaded the DE migration and need to wait for the files to be moved off the primary drive.
If it hasn't done so already, the warning will disappear and you'll see the free space of the D drive in My Computer get larger as files are moved off.
So, simple answer, just wait for WHS to do its thing. Think of it that yo can only copy so many Gb's to the server at any one time.
Hope you're still with me after all that,
Davo
Saturday, September 1, 2007 8:00 AM -
.... and as a cautionary note, be careful in Disk Management because (a bit like poking in the Registry) it's possible to break WHS.
Your backups are stored on D: and this can reduce your available "landing zone" space.
This problem of understanding where the space exists is one of the reasons that the console is intended to be the user interface, but it should be more informative about the "working" free space has gone - "Balancing drives" doesn't mean much to the average user.
As Davo says, this is the reason for having your biggest disk as your primary, and why most OEM versions have decent sized ones.Saturday, September 1, 2007 10:22 AM -
That makes perfect sense. Over the course of the evening, I'd used robocopy to re-populate the shares. That, along with the nightly backups definatley overran the DE.
Thanks for the detailed answer.
John
Saturday, September 1, 2007 5:25 PM -
No problem John. I thought it might have been a bit too detailed for what you were after; I have a tendancy to prattle on a bit.
Davo.
Sunday, September 2, 2007 10:57 AM -
The size of this D drive will not change by adding more drives and is the reason why it is recommended to have the largest hard drive your primary
This thread covers a few of my questions, but I'm a little puzzled in my situation. I want an 80GB drive for the operating system ONLY, and a 320GB for storage. Now if I want the 80GB for the OS, I'm going to assume the OS drive is the "primary". The whole idea behind having a dedicated drive for the OS was so that I could have the 320GB for nothing BUT storage. If I make the 320GB the primary, the 80GB will just be used as additional space?
The problem is when I want to map a drive from the WHS to my desktop, it will only show me 50GB or so free (I want 320GB to be free, excluding the 80GB as a whole). This is the same case with "My Computer" on the WHS itself. While the console will show that whole 320GB being used, Windows itself will only show 50GB of free space.
when WHS console reports 100+ gb free space; you have overloaded the DE migration and need to wait for the files to be moved off the primary drive.
Now if I read this thread correctly, this 50GB will start moving files to the 320GB for data balancing once it reaches low free space?
What I want is the ability to use every byte on my 320GB without impacting the 80GB. It seems that the bigger the size difference between 2 drives, the less beneficial DE is. Is WHS the worst solution for a setup like this?Monday, November 26, 2007 8:10 PM -
When you use WHS, you don't have that control. It will use a 20MB partition on the primary drive for the OS, and give the rest over to backups and migration of data to other drives (if installed). 80GB is the minimum spec for the primary drive, not the optimum. If you use your 320GB drive, you'll have a 300GB-ish D: drive, and the 80GB drive will be added to that as additional storage.
The reason for having the biggest drive as system is so that the D: drive (the second partition on the primary drive) has space for backups and for incoming files that will be migrated to other drives. This also provides breathing room if you need or want to replace your secondary drive(s). Or just add another one when/if you run low.
If you have duplication of shares on, WHS will duplicate the data on both drives. If not, it will put the shares on the secondary drives and when data arrives migrate it from the secondary partition on the primary drive. If there isn't much room on the drive, or you're transferring a lot of data, it'll have to pause periodically to manage it (balancing).
If you are mapping a drive to a share, it can't show you the amount of available space - your local machine (or Explorer on the server via RDP) doesn't understand how WHS works and cannot report an accurate figure. Do not map to a drive-level share. The WHS console shows you how much space is free in the pool, and this is how it is intended to be used.
Monday, November 26, 2007 9:29 PM -
Crash2975 wrote: If you are mapping a drive to a share, it can't show you the amount of available space - your local machine (or Explorer on the server via RDP) doesn't understand how WHS works and cannot report an accurate figure. Do not map to a drive-level share. The WHS console shows you how much space is free in the pool, and this is how it is intended to be used.
So you seem to know what I'm looking for.
Ok here's the thing, the mapped drive only showing me 50GB free is fine, AS LONG as I will still be able to continue uploading once the drive starts getting full.
My #1 worry is Windows telling me that the drive is full when it's really not, and I cannot upload anymore. Tell me that 50GB free is only an inaccurate number that doesn't really represent the total free space I have to work with.
If this is the case, the WHS was only designed for system backups and NOTHING else. Someone please shine some light on me.Tuesday, November 27, 2007 1:53 AM -
An0n wrote: So you seem to know what I'm looking for.
Ok here's the thing, the mapped drive only showing me 50GB free is fine, AS LONG as I will still be able to continue uploading once the drive starts getting full.No, you won't (at least not right away). It needs a little time to change all of the files on the primary partition into tombstones before you'll be able to add more files. Not to mention if you're copying from Vista, it won't even let you start copying.
An0n wrote: My #1 worry is Windows telling me that the drive is full when it's really not, and I cannot upload anymore. Tell me that 50GB free is only an inaccurate number that doesn't really represent the total free space I have to work with.
If this is the case, the WHS was only designed for system backups and NOTHING else. Someone please shine some light on me.No, it's designed for the average user to be simple (very little user interaction).
Tuesday, November 27, 2007 4:53 AMModerator -
So I still don't quite understand.
1. I have 2 HDs: both 500 GB
" MY Computer" My 20 GB system drive is almost full and has been showing that way for a while (less than 1 GB free). The D data drive in "my computer" shows 351 GB free.
2. In "Disk Management" in the WHS console, Disk 0 is 35% full, Disk 1 is 89% full
3. "Server Storage" in the console shows 351 GB free out of 931 total.
Questions:
A) Is there a way for me to improve the amount of space free on the 20GB system drive?
B) How is Disk 1 89% full in disk management, when total system and "Server Storage" has 351 GB free out of a total of 931 GB? Shouldn't both drives have similar amounts of free space?Wednesday, September 23, 2009 1:09 PM -
A) The usual: delete temporary files and unnecessary logs. Windows Home Server logs quite a bit of information here: C:\Documents and Settings\All Users\Application Data\Microsoft\Windows Home Server\logs\B) Windows Home Server doesn't "load balance" across disks. It tries to keep data off the system drive (disk 0 in your case) if it can, which is why there's more data on disk 1. Probably the difference in disk usage is due to your backup database, which likely resides on disk 1. The space used on disk 0 is the system partition (C:) and duplicated shares. The duplication wedge on the server storage tab in the console probably shows around 140 GB?
I'm not on the WHS team, I just post a lot. :)- Proposed as answer by firedog55 Wednesday, September 23, 2009 8:39 PM
Wednesday, September 23, 2009 4:44 PMModerator